Alberta PST discussion

[Dion]

Originally Posted by RedMileDJ

I'm sorry, but if you move into a community expecting a school to go up, because that's what you were told, then you're dreaming. I don't know if this is your situation, but I honestly laugh at parents and families that buy in these new communities expecting a school to go up.

If you're planning on having children in X amount of year, or already have kids that are close to going to school, then buy into a community that already has established schools. As well, make sure they can get in. Pregnant? Ok, you have 9 months to sell and find a community with an established school.

When you make your top 10 list for a home, schools should be in the top 3. At least it was for us.

I will agree that there is a school shortage. Or at least not enough schools for all the urban sprawl. But there are plenty of communities with schools, to pick from.

Sorry. Not trying to be a jerk.

Back on topic: no PST. Thanks.

Not always not that simple. People move to communities that have schools but when the time comes there's over crowding and they have to bus the kids elsewhere.

[RedMileDJ]

Originally Posted by Dion

Not always not that simple. People move to communities that have schools but when the time comes there's over crowding and they have to bus the kids elsewhere.

I'll agree with this. I'm talking about people that move into these new communities, expecting a school to go up, and then panic when there is no school after X amount of time.

[RedMileDJ]

Originally Posted by Dion

Not always not that simple. People move to communities that have schools but when the time comes there's over crowding and they have to bus the kids elsewhere.

Originally Posted by RedMileDJ

I'll agree with this. I'm talking about people that move into these new communities, expecting a school to go up, and then panic when there is no school after X amount of time.

I'll expand on this:

Do your research. Is there ever a waiting period at the school? Has it ever been over-crowded? Etc.

We bought into a community that will have space for our son and daughter, and has never been over-crowded. It's a Catholic school, so him being Baptized Catholic and having all the papers, will put him ahead of a kid that isn't.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by RedMileDJ

I'll expand on this:

Do your research. Is there ever a waiting period at the school? Has it ever been over-crowded? Etc.

We bought into a community that will have space for our son and daughter, and has never been over-crowded. It's a Catholic school, so him being Baptized Catholic and having all the papers, will put him ahead of a kid that isn't.

I've heard stories in the news where familes that had kids going to a certain school who were years later forced to be bussed elsewhere. There might be vacancies when you move there, but over time the same community can grow to a point where there is an over capacity.

In other cases, school boundries can be changed where your child is forced to go to another school much further away.

You can't predict the above.

[Jacks]

Give the PC's 5% more and it will be gobbled up instantly, then in a few years the same people will be saying we need more tax revenue. The government needs to clean up the way it does business, there are 3 people now doing the same job that 1 person used to do 10-15 years ago and they like to create lots of hoops to jump through to justify their jobs. I'm not talking out my butt here, I deal with them on a regular basis.

For the folks talking about a "temporary tax", when has that ever happened?

[SebC]

If people support a sales tax for Alberta, doesn't it logically follow that the federal Conservatives should not have cut the GST?

[krazycanuck]

It makes no sense that someone making 40k a year is paying the same 10% provincial income tax that someone making 200k is paying. bring on the provincial tax brackets!

[eddly]

Originally Posted by RedMileDJ

I'm sorry, but if you move into a community expecting a school to go up, because that's what you were told, then you're dreaming. I don't know if this is your situation, but I honestly laugh at parents and families that buy in these new communities expecting a school to go up.

If you're planning on having children in X amount of year, or already have kids that are close to going to school, then buy into a community that already has established schools. As well, make sure they can get in. Pregnant? Ok, you have 9 months to sell and find a community with an established school.

When you make your top 10 list for a home, schools should be in the top 3. At least it was for us.

I will agree that there is a school shortage. Or at least not enough schools for all the urban sprawl. But there are plenty of communities with schools, to pick from.

Sorry. Not trying to be a jerk.

Back on topic: no PST. Thanks.

Don't think you are being a jerk.

We were renting in Evanston. Finally buying a house this year. With the low availability of suitable rentals you take what you can get with or without schools. It just doesn't make sense to me that their would be essentially no plan for schools being built in a timely manner.

I've given up on the idea of having a school within walking distance. We are buying in Mahogany which won't have schools for a while.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by SebC

If people support a sales tax for Alberta, doesn't it logically follow that the federal Conservatives should not have cut the GST?

You are smart enough to know just how tortured your logic is there man.


At any rate, my beef with the sales tax idea in this case revolves around how transparent a liar Jim Prentice is. He says he doesn't support one? Bullcrap. He wouldn't be bringing it up if he didn't. The PCs have raised this boogeyman repeatedly over the last few years not to gauge support for the idea, but to gauge how tired people have become of the "discussion". The PCs know that introducing a sales tax is politically dangerous, but they are trying to wear people down into a sense of inevitability so as to minimize that political fall out.

Honestly, crap or get off the pot. If you want to introduce a sales tax, or bring back variable tax rates or re-introduce health care premiums because you spent yourself into a massive hole, then have the god damned courage to do it and live with the consequences.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

You are smart enough to know just how tortured your logic is there man.


At any rate, my beef with the sales tax idea in this case revolves around how transparent a liar Jim Prentice is. He says he doesn't support one? Bullcrap. He wouldn't be bringing it up if he didn't. The PCs have raised this boogeyman repeatedly over the last few years not to gauge support for the idea, but to gauge how tired people have become of the "discussion". The PCs know that introducing a sales tax is politically dangerous, but they are trying to wear people down into a sense of inevitability so as to minimize that political fall out.

Honestly, crap or get off the pot. If you want to introduce a sales tax, or bring back variable tax rates or re-introduce health care premiums because you spent yourself into a massive hole, then have the god damned courage to do it and live with the consequences.

So what would you support? I think that you're against a consumption tax, and probably against raising taxes?

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Slava

So what would you support? I think that you're against a consumption tax, and probably against raising taxes?

What do I support? Going back in time and having Redford listen to people telling her she was spending us into danger.

It really doesn't matter which option I hate least. Prentice and the PCs are still operating under a tax, spend, and pray philosophy, and they are going to jack something up that will hurt pretty much all of us. Just pick one and do it already.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

What do I support? Going back in time and having Redford listen to people telling her she was spending us into danger.

It really doesn't matter which option I hate least. Prentice and the PCs are still operating under a tax, spend, and pray philosophy, and they are going to jack something up that will hurt pretty much all of us. Just pick one and do it already.

I wouldn't exactly call it artful, but it's a dodge none-the-less.

[Resolute 14]

High praise coming from the master.

I support none of the above, obviously. But the fact that this government has #####ed us into the inevitability of having to jack something up is also fairly obvious.

[Hockeyguy15]

Originally Posted by Slava

Or just tax non-essential items. If people are spending discretionary income on things then the extra 5% is just factored in when they decide to spend.

I like this, I would be fine with it.

Tax booze, smokes, cars, ect...

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

High praise coming from the master.

I support none of the above, obviously. But the fact that this government has #####ed us into the inevitability of having to jack something up is also fairly obvious.

Face the facts: Alberta has the lowest level of government revenues per unit of GDP than any province.

Alberta has the lowest level of program expenses per unit of GDP than any province.

Alberta relied on approximately 1/5 of their revenue to come from oil and gas royalties. That was projected to be $9 billion over the past year. This year, should oil prices hold, they would effectively receive no royalties. 1/5 of your entire budget is up to something that's totally out of your control.

Yet that's not the problem is it?

No no, it's <mouthfoam> Redford and Stelmach and all their spending and gettin in the way of the economy and us doing our jobs </mouthfoam>

Just ridiculous.

[Nehkara]

I personally think it would be a much better idea to get rid of the flat income tax and go progressive.

[WilsonFourTwo]

It's not a revenue problem, it's a spending problem. Adding more money to the situation just increases the scale of the problem.

EDIT: The rest just doesn't matter. It's just me being pissed off...

[Northendzone]

to me it would likely make sense to introduce a PST along with revisions to the entire tx structure/formulas.

i think it would be difficult for the gov't to tax non-essential items, because who is going to decide was is essential vs non-essential.

as others have said, once the horse it out of the barn, it ain't goign back in - a PST will be around forever....

[InglewoodFan]

I really wouldn't have a problem with a sales tax or increased provincial tax if whatever legislation brought it in also spelled out that resource royalties went to savings. Eventually (and it would suck for a few years until enough $$$ was saved) a lot of needed capital spending could be financed out of interest on that savings.

And, a bit more controversially, royalties should probably go up. We are basically paying negative royalties on coal at this point.

[PsYcNeT]

Put me in the ring for a progressive provincial income tax. Flat taxes are ####ing dumb as hell.