[PGT] Weird night in Ottawa. Flames lose 5-4 in SO

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by dammage79

1. Hiller can't hold the dam from bursting. Blame him if you want but the D pairing of Wideman/Russell are responsible for 3 of those goals.

All of them are responsible. Hiller's style keeps the puck in play in dangerous areas where most NHL goaltenders would have frozen the puck and the team would have swapped in Gio/Brodie and all would have been merry. Nothing he could have done on the first goal (well, other than make a great save) against but on the next two there's plenty of blame to go around.

4. Some players need a wake up call: Backlund, Jooris, Bollig, Jones.

I'm not saying all of those guys weren't goats tonight, because they were, but people are selling Backlund a bit short for the body of work in the whole game. Guy had a 33% offensive zone start and finished with 71.43% possession at even strength. Can't get too fixated on one or two plays.

7. TJ Brodie mixes the cocktails for the Flames. Its night and day the difference the team is with him and without him. Hate that he isnt 100% and playing though.

Yes.

[Racki]

It is just killing us that we can't get a save. I know that our coverage down low was pretty bad on the last couple goals and Hiller would have had to make a couple of great saves to prevent those goals - but guess what? It's part of his job to make a few really hard saves once in a while. If Hiller got paid like the majority of us his pay cheque would be $173,076 every two weeks. That is an extraordinary amount of money. I would expect that person to be able to do extraordinary things every now and then.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

All of them are responsible. Hiller's style keeps the puck in play in dangerous areas where most NHL goaltenders would have frozen the puck and the team would have swapped in Gio/Brodie and all would have been merry. Nothing he could have done on the first goal (well, other than make a great save) against but on the next two there's plenty of blame to go around.



I'm not saying all of those guys weren't goats tonight, because they were, but people are selling Backlund a bit short for the body of work in the whole game. Guy had a 33% offensive zone start and finished with 71.43% possession at even strength. Can't get too fixated on one or two plays.



Yes.

You won't get an argument out of me on Hiller rebound control. Only Ramo's is much...much worse. Just cannot expect Hiller to Stop goal #1 and goal #3. Straight up, those two goals were not on him.

As far as Backlund goes, I truly believe we have a better Backlud on the farm in Bill Arnold. From the fancy stats all the way up to points production.

If I was the GM and wanting to make a knee jerk trade, I trade Backlund first, for whatever, then Call up Arnold and I swear you not even miss Backs for one second. This is coming from a stout Backlund defender over the years. It's just time to move to the younger better guys.

[Samonadreau]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

All of them are responsible. Hiller's style keeps the puck in play in dangerous areas where most NHL goaltenders would have frozen the puck and the team would have swapped in Gio/Brodie and all would have been merry. Nothing he could have done on the first goal (well, other than make a great save) against but on the next two there's plenty of blame to go around.



I'm not saying all of those guys weren't goats tonight, because they were, but people are selling Backlund a bit short for the body of work in the whole game. Guy had a 33% offensive zone start and finished with 71.43% possession at even strength. Can't get too fixated on one or two plays.



Yes.

Backlund is well known for his Posession prowess but he was still -1 tonight and you dont start him him in the o zone because he lacks the offensive instincts and finish to do so. So many plays fall dead as he just throws the puck at the net (the goalies chest)

[Fire of the Phoenix]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

I think his point is maybe the start of the season is this year's "8 game losing streak" and at the end of the year you say "other than the start, the Flames played 700 hockey".

I get the point, I just think that it's insanely optimistic given what we've seen thus far.

Honestly though, I'm happy we have some optimists around to keep things more level around here. I wish I could see things that way.

[Samonadreau]

Originally Posted by iggysback05

It is just killing us that we can't get a save. I know that our coverage down low was pretty bad on the last couple goals and Hiller would have had to make a couple of great saves to prevent those goals - but guess what? It's part of his job to make a few really hard saves once in a while. If Hiller got paid like the majority of us his pay cheque would be $173,076 every two weeks. That is an extraordinary amount of money. I would expect that person to be able to do extraordinary things every now and then.

Agreed. Many of the previous losses couldnt be pinned entirely on subpar goaltending but entirely could be.

[PepsiFree]

Zone start and possession stats are great but basically meaningless when you're watching a player and he just looks generally bad, like Backlund.

I'd be fine seeing him go. Along with Hiller/Ramo and Russell/Wideman. Every part of the lineup needs to get rattled.

Colborne was awesome I thought, so was Bennett. Lot of bright spots in this game and much better all-around.

[dammage79]

Yeah, Forgot to add Colborne is a breath of fresh air on the Monny line. He keeps that kin of work up along the boards, great success awaits that line.

I am concerned a bit with Hudler. He's displaying some outright next level frustration on the ice, cannot imagine how that's going behind the scenes. I get being frustrated, but that icing in that 1st period was a temper tantrum event.

[polak]

I like these new top 2 lines. Tough loss though

[Go_Flames4ever]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Zone start and possession stats are great but basically meaningless when you're watching a player and he just looks generally bad, like Backlund.

I'd be fine seeing him go. Along with Hiller/Ramo and Russell/Wideman. Every part of the lineup needs to get rattled.

Colborne was awesome I thought, so was Bennett. Lot of bright spots in this game and much better all-around.

To add to this, "possession" is pretty irrelevant when you're throwing pucks "towards" the net and it translates to ZERO offense.

4 shots towards the opponent's net that did nothing, and the 1 shot towards your own net ends up in it...I know the only thing that mattered is we're down 1-0 on the scoreboard. But wait we should win because we have better possession stats!

[The Voice of Reason]

Originally Posted by Go_Flames4ever

To add to this, "possession" is pretty irrelevant when you're throwing pucks "towards" the net and it translates to ZERO offense.

4 shots towards the opponent's net that did nothing, and the 1 shot towards your own net ends up in it...I know the only thing that mattered is we're down 1-0 on the scoreboard. But wait we should win because we have better possession stats!

Generally speaking teams that have the puck more often than their opponents often take more shot attempts than their opponents and win more games than their opponents.

You can win a few games when you get outshot. You probably won't win many championships if you're more often than not getting outshot.

[Samonadreau]

Originally Posted by The Voice of Reason

Generally speaking teams that have the puck more often than their opponents often take more shot attempts than their opponents and win more games than their opponents.

You can win a few games when you get outshot. You probably won't win many championships if you're more often than not getting outshot.

Captain obvious award

[868904]

I like having guys like Bollig and Engelland in the line up bit if Bollig isn't going to do his job and worse take stupid penalties then he needs to sit.

There is no excuse for the dumb penalty he took. If a wimp like Karlsson roughs him up, he should just take it and laugh, not punch him in the back of the head.

His penalty would have been better served as an instigator in a fight against Cowen who was roughing Gaudreau up all night.

Smarten up Bollig and do your job!

[crapshoot]

I wish everyone would stop defending Hiller. If you face 18 shots you can't let four of them in if you are a goaltender in the NHL. He's crap and he's playing his last year in the league if he intends on letting four or more past him just about every game. I blame it on goaltending right now. We should have had this game. The team played a very good road game with only a few defensive lapses where the goalie should have stepped up and saved them on at least a pair. With a good goalie it would have ended on a different note. It's time to throw Ortio into the deep end, let him string a couple of games together and see where he's at.

[868904]

Am I reading it wrong or did Hamilton really have 7 shots on net and Engelland had 5 shots?

[hockey.modern]

(Colborne-Monahan-Hudler) - The line was drivin by Colborne who has played exceptionally well along the boards and keeping they play on his stick. Monahan needs to find a way to not lose the puck. He hasn't stood out the way he has in the past and I hope he find his game soon. That said he is still one of the better forwards on the team. Hudler has been inconsistent and has shown some flashes at time. The flames would be better off without him at this point when the times come at the end of the season. He still has the play making ability but I think the flames should target someone in the league or farm that can play similar in a larger frame. That line will be very good at cycling the puck and tiring out the players on other teams with the big bodies and offensive upside. This line should remain for now however.

(Gaudreau-Bennett-Frolik) - There isn't much to say about this line. amazing. The relentless forechecking and turnovers that this line caused created lots of potential tonight. Three very speedy players who have very good upside and could do some insane damage. If this keeps up, I wouldn't be surprised as this to be our best line this season. Gaudreau was bursting out there and the chemistry is definitely showing between him and Bennett. I love the play that Bennett has. If only he could have a larger frame. But hey he is only 19. The way this kid plays with and edge creates a perfect piece for both Frolik and Gaudreau. Bennett using the body to hit the players after the Gaudreau incident was very nice to see him stick up for his teammate. Frolik is the quiet guy in this line but can do everything right. He's coming along great this season with the flames despite the points.

(Gio-Brodie) - the flames sure needed Brodie. His skating ability and ease to clear the zone was something the flames were lacking and thankfully he gives those things to us. Gio was fumbly a bit on the puck but I thought he had a pretty solid line.

(Dougie) - he's starting to know the Flames system out there and I can see his confidence building up. He will be a stud for us one day.

(Ortio) -played solid in his short time and I really think he will be the number one by the end of November. I hope Hartley gives him the chance should Hillers injury be long term.

[Samonadreau]

Originally Posted by 868904

Am I reading it wrong or did Hamilton really have 7 shots on net and Engelland had 5 shots?

Backlund eat your heart out. Hows that for possession.

In all seriousness the duo was actually pretty good tonight. Probably Dougie's best game yet as a flame.

[Samonadreau]

Gio-Brodie
Nakladal-Wideman
Engelland-Hamilton
Smid

Russel nets a top six winger.
Hamilton is sheltered this year and ready for top 4 minutes/assignments next year.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

All of them are responsible. Hiller's style keeps the puck in play in dangerous areas where most NHL goaltenders would have frozen the puck and the team would have swapped in Gio/Brodie and all would have been merry. Nothing he could have done on the first goal (well, other than make a great save) against but on the next two there's plenty of blame to go around.

I've been reluctant to blame the goalies since our general team game has been atrocious. But I think I'm officially done with Hiller. On the play where he got hurt, he actually managed to bounce a rebound into the middle of his crease off of a shot that was (arguably) slightly wide of his right post. I would think goalie fundamentals 101 dictates you just kick that into the corner / wide of the net rather than kicking it back into your crease. I'm not sure if his crouch made it difficult to do, but if he just deflects that into the corner, he doesn't get run.

Regardless, his fundamentals and concentration are just subpar. Perhaps his confidence is low, but the team doesn't have time to help him work it out.

[crapshoot]

Another thing about Hiller that bugs the crap out of me is how his body language signals defeat so clearly. Great Jonas, everyone knows how disappointed you are about letting in soft goals all the time. How about just sucking it up and go about you damn business instead of amplifying it for the whole world to see at every opportunity?