The Tariff Thread

[Acey]

Originally Posted by WideReceiver

I’m not so sure. Vance takes over and he could be more dangerous, plus the rot runs deep.

Also the non-zero risk of a MAGA thinking his death is the result of a Canadian conspiracy and them coming here for some January 6 levels of unhinged behaviour.

[Drak]

Originally Posted by butterfly

What would you propose?

I do see your point. Trump is hurting the American People here making them pay more. Retaliation hurts us, will escalate his action against us. It’s a hard spot.

[EldrickOnIce]

Originally Posted by Acey

My family is the opposite of yours, most are American and a lot moved from TX to a blue area in a northern state after zero response to the Uvalde shooting. They are disgusted by the actions of Trump.

There are some good Americans out there still, as increasingly difficult as that is to believe.

First time in US history that disapproval rating for a incoming president at inauguration was higher than their approval rating just happened. So yeah, there are a lot of angry/upset Americans.

[BigThief]

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/busi...20the%20world.

Tariffs, which the U.S. president has constantly said he would introduce, are a threat to Canada’s national economic security. If Donald Trump follows through, Canada must respond with all economic weapons at its disposal, a key armament of which is intellectual property such as patents. This country has the right, under both Canadian and international law, to effectively suspend patent rights held by U.S.-controlled companies in key sectors, such as pharmaceuticals and artificial intelligence. Doing so would put tremendous pressure on the Trump administration.

Under the World Trade Organization and section 19 of Canada’s Patent Act, Canada can circumvent U.S.-controlled patents, freeing up Canadian companies to make patented drugs as well as develop AI-based inventions and other key technologies to sell predominantly in Canada but also around the world. Given the national emergency that Trump’s Tariffs would create, Canada could immediately seek permission to accord these rights from the Commissioner of Patents, a public servant in charge of the Canadian patent office.

This is from Trump's first presidency
https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/secon...erty-1.4708630

The U.S. holds more pharmaceutical patents and other intellectual property licences than any other country. But that strength could become a vulnerability if Canada took action to suspend American patents on Canadian soil. Canadian companies would then be able to produce those drugs.

"You hit us on tariffs, we hit you on patents," he said.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by LanceUppercut

I'm tangentially working in oil and gas, and I would go nuclear and cut off all the taps to the US as soon as the tariffs hit. Trump said the US doesn't need anything from us, lets see how that goes.

You can't Trump then orders line 5 shut down and Eastern Canada is effectively energy starved.



And that's the this #### could get so much worse scenario. We not only left ourselves incredibly economically dependant to the US. But our main transportation of oil and Gas stupidly goes through the US. We would have to start shipping massively by train, which would screw our food shipments from west to east.

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by Slava

100% retaliation. This is annexation under the guise of border security, purely because he thinks that makes it legitimate under the USMCA. We’ve heard over and over that you don’t need our oil, lumber and other goods (no idea how you have a trade deficit in that case?), so we should fight fire with fire.

This is absolutely hostile and Canada cannot just sit back and appease the US.

Okay, let’s assume each party continues to escalate until all trade is completely cost prohibitive or outright closed. Does that leave anybody better off?

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by Drak

I do see your point. Trump is hurting the American People here making them pay more. Retaliation hurts us, will escalate his action against us. It’s a hard spot.

Yeah, he started it, it’s absolutely needless and here we are. I’m of the mind that it’s better to put out the fire and have a roof over your head than to throw gasoline on it and let it burn down.

It’s 3 years 11 months and some days. Weather the storm and fix the infrastructure problem for next time.

[AltaGuy]

Originally Posted by butterfly

Okay, let’s assume each party continues to escalate until all trade is completely cost prohibitive or outright closed. Does that leave anybody better off?

You seem to be under the impression that without any action by Canada, these tariffs will be the end of the bullying. This is incredibly naive and misguided: inaction is an invitation to Trump to ratchet up his insane demands. He's already suggested we should be giving the US a "deal" on our export price of oil as a next concession. The insanity would simply never end.

Gotta fight back.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by butterfly

Sure, happy to oblige. I think the Canadian government has a duty to do the best thing for Canadian citizens, which is to not harm them. If I were them I would do nothing.

