Underperformers

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Oh here we go.

The doghouse/goat horns thread will be a hot button topic this year.

Just remember that down years happen with younger players and as long as they're showing flashes then they can probably still put it together with some patience.

This isnt exactly an easy team to excel with. A lot of guys arent executing at a high level.

Like if we had some guys that could hit the net Parekh would have a bundle of apples already.

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by SportsJunky

Perhaps the stated goal isn't the true goal?

Yeah, that's my solace right now.

But I do think Flames fans could handle an honest, 'This is a rebuild, you'll see a lot of new faces as we build towards something great in the future. Please support the team and our promise to you is compete every night and play an entertaining brand of hockey.'

An alternative explanation is that Flames don't know what they are doing. I'd rather believe that they are just playing the media game (internal front office and external media relations stories are different).

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Because as an organization, you're always looking to improve?

If you won the cup, or were right there knocking on the door, then sure, roll the same thing out there next year. But when you're a transitional team that is in the middle of a retool, that seems like the perfect time to re-evaluate everything, IMO.

I have said it a hundred times, and reading these threads today, I keep seeing it over and over - Canadian fans are way too impatient.

Hanley was great last year - 5 games into a season where no one has played well, and fans want to fire him into the sun. Same with a handful of others, the coach, the PP coach, the PK coach...

Chill people - rebuilds take time and the team is going to suck throughout it.

Really? Great teams don't change systems/pp/pk year over year.

Flames last year were not great, but they had something special and almost made the playoffs. With the same roster it would be reasonable to tweak some things but not completely change them.

Rejean31 is right. That is a crazy decision unless the composition of the team has changed. It barely has - and Huska seems to be the person reluctant to do so.

Huska is in a bad spot. He needs to win to keep his job, which helps him cement a future as a HC here and maybe elsewhere some day. But he has as much as 50% of his roster comprised of AHL level players. So he is defaulting to guys with experience, even if it is not much (Miro, Bean).

This is all aggravated by Flames not admitting what they are doing, which puts unrealistic expectations on Huska.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

You can't blame Wolf for any of the losses. He has been average, but he also hasn't been given much support and at times has been completely hung out to dry. Underperforming by his standards probably, but those standards are also really high. I don't expect him to remain average.

It's not that different than most of the losses Vladar had last season. This team with average goaltending is below average overall.

Wolf is dead last in the NHL in Goals Saved Above Expected at -7.8.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

Huska is in a bad spot. He needs to win to keep his job, which helps him cement a future as a HC here and maybe elsewhere some day. But he has as much as 50% of his roster comprised of AHL level players. So he is defaulting to guys with experience, even if it is not much (Miro, Bean).

Huska relied pretty heavily on Gridin, has trusted Honzek pretty strongly on the defensive side, and throws Parekh out whenever they’re desperate for a goal.

I don’t think he’s defaulting to guys with experience. I think he has a pretty consistent plan on how he wants to bring along the young guys and is doing so.

Same thing happened unproven guys Coronato, Klapka, Pospisil, Zary, etc. They only seem to move backwards when they take a step back or show they weren’t quite ready for the step forward, but he’s always willing to try them again.

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Huska relied pretty heavily on Gridin, has trusted Honzek pretty strongly on the defensive side, and throws Parekh out whenever they’re desperate for a goal.

I don’t think he’s defaulting to guys with experience. I think he has a pretty consistent plan on how he wants to bring along the young guys and is doing so.

Same thing happened unproven guys Coronato, Klapka, Pospisil, Zary, etc. They only seem to move backwards when they take a step back or show they weren’t quite ready for the step forward, but he’s always willing to try them again.

You sort of make my point though, he defaults to other guys and plays Parekh when he is desperate. It's weird.

If Zayne has the skill to save you, then surely he has the skill to prevent you from needing him to save you?

Maybe it is the way he brings new guys along, as you say. But the logic he's applying still strikes me as odd (if that is indeed his thought process).

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

You sort of make my point though, he defaults to other guys and plays Parekh when he is desperate. It's weird.

If Zayne has the skill to save you, then surely he has the skill to prevent you from needing him to save you?

Maybe it is the way he brings new guys along, as you say. But the logic he's applying still strikes me as odd (if that is indeed his thought process).

Same reason Honzek is being trusted on the penalty kill but not on the power play or the top 6 yet.

In my eyes it’s just recognizing the strengths of players and playing to them while managing the risk/reward of what spots they’re put out in.

You could gift Parekh top pairing minutes all game but he’s still high risk high reward. He stands a higher chance of getting you a goal but a higher chance of costing you one, too. So the 2nd period of a tied game or a game where you’re up 1-0? Maybe that risk is a little high. But the end of the 3rd when you’re down anyway and a goal for could be the difference between winning and losing and a goal against just cements where you’re at? That changes the kind of risk/reward.

I’m extremely confident that both Parekh and Honzek, if they continue on the current path, will get way more opportunities in all situations. But I like playing them to their strengths in the right situations, right now.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Wolf is dead last in the NHL in Goals Saved Above Expected at -7.8.

99% of people wouldn't stop most of the shots that have gone in, but at the same tine Wolf hasn't played up to Wolf's level.

[stemit14]

Originally Posted by iamca

Agreed on the D, none of those 3 are full time NHLers.

I think Zary needs to be on a different line where he can hopefully use his play making skills.

Sharky needs to sit now. If he doesn’t respond, send him down to the AHL. He is a major liability and with a ridiculous extension in place.

Honzek has shown some great flashes out there and needs to be rewarded for his effort.

Huska has been frustrating with some of his coaching decisions this season, especially ice time for some of these underperforming players, PP personnel, and I’ll say it, overplaying Wolf.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Agreed. I know we’ll have to be patient for the vet trades to happen but I hope Conroy can get a good return for players like Andersson, Coleman and Kadri. And I think it would be ideal if they could move Sharangovich without having to pay another team to take him on. Don’t really care about his cap hit at the moment - just his roster spot. Similar with Miromanov and Bean. With those players traded/moved down, it would open up spots for a roster with lots of opportunity for young players to play larger roles. A lineup like this would be interesting to see by the end of the year:

Huberdeau-Frost-Gridin
Posposil-Zary-Klapka
Farabee-Backlund-Honzek
Lomberg-Morton-Suniev

Weegar-Parekh
Bahl-Brzustewicz
Kuznetzov-Hanley

It’s very likely a weaker roster than what the flames have now but that’s ok. It’s young players playing larger roles and the hope would be the flames would end the season with following assets going into the draft:

2026 or 2027 1st round pick from Andersson trade
2026 or 2027 1st round pick from Kadri trade
2026 or 2027 2nd round pick from Kadri trade
2026 or 2027 2nd round pick from Coleman trade
Top 5 pick in the 2026 draft (their own pick)

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

99% of people wouldn't stop most of the shots that have gone in, but at the same tine Wolf hasn't played up to Wolf's level.

The stat says differently.

It says that the average goalie would have saved 7.8 goals more than Wolf based on the shot quality.

[gvitaly]

I'm actually looking forward to seeing which players get a longer leash from the coach, and which get scratched. Huska isn't exactly shy about scratching players to send a message. Kuzmenko was a prime example last year. He even did it with Huberdeau in his 1st year as a coach before they got on the same page.

IMO, Coronato, Zary, and Sharan need to find a new line/chemistry. The team is committed to all 3 for the foreseeable future, so I'm sure that the coaches will try to get them going, hopefully they find a way to generate at least 2 lines that work. I would also love to see the Flames generate odd man rushes at least once in a while.

[Flamesfan05]

People forgot Kadri and Huberdeau had a real good year last year
Team is going nowhere without them performing

Rest of the team are just mediocre talent wise

[boogerz]

Sharangovich is probably the wrong whipping boy. The big knocks against him when he was traded to the Flames was his softness, inconsistency, and being a perimeter player/unable to create his own offense. He's improved a little bit since coming here, but a player that struggles to create his own offense isn't going to be an offensive dynamo in a system that makes it difficult for players to create offense.

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

They're still underperforming, especially as a cohesive team. It doesn't take a lot of talent to play defense, they're just not doing it.

The offense is maybe a little more about talent, but they're still not doing much at all out there, and I do think they're underperforming across the board.

Honestly, I hate to say it, but the fact that everyone on the team looks so disjointed is on Huska. He needs to right the ship a little here soon. Can't keep getting embarrassed on a nightly basis. You might still lose, but the effort and commitment to defense has to be there.

Fully agreed. It feels as though a lot of the frustration is being misdirected at the players even though it's Huska's job to create structure for the team and keep everyone motivated.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

Really? Great teams don't change systems/pp/pk year over year.

Flames last year were not great, but they had something special and almost made the playoffs. With the same roster it would be reasonable to tweak some things but not completely change them.

Rejean31 is right. That is a crazy decision unless the composition of the team has changed. It barely has - and Huska seems to be the person reluctant to do so.

Huska is in a bad spot. He needs to win to keep his job, which helps him cement a future as a HC here and maybe elsewhere some day. But he has as much as 50% of his roster comprised of AHL level players. So he is defaulting to guys with experience, even if it is not much (Miro, Bean).

This is all aggravated by Flames not admitting what they are doing, which puts unrealistic expectations on Huska.

The Flames were not great last year, LOL. And even if you want to argue that they were reasonably good, the fact is that they were 19th in PP percentage, and 25th in PK. Any team that is bottom half of the league should be looking at ways to improve. To suggest that Huska is somehow upsetting the applecart is ridiculous - the organization is trying to improve, and any fan that thinks they shouldn't be doing these things (now, especially) is nuts, IMO.

As for the bold, do you honestly believe that the organization has not given Huska clear directions on what they want from him? Just because they haven't come out and told you specifically what their plans are, does not mean they don't have plans, or have not shared them with Huska.

Honestly, some of the complaints around here are just ridiculous - people want to spin literally everything as a reason to bitch about the team. "they are trying to improve the special teams - how dare they?!?"

[Macho0978]

This is the team most of us expected last year and ice time.

Zary was 1 player mentioned, but when you go from 16 minutes a game to 13, what do people expect?

Conroy needs to address the log jam at forward.

Defense is just bad, Parekh needs to play

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

The stat says differently.

It says that the average goalie would have saved 7.8 goals more than Wolf based on the shot quality.

That stat can be tough for a couple of reasons. It doesn't account who is shooting, and doesn't account where it's shot. Just the location the shot was taken from.

Wolf early this season reminds me a bit of Markstrom in the Oilers series.

The numbers look terrible, but the Flames keep giving up grade A chances to the other teams best finishers.

That stat gives the same weight giving up a grade A chance to Joel Farabee as it does to Jack Eichel and Mitch Marner...and those things are very different.

For example in the Vegas game it has Wolf as giving up 5 GA on an XGA of 1.57...which is ridiculous because you'd expect him to save at most 1 of those goals and the xGA should be way higher than 1.5 based on the quality of shooters taking those chances in that game.

The only game where I thought Wolf was actually poor was the Vancouver game...and that was idiotic coaching when they played him on the second half of a season opening back to back with travel after the game went to OT.

[blankall]

This team got a lot of its points last year by going balls to the wall every night and feasting on lesser teams. They were often shut down by the actual good teams in the league.

When a team gets by on feistiness it's pretty easy for that feeling to dissipate and for things to fall into a tail spin.

I've been under the impression that Wolf has been good enough to keep the Flames out of the very bottom. That's obviously not correct this year, and I will admit I was wrong on that. This team looks like the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever did suck.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by blankall

This team got a lot of its points last year by going balls to the wall every night and feasting on lesser teams. They were often shut down by the actual good teams in the league.

When a team gets by on feistiness it's pretty easy for that feeling to dissipate and for things to fall into a tail spin.

I've been under the impression that Wolf has been good enough to keep the Flames out of the very bottom. That's obviously not correct this year, and I will admit I was wrong on that. This team looks like the suckiest bunch of sucks that ever did suck.

I just hope getting shelled almost every night doesn’t destroy his confidence. He looked destroyed on the bench after getting the mercy pull. It’s really bad timing that the closest thing we have to a superstar on a rebuilding team that can’t play defense that well and offers even less goal support, is a goalie.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

That stat can be tough for a couple of reasons. It doesn't account who is shooting, and doesn't account where it's shot. Just the location the shot was taken from.

Wolf early this season reminds me a bit of Markstrom in the Oilers series.

The numbers look terrible, but the Flames keep giving up grade A chances to the other teams best finishers.

That stat gives the same weight giving up a grade A chance to Joel Farabee as it does to Jack Eichel and Mitch Marner...and those things are very different.

For example in the Vegas game it has Wolf as giving up 5 GA on an XGA of 1.57...which is ridiculous because you'd expect him to save at most 1 of those goals and the xGA should be way higher than 1.5 based on the quality of shooters taking those chances in that game.

The only game where I thought Wolf was actually poor was the Vancouver game...and that was idiotic coaching when they played him on the second half of a season opening back to back with travel after the game went to OT.

Flames have the 4th lowest expected goals against...they have played good teams though

[FlamesNightmare]

Yegor sharangovich; that guy is so invisible he could scare a ghost. What happened to this guy. Even had the same problems last season. Like, Kevin Bieska called him out if I recall.