[Rumour] Dreger: Bowen Byram trade talks heating up. Calgary one of many teams interested

[GullFoss]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Why are we on using the Oilers? What about the kings ? Panthers ? Lightning? Hawks ?

Teams with actual success and multiple cups. All of them picked top 3 and went onto win cups.

What .makes more sense...

1) tanking, then drafting top 3 picks, then building a cast of home grown supporting players around them.

Or

2) building a cast of home grown supporting players, then tanking and drafting top 3 picks?

Id suggest it doesn't matter. You build a supporting cast both prior to and immediately after drafting your franchise players. You need both supporting players and franchise players and you play the cards you've been given.

Just because the flames haven't drafted top-3 draft picks yet doesn't mean they won't.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by midniteowl

TBH, from what they've done so far this off season, if one or 2 teams take a step forward, they might not make the playoff next season.

Is going to be a very wide openn season. Even the Panthers will be sending a bunch of players to the Olympics.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

What .makes more sense...

1) tanking, then drafting top 3 picks, then building a cast of home grown supporting players around them.

Or

2) building a cast of home grown supporting players, then tanking and drafting top 3 picks?

Id suggest it doesn't matter. You build a supporting cast both prior to and immediately after drafting your franchise players. You need both supporting players and franchise players and you play the cards you've been given.

Just because the flames haven't drafted top-3 draft picks yet doesn't mean they won't.

Personally I think having players ready to go and getting top tier talent is the best way. They will be on cheap deals and they will young now.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

I assume you watched the playoffs the last 2 years where they went to game 7 of the Stanley cup finals and game 5 of the Stanley cup finals?

They are the 2nd most successful franchise over the last 2 seasons behind Florida

If they are the argument that drafting superstars doesn’t work I don’t know what to say . They are the perfect example that a couple superstars can make up for many other deficiencies

I only hope we can experience this level of failure in the future (straight Stanley cup appearances)

Under the old rules...under the current draft rules the Oilers wouldn't have gotten McDavid and he is the ONLY reason they have even been "close"
Lets stop pretending it was some shrewd plan

[midniteowl]

That's Oilers problem, they couldn't do anything with McDiver and Pissy in the ELC. Their GM's could not sign any supporting cast that can help their 2 elite centers. They should be able to have 2 dangerous lines and still have enough cap space to sign an elite goalie. But then again, it's their poor management in recognize true talents. And that's why it's a joke calling them successful franchise.

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by midniteowl

There are no "we" here, just Jason14 don't know why he keeps bringing that "back to back SC Final appearance".

I was asked (randomly - still don’t know why - by name ) what have the Oilers accomplished . Never once brought them up . I’m still confused why I was even asked ! Taxbuster wasn’t even replying to a post of mine when he posted the below . Maybe he’s confused !

Originally Posted by taxbuster

Yup..and works both ways.

Johnny Gaudreau, Brett Hull, Pavel Datsyuk and Luc Robitaille among others went after the third round and had terrific careers.


On the other hand, Nail Yakupov (LOL) says hello.

Picking high is no guarantee of diddly-squat. The odds might be better…but they’re still odds. Remind me again what the Greasers have done with those high picks? (that’s for Jason 14h).

I answered

That’s why I brought it up (once) - because I was asked

But it becoming hilarious that there’s 3 pages apparently thinking somewhere I said we should a) tank , or b) that the Oilers are a model we should aim for . I didn’t say either !

[TheScorpion]

I'm starting to think the Bo Byram talks aren't actually heating up

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I'm starting to think the Bo Byram talks aren't actually heating up

Seems to me like the propane tank went empty a couple of days ago.

[InternationalVillager]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I'm starting to think the Bo Byram talks aren't actually heating up

Yup. I've heard nothing now for a few days.

[Royle9]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I'm starting to think the Bo Byram talks aren't actually heating up

The scary thing is that Adam’s and Craig are both pulling the “he’s still on our team” card and acting like they don’t need to trade the respective players.
It’s uncanny how similar the situation is, coupled with the fact that both teams have interest in the other sides player in this situation.

Calgary’s interest is contingent on moving Rasmus, Rasmus won’t extend in Buffalo though as we know.

It’s a dangerous game, we went from a position of power heading into the deadline last year, then again at the draft but that quickly changed and now we’re stuck with a long drawn out stalemate.

Things were close, on both fronts but now sadly have cooled off.
Rasmus’s stance on wishing to not extend prior to his UFA status has essentially pigeonholed Calgary once again (Hanifin 2.0) which counters the leverage of a good trade prior to the start of the year. This could turn into a situation where he’s held to the deadline to try and maximize value.. but not the value he’s had previously.

I hate to say it but I feel like the false hope last year and holding onto Andersson for the stretch run will come back to haunt us.

I do know that it’s not lost on the group and there are players wondering what their own situation looks like should Andersson be moved. Which is why it’s advantageous from CGY perspective to get this handled ASAP.

Sorry guys, TLDR: it’s complicated now.

[SutterBrother]

Originally Posted by Royle9

I hate to say it but I feel like the false hope last year and holding onto Andersson for the stretch run will come back to haunt us.

What a shocker.

[RANT]

I get really angry when I hear the GM talk about 'we owe it to these guys to keep them together' and 'we are building culture'.

What do they owe me as a fan? What do they owe season ticket holders who have paid for decades to watch this also-ran drivel?

You pay the players MILLIONS of dollars. You "owe" them zero.

And what culture? A culture of losing? Congrats on that. Are players going to clamor to come here because the GM is 'nice'? Of course not. Because he flew out to pick them up in a jet?

Guess what. They're on jets all the time. They will sell out on you and your hinterland team at the first opportunity because the ONLY things they care about are money and winning.

So how about this franchise try investing in winning instead of these dud players for a change, and maybe give the fans something to look forward to.

Instead of this sh-t.

Yet again.

[/RANT]

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Royle9

The scary thing is that Adam’s and Craig are both pulling the “he’s still on our team” card and acting like they don’t need to trade the respective players.
It’s uncanny how similar the situation is, coupled with the fact that both teams have interest in the other sides player in this situation.

Calgary’s interest is contingent on moving Rasmus, Rasmus won’t extend in Buffalo though as we know.

It’s a dangerous game, we went from a position of power heading into the deadline last year, then again at the draft but that quickly changed and now we’re stuck with a long drawn out stalemate.

Things were close, on both fronts but now sadly have cooled off.
Rasmus’s stance on wishing to not extend prior to his UFA status has essentially pigeonholed Calgary once again (Hanifin 2.0) which counters the leverage of a good trade prior to the start of the year. This could turn into a situation where he’s held to the deadline to try and maximize value.. but not the value he’s had previously.

I hate to say it but I feel like the false hope last year and holding onto Andersson for the stretch run will come back to haunt us.

I do know that it’s not lost on the group and there are players wondering what their own situation looks like should Andersson be moved. Which is why it’s advantageous from CGY perspective to get this handled ASAP.

Sorry guys, TLDR: it’s complicated now.

I normally like to try to understand the thought process behind certain moves, even if that ‘move’ is to not move.

Have to admit that this time around the only thing I see is shortsightedness and false hope.

I sure hope this severs as a lessons learned for Flames management. If we’ve learned anything over the last handful of years is that at the moment, the game/league seems to reward the teams who are bold.

The Flames had a coveted asset that all but certainly needed to be capitalized on, for