Trump doing this to our three biggest trade partners simply hurts American consumers. Why would you want to raise prices for your own consumers? It's senseless and leads to an inefficient allocation of resources. Chinese, Mexicans, and Canadians can bring unique goods and services to market at a better price than Americans can, and they're all things that we desire. Trump is lying when he claims "we don't need them", because if we could get these things for cheaper we would already be doing it.

So if they're happy to trade with us, why not do it? It really should have nothing to do with the government as it's obvious interference between parties willing to trade.

If I were Canada I certainly would not want to increase prices on my own consumers in an attempt to demonstrate some false sense of strength.

Doing nothing does harm Canadian consumers. The natural reaction of Canadian companies would be to just move their operations to the USA then. You can sell into Canada with no penalty and you can avoid the US tariffs. Win-win. You times that by say 100 companies and real Canadians will lose their jobs. That is multiple times worse than a slightly more expensive orange, especially when there are substitutes for most goods.

[Manhattanboy]

If currency is like a stock Canada will be ripe for a takeover very shortly.

That’s Trump’s endgame so he’s doing this to tank the $Cdn.

[BigThief]

Originally Posted by butterfly

Okay, let’s assume each party continues to escalate until all trade is completely cost prohibitive or outright closed. Does that leave anybody better off?

You're acting like the American Tariffs won't affect Canadians. We're dealing with a hostile trading partner. We could just roll over? Let Donald Trump slowly roll over the Canadian economy? Do you think he ends with these tariffs? That 25% is the opening and finishing movie?

Donald Trump has openly claimed he will use "economic force" to compel Canada to become the 51st state in the union. This is a war, a trade war.

Stop being naive and weak.

[powderjunkie]

I think we should just invade them. It's the last thing they'll expect.

[BigThief]

Originally Posted by butterfly

Yeah, he started it, it’s absolutely needless and here we are. I’m of the mind that it’s better to put out the fire and have a roof over your head than to throw gasoline on it and let it burn down.

In your fire analogy you're sitting back and letting the fire grow, hoping it puts out itself.

[BigThief]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

I think we should just invade them. It's the last thing they'll expect.

Spoiler!

Some rube is going to reply mentioning 1812 and the burning of the white house. It will probably be Locke

[CaptainCrunch]

I expect that on Monday the Loonie and the TSX are going to absolutely melt down. Good pricing due to that is going to be an absolute nightmare, especially for food that we import from the States and elsewhere that are priced with the US dollar.


And yeah, if this goes longer then a few months, investment is going to really dry up.



We can all sit there and say, ok, survive the first blow and lets go to war, fine and I agree you have to establish that you're in the fight, but I'm worried about that second level of retaliation that Trump is hinting at.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

I think we should just invade them. It's the last thing they'll expect.

I know you're joking, but when half of our vehicles, ships and aircraft would even start when the key is turned.


You want to really have an effect, pool every dollar in Canada and initiate a hostile take over of the top 5 benchmark stock companies in the States, that's not a bank. Buy them and move them to Canada.


And I'm joking on that. But if you want to go to economic war, then be creative.

[Manhattanboy]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I expect that on Monday the Loonie and the TSX are going to absolutely melt down. Good pricing due to that is going to be an absolute nightmare, especially for food that we import from the States and elsewhere that are priced with the US dollar.


And yeah, if this goes longer then a few months, investment is going to really dry up.



We can all sit there and say, ok, survive the first blow and lets go to war, fine and I agree you have to establish that you're in the fight, but I'm worried about that second level of retaliation that Trump is hinting at.

Possibly the TSX but the C$ trades all the time. It’s down a bit now but not as much as you might expect.

edit: sorry I might be wrong on that. The rate I looked at was today but very early this morning. Not sure what the current rate is.

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by calgarygeologist

This was actually a very reasonable 6 pages worth of discussions until you pulled in with your ####ing nonsense and useless garbage as the biggest POS contributor on CP.

Why because you are upset as a rightwing lemming that your useless lappydog PP is going down? lol

Why so mad? Was it freezing down at the freedumb protest next to petrocan?

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by BigThief

In your fire analogy you're sitting back and letting the fire grow, hoping it puts out itself.

Admittedly not a great analogy, but sitting back is better in my view than throwing gasoline on it and lighting the neighbor's house on fire.

[RogerWilco]

Originally Posted by butterfly

Admittedly not a great analogy, but sitting back is better in my view than throwing gasoline on it and lighting the neighbor's house on fire.

No, we absolutely want to light our neighbor's house on fire, literally, that is the point.