I wanted to trade Gaudreau last summer. Even when we were in the playoffs I wouldn't have been mad trading him at the deadline.
Going all in and risking that much on one year is foolish, smarter ways about it
I don't see how trading him at the deadline would be smart at all. We we had a solid cup chance and went for it.
What would the return be for him? The value of a rental.
What was he worth to the Flames? The value of a rental, plus value of knowing he fits perfectly in our system, plus value of a solid chance of re-signing.
I don't see how trading him at the deadline would be smart at all. We we had a solid cup chance and went for it.
What would the return be for him? The value of a rental.
What was he worth to the Flames? The value of a rental, plus value of knowing he fits perfectly in our system, plus value of a solid chance of re-signing.
That's a losing trade.
Then we got #### kicked in the playoffs and turns out his chance of resigning was zero.
We paid a first for Toffoli. Could have emptied a contenders cupboards.
Not that my opinion would ever change anyone's else on this forum, but at the end of the day, the organization lost these players because they don't want to play in a small market and cold Canadian city, this situation is not unique to Calgary. Look what's happening in Winnipeg, all the Canadian players that loved playing in California, Stamkos deciding to stay in Florida, I find the majority of Russians prefer to play in the states, can't forget about Adam Fox. Even if we traded Gaudreau for a first and a prospect at the beginning of the year, its not enough to be anything meaningful. I like Calgary, but for alot of hockey players, they don't want to be here
This is what I mean, once you have a statement of facts around the fact that two elite players want out of Calgary, you can argue about why. No other team has lost two assets like this in 14 days based on decisions made by the player before that I can remember, so this is definitely a first. You believe that reasonable efforts were made to prevent this and it is just bad luck. I think that it is incompetence from an asset management perspective.
100 percent I would either know they were staying or maximize value. I would not have hoped that two elite players would stick around to play on a team that could not make the playoffs in the powerful Canadian division last year.
The Flames are forcing Tkachuk's hand. That is why they might "lose" him within 14 days of Gaudreau leaving. The organization is doing their best to be pro-active with Tkachuk. Not really much else they can do.
With Gaudreau if they had traded him for a low offer, last off season, and watched him put up 100 points this season, people would be losing their minds about that.
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Eric Francis has been right about a lot of things.
These 2 guys wanting out isn’t a bold take. I think there is a decent portion of the fanbase that thought Johnny would walk when he could and a Chucky was itching to get to free agency to do the same thing
I don't think Tkachuk wants out.
I think he wants more money than the Flames want to pay him and probably more time, but the organization is terrified to play this out the same way they did with Gaudreau.
Tkachuk is also kind if a victim of Gaudreau here, because everyone is assuming he'll do the same and he won't be given the same opportunity to play out another season and negotiate as it goes.
This may or may not be true, but he's been treated differently because of what just happened with #13.
IMO, Tkachuk has more leverage to cash in now that Johnny isn't taking $10.5M per year. Doesn't mean he should get $12M (IMO), but presumably Treliving isn't going to lowball him at this stage and risk having another player not sign.
That said, if Chucky doesn't want to be the captain and play in the spotlight of a rabid Canadian market, and would prefer the comforts of the midwest US, then I don't want him here. In the past couple of weeks we've learned a lot about what makes some NHL players tick, and while Johnny's decision was puzzling at best, I'm not convinced Matthew is wired the same way. I hope he proves me right.
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Then we got #### kicked in the playoffs and turns out his chance of resigning was zero.
We paid a first for Toffoli. Could have emptied a contenders cupboards.
Dude I am sorry, but every single team in the NHL would have done the same thing the flames did, the team was projected to be a bubble team, you keep your stars and go for it,
IMO, Tkachuk has more leverage to cash in now that Johnny isn't taking $10.5M per year. Doesn't mean he should get $12M (IMO), but presumably Treliving isn't going to lowball him at this stage and risk having another player not sign.
That said, if Chucky doesn't want to be the captain and play in the spotlight of a rabid Canadian market, and would prefer the comforts of the midwest US, then I don't want him here. In the past couple of weeks we've learned a lot about what makes some NHL players tick, and while Johnny's decision was puzzling at best, I'm not convinced Matthew is wired the same way. I hope he proves me right.
Yes and no. More money, but questions about his individual production without JG. Somewhere between his performance with Backlund and last year, given Lindholm is still there. So how much is 80-80 points worth?
I don't think Tkachuk wants out.
I think he wants more money than the Flames want to pay him and probably more time, but the organization is terrified to play this out the same way they did with Gaudreau.
Tkachuk is also kind if a victim of Gaudreau here, because everyone is assuming he'll do the same and he won't be given the same opportunity to play out another season and negotiate as it goes.
This may or may not be true, but he's been treated differently because of what just happened with #13.
Tkachuk is unlikely to put up a better season next year than this year. This is the time for him to decide what to do, as his bargaining power is as good as it could ever be. I don't see him as a victim at all. He's actually been giving a massive opportunity. Career year with Gaudreau. Now the team is desperate to sign him.
If he's still unsure now about whether he wants to commit, what would change in a year?
Not that my opinion would ever change anyone's else on this forum, but at the end of the day, the organization lost these players because they don't want to play in a small market and cold Canadian city, this situation is not unique to Calgary. Look what's happening in Winnipeg, all the Canadian players that loved playing in California, Stamkos deciding to stay in Florida, I find the majority of Russians prefer to play in the states, can't forget about Adam Fox. Even if we traded Gaudreau for a first and a prospect at the beginning of the year, its not enough to be anything meaningful. I like Calgary, but for alot of hockey players, they don't want to be here
Jeeze, it's almost like the only way to win long term in a canadian market is to build from the draft over a period of 5-6 years and then lock the resulting star players into max length contracts as soon as possible. Almost like what the whole forum has essentially been advocating for for the last 10 years. We almost friggen did it and pulled up too early to try and get Hamonic. I am forgiving the Dougie get because he was a young stud D man in the core age range still. Anyways, reverse that Hamonic trade, we come out with Dobson on top of our current group and maybe that changes the outcome last playoffs. That was our chance. A few more pieces for other trades to bring in difference makers maybe too.
End of the day, the only way to get back here is start over. you're right, we're very unlikely to improve the team measurably through attracting free agents or hoping foreign players stay in Calgary into their 30s when they have contract freedom.
