[Trade] Eichel + 3rd to Vegas for Tuch, Krebs, 1st, 3rd

[CSharp]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Monny hasn't got a 5v5 point in his last 15 games.

Didn't Conroid say that you don't get many scoring chances down in the 3rd and 4th lines when he was asked why his production went down? LOL, I think the players can try to score but when you're on the checking lines, you're focused on grinding things out and your opportunities to score kind of diminishes. I'm sure Monahan will get back into the second line later in the season - if not, he'll be traded. No way Sutter's gonna leave Monny there as an overpaid 4th line center.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by dino7c

To put them over 100M in cap?

I was mostly being facetious, but people keep saying they can't do anything because they are capped out yet they keep adding elite players anyways and finding a way.

They've gutted their prospect base, and become very top heavy while losing a lot of depth. But they still have a lot of elite players on their roster, especially if Eichel returns to form.

All we can do is hope they turn into the Sharks V2.0 ASAP

I'm pissed off that the Flames missed out again. If they keep winning and playing great though, that's all that matters.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I was mostly being facetious, but people keep saying they can't do anything because they are capped out yet they keep adding elite players anyways and finding a way.

They've gutted their prospect base, and become very top heavy while losing a lot of depth. But they still have a lot of elite players on their roster, especially if Eichel returns to form.

All we can do is hope they turn into the Sharks V2.0 ASAP

I'm pissed off that the Flames missed out again. If they keep winning and playing great though, that's all that matters.

Well they can't ice the roster people are so worried about so lets see how it all shakes down

They keep adding stars and losing picks but have not improved from their first season

[sureLoss]

LeBrun
https://theathletic.com/2935714/2021...rade-to-vegas/

The final three suitors, according to sources, were Vegas, Calgary and Carolina. The Hurricanes (of course the Hurricanes!) were probably hanging in there just to make sure the price didn’t drop enough that they’d lose out on Eichel at a cheaper price. Makes sense. But the asking price stayed at a level for Carolina where the Canes couldn’t or wouldn’t get up there with the Golden Knights or Flames.

The Anaheim Ducks had stayed in touch with the Sabres dating back to last summer but fell out of it, I’m told, because they weren’t ready to risk dealing for him pre-surgery. Had Eichel got the surgery in Buffalo and fully recovered, I think the Ducks would have re-engaged.

There was a moment as late as Wednesday where the Golden Knights thought Eichel might be headed to Calgary. Whether the Sabres leaked something out there regarding the Flames or not in order to get one last piece in the Golden Knights deal, well, I guess we’ll never know for sure.

Matthew Tkachuk was never part of any Flames package, and that’s a fact. But the Flames went hard after Eichel, sources confirm, and may have felt their offer to Buffalo was not only was fair but perhaps better than Vegas. That’s all in the eye of the beholder, of course.

The takeaway is Calgary remained in the Eichel sweepstakes right to the end, as well it should, given the chance to get a franchise center at a certain discount.

[jonesy]

I don't believe Treleving would have known any details on what las Vegas was offering. Buffalo or Vegas certainly would not have told him. It was a blind auction. So to just rail that " He should have matched!!!!" " Let's go Bradley!!" Didn't make sense.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

LeBrun
https://theathletic.com/2935714/2021...rade-to-vegas/

and may have felt their offer to Buffalo was not only was fair but perhaps better than Vegas. That’s all in the eye of the beholder, of course.

Yeah, at this stage we know Treliving's view of his own players is just wrong.

"We can't trade players for 50 cents on the dollar!"

*Monahan gets parked on 4th line because he's bad*

"We can't trade players for 10 cents on the dollar!"

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

LeBrun
https://theathletic.com/2935714/2021...rade-to-vegas/

So Monahan, Valimaki, and some prospects probably. If the Flames didn't have Zadorov they could have made it fit with just Monahan's salary.

I really want to know what the Flame's final offer was.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by neo45

For what it’s worth Weekes and Adams played together for three years

Going to guess that was Weekes doing his friend a favor to get Vegas to budge

I hope Adams takes Weekes out for a real nice dinner. Because Weekes lost some credibility around the league with that stunt. Here’s what an NHL exec had to say about it:

I also have to wonder how quickly this deal got done (became a reality) based on the pressures of Vegas being the only team/option after the potential Calgary deal ‘leak’ yesterday…not good.

https://theathletic.com/2935714/2021...rade-to-vegas/

There’s a reason Friedman is discrete (or call it vague) in his role as an insider; he knows he can’t burn his sources or be seen as a patsy for a GM.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Yeah, at this stage we know Treliving's view of his own players is just wrong.

"We can't trade players for 50 cents on the dollar!"

*Monahan gets parked on 4th line because he's bad*

"We can't trade players for 10 cents on the dollar!"

Without knowing the offer it's impossible to say though.

Let's say it's what we've rumored and it's:

Monahan, Zary, 2022 1st, Valimaki

vs

Tuch, Krebs, 2022 1st, 2022 3rd

I'd argue that is a better trade package from the Flames than what Buffalo got from Vegas because IMO Krebs = Zary.

But if Buffalo think Krebs >> Zary then that's their call.

[Jake]

I don’t blame Treliving for missing out on this trade if we consider the event individually. The cap just didn’t work for us, and the Sabres probably didn’t want Monahan and Zadarov just to make a deal happen.

But you can’t consider this event individually. Using cap space on guys like Zadarov, Neil, even guys like Pitlick, Stone, Gudbranson etc may have cost him the ability to finally acquire a true #1 C, albeit one with some risk attached.

Hindsight is 20/20 though. Gudbranson is playing well and Treliving doesn’t get enough credit for his good moves. Flames are 6-1 right now and playing consistent, thorough hockey. Ultimately we need to see how things play out to judge this one. Eichel’s has injury problems and another C may come along.

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Yeah, at this stage we know Treliving's view of his own players is just wrong.

"We can't trade players for 50 cents on the dollar!"

*Monahan gets parked on 4th line because he's bad*

"We can't trade players for 10 cents on the dollar!"

When you look at his eye for coaches, it probably shouldn't come as a surprise that his ability to accurately assess talent is a bit, shall we say, compromised.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by blender

Glad you are all good, buddy.

I'm fine, I appreciate you asking. I got about three hours sleep last night, so I'm a little short-fused.

[jroc]

Can we get a poll? I'd be very curious about the results. Suggested responses:

How do you feel now that the Eichel drama has come to a close?:

- Pissed! The Flames are forever stuck in mediocrity and needed to make a big splash for a true #1 Center
- Dodged a bullet! Too much to risk for a player coming off a major neck surgery.
- On the fence.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Yeah, scoring on the PP is important.

You know what's more important? Outscoring the opposition while you're on the ice during even strength play. Sean Monahan doesn't do that.

The NO GOODS would argue with that statement.

[Jay Random]

Some thoughts after shovelling my way through the whole thread:

Originally Posted by JurassicTunga12

Feels like we’re destined never to have an elite first line center again.

What do you mean, ‘again’? The Flames have never had an elite first-line centre. The closest they ever had was Kent Nilsson, and he only played that way for one year. Even in '89, the elite centres in the league were Gretzky, Lemieux, Yzerman, Messier, with a case to be made for Nicholls, Savard, and Hawerchuk. What they did have was two legitimate (but not top-tier) #1s in Gilmour and Nieuwendyk.

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

That or "The total salary cap hit of your signed roster for the playoffs needs to be cap compliant"

That way if the injured player is truly hurt then he can come back, but you'd need to make a decision about who drops off the roster.

I like this idea very much.

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

The Spurs lost deliberately for Duncan.

One superstar can make or break a basketball team. Hockey is nothing like that. You ought to know better than to make such a silly comparison.

Originally Posted by Sainters7

You can tell within that industry it's super important in a chest thumping way to be the one to break news...which is extremely dangerous, because it leads to misinformation in their race to break things first. I wonder if any in the industry realize we as the general public DO NOT CARE who breaks the freakin story first, just get it right!!

Bang on, and it's thoroughly stupid, like a lot of things in that business. As Michael Lewis wrote in Moneyball:

Most reporters, in Billy [Beane]'s experience, are simply trying to be the first to find out something they'll all learn anyway before their deadlines. “They all want scoops,” he complains. “There are no scoops. Whatever we do will be in every paper tomorrow. There's no such thing as a paper that comes out in an hour.”

Tweets, of course, come out instantly – but only if you rush madly to the keyboard and don't do any form of fact-checking or verification. If your principal goal is to get eyeballs on Twitter, that's not journalism, it's gossip. Twitter does very little good in the world, and so-called journalists who become obsessed with Twitter do even less.

[guzzy]

Originally Posted by Jake

I don’t blame Treliving for missing out on this trade if we consider the event individually. The cap just didn’t work for us, and the Sabres probably didn’t want Monahan and Zadarov just to make a deal happen.

But you can’t consider this event individually. Using cap space on guys like Zadarov, Neil, even guys like Pitlick, Stone, Gudbranson etc may have cost him the ability to finally acquire a true #1 C, albeit one with some risk attached.

Hindsight is 20/20 though. Gudbranson is playing well and Treliving doesn’t get enough credit for his good moves. Flames are 6-1 right now and playing consistent, thorough hockey. Ultimately we need to see how things play out to judge this one. Eichel’s has injury problems and another C may come along.

I disagree completely. Eichel would have came over on LTIR. So there wouldn't have been a cap issue. When he was ready to play, Treliving would have made a trade to make the space. If he wasn't ready by deadline, Treliving would have made a deal at deadline if Eichel was ready for playoffs.

[Roof-Daddy]

Glad they're throwing cold water on the Tkachuk inclusion rumors.

Don't need him thinking the Flames just about banished him to Buffalo.

Winning cures all, just keep winning Flames.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by guzzy

I disagree completely. Eichel would have came over on LTIR. So there wouldn't have been a cap issue.

It has been made clear multiple times that LTIR does not transfer between teams. The Flames would have had to clear cap space for Eichel, and then put him on LTIR. Whereas Vegas could clear the space temporarily just by moving Stone from regular IR to LTIR.

Besides, Eichel was never on LTIR in Buffalo to begin with. They didn't need the extra cap room.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I have to say, how little the return is for Eichel is the only thing that surprised me about this trade.

If this is what it took, I don't understand why a trade didn't happen in July.

Again, I would suggest that once the medicals were provided to those interested, the price plummeted.

This is about as serious a surgery as an athlete that wants to come back and play again, can get. It is literally a rebuild to part of the spine. He may be as good as he was, he may be unable to ever play again, and most likely somewhere between those two extremes.

This was a huge huge risk and why Buffalo's medical personnel (and i would think other teams as well) wouldnt budge on the fusion surgery instead. It has been done successfully before.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

I don’t know why some people are worried about Vegas being good and getting better. It’s Edmonton that’s gonna win the next 5 cups with mcdavid. Eichel will just be playoff fodder like everyone else.