[Rumour] Flames Not Yet Done - More to Come? Possible D for F?

[mile]

The 2019 Blues had Bouwmeester
The 2020-2022 Lightning had McDonagh


I see Hanifin in the same vein as those players - not a #1 D, but still an important piece a contender needs

[Elkyiv]

Is anyone else concerned that the success of the team is based on Toffolli being a true first line winger? What do we do if he doesn't produce?

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by Elkyiv

Is anyone else concerned that the success of the team is based on Toffolli being a true first line winger? What do we do if he doesn't produce?

Dube or Pelletier have to step up

[Drunk Uncle]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Well, rest of the league shut down the Oilers quite easily. You don’t have to shut down McDrai totally. Just enough.

McDrai played 300min together and they played 1000min apart. The rest of the league didn't shut them down quite easily because they play against when they were on the same line.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Elkyiv

Is anyone else concerned that the success of the team is based on Toffolli being a true first line winger? What do we do if he doesn't produce?

The success of the team is absolutely NOT based on Toffoli being a first line winger.

The success of the team is based on the strength of the goaltending, defense, and entire forward group. The first line will be carried by Huberdeau and Lindholm, and the RW just needs to pot some goals. If Toffoli does not perform satisfactorily, others will be tried.

But the team's success is not resting on him.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by Drunk Uncle

McDrai played 300min together and they played 1000min apart. The rest of the league didn't shut them down quite easily because they play against when they were on the same line.

Should have said the playoffs

The Oilers practically had no playoff success other than against the Flames

Nobody totally contained them but enough to kick their ass

[Flame On]

To me, the Flames D core are top 5 in the league. Is the addition of some forgotten forward going to elevate our offense into top 5 in the league without doubt?
To me I wouldn't weaken one of our top strengths for a small improvement in another area that may not pay off. Don't they have a little room to see what is needed at the TD?

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by mile

With the addition of Weegar, Hanifin is going to slotted better in a role that's perfect for him.

Consider that and the improvement he showed from the Covid year to this year (did anyone see him putting up almost 50 points?), I doubt management and the coach are looking to move him. The playoffs will be a learning experience for him.

#### I hope so.

[Phaneufenstein]

Toffoli's finishing ability is definitely top-6 calibre.

Many of us suspected fitness was an issue for him last year.
He seemed to run out of gas towards the latter part of the season, then ramped it up a bit in the playoffs, only to fade again against the Oilers.

I'm expecting him to come in better shape this year.
I'm sure Darryl told him to "better be ####ing ready".

[djsFlames]

Toffoli had a rough finish to the season. Not sure if it was fitness or a drop off after the high of coming on to a team running away with the division but it seems like a lot of people are judging him based off a subpar 2-3 weeks to close out the year.

Honestly it's a bit strange to see a fanbase go from TT chants to labelling the guy as slow and useless.

He had 7 goals in 7 games to start as a Flame and was on a pace for well over 40 the season prior.

All we need for him to do next to Kadri or Lindholm is shoot the puck in. He will have a pretty singular and straightforward assignment our there.

Hopefully he can just be like a Cammy or Monahan of old and get open and wire the puck.

I think he will have a better season. He's been an impact player before and will be again, I am sure. Rentals do not often pay off because settling in on the new team takes time, and there usually isn't enough for things to click. So good thing we have him another couple seasons to really find his place here.

[dammage79]

Toffoli and coleman both kind of pffffft towards the end. I suspect it had more to do with 2 straight years of deep cup runs more than anything.

I suspect both will be running with a lot of P and V this coming season.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Phaneufenstein

Toffoli's finishing ability is definitely top-6 calibre.

Many of us suspected fitness was an issue for him last year.
He seemed to run out of gas towards the latter part of the season, then ramped it up a bit in the playoffs, only to fade again against the Oilers.

I'm expecting him to come in better shape this year.
I'm sure Darryl told him to "better be ####ing ready".

Also, remember that he played until July 7 the previous year, so he had a very short summer last year.

Even in the years he went on long runs with the Kings, their summers were still a month longer than what he had last year (and he was almost a decade younger too).

[Jason14h]

Why do people equate trading Hanifin to dumping Hanifin

Look at the return we got for Dougie Hamilton including Hanifin

If you believe Hanifin is your 3rd or even 4th best and most valuable D and you can deal him to a team where he is their 2nd, you can extract more value and build a stronger team

If you believe Hanifin is , or will develop to be one of your two most important D, you keep him

I don’t think he is as good as the other 3 guys and think is a great opportunity to extract value and improve the team

[Just a guy]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

1) very small sample size
2) with Tanev out and Kylington and Gudbranson banged up, MOST of the heavy minutes fell to Hanifin and Andersson
3) Hanifin's TOI went up by 2 full minutes in the playoffs, vs the regular season

The playoffs are a different beast - some teams get on a roll, others do not. The sample size is tiny, and matchups matter A LOT. In a single series, if you're matched up against a line that is playing well, your numbers are going to suck.

Did Hanifin struggle against the Oilers? Absolutely. Is there anyone on the Flames' D that didn't? No.

Trading good young defensemen away, and making the D weaker, does not seem like the greatest strategy to fixing the problem of our D not being good enough against the Oilers.

Further, did the forward group go away from their game and added pressure on the defence?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Toffoli had a rough finish to the season. Not sure if it was fitness or a drop off after the high of coming on to a team running away with the division but it seems like a lot of people are judging him based off a subpar 2-3 weeks to close out the year.

Honestly it's a bit strange to see a fanbase go from TT chants to labelling the guy as slow and useless.

He had 7 goals in 7 games to start as a Flame and was on a pace for well over 40 the season prior.

All we need for him to do next to Kadri or Lindholm is shoot the puck in. He will have a pretty singular and straightforward assignment our there.

Hopefully he can just be like a Cammy or Monahan of old and get open and wire the puck.

I think he will have a better season. He's been an impact player before and will be again, I am sure. Rentals do not often pay off because settling in on the new team takes time, and there usually isn't enough for things to click. So good thing we have him another couple seasons to really find his place here.

Toffoli was not put with a compatible centre for most of his tenure. He also got shuffled a whole lot, between Backlund, an injured Monahan and Jarnkrok. I expect he will be with either Lindholm or Kadri and his points will respond.

And fitness (especially at altitude) was an issue. Hopefully he's addressed that.

[cral12]

Originally Posted by Elkyiv

Is anyone else concerned that the success of the team is based on Toffolli being a true first line winger? What do we do if he doesn't produce?

Nope - Huberdeau's most common linemates in Florida last season: Bennett & Duclair.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by cral12

Nope - Huberdeau's most common linemates in Florida last season: Bennett & Duclair.

Huberdeau never played in Florida with a center the caliber of Lindholm. Should be a great combo, as Lindholm is a strong finisher himself.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by blankall

Huberdeau never played in Florida with a center the caliber of Lindholm. Should be a great combo, as Lindholm is a strong finisher himself.

Well, he had a couple season at least on Barkov's wing.

[Drunk Uncle]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Should have said the playoffs

The Oilers practically had no playoff success other than against the Flames

Nobody totally contained them but enough to kick their ass

Tanev is the biggest reason that happened IMO. No other team they played was missing their top D. The only team that shut them down was Colorado (and they still outscored Colorado). For playoff context, they didn't put McDrai together until part way through the LA series so here are there splits. Obviously some of these are small sample sizes:

McDrai 22GF - 9GA (Playoffs against all teams)
McDavid w/o Drai 9GF - 8GA (Playoffs against all teams)
Drai w/o McDavid 1GF - 9GA (Playoffs against all teams)

McDrai vs LA (37min), 4GF - 1GA
McDrai vs Flames (73min), 13GF - 4GA
McDrai vs Colorado (46min), 5GF - 4GA

McDrai vs the Flames pairings:
Hanifin Anderson (38min), 8GF-0GA
Tanev Kylington (10min), 0GF - 1GA
Gubranson Kylington (5min), 1GF-0GA
Zadorov Gudbranson (6min), 3GF-0GA

Bottom line is McDrai caved in every pair we had when Tanev was out of the lineup. They also caved in LA's top pair. The only pair they didn't cave in was Makar-Toews and McDrai still out performed that pair.

What the above tells me is Hanifin Anderson can't handle McDrai. That leads me to believe that Darryl will try split Hanifin Anderson to try get 2 pairs that won't get caved in. I also think losing Hanifin or Anderson by way of trade makes it much more difficult to get 2 pairs that won't get caved in.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Toffoli was not put with a compatible centre for most of his tenure. He also got shuffled a whole lot, between Backlund, an injured Monahan and Jarnkrok. I expect he will be with either Lindholm or Kadri and his points will respond.

And fitness (especially at altitude) was an issue. Hopefully he's addressed that.

Yeah, I think it was a combination of conditioning and the constant shuffling between the depth lines, with players who themselves were struggling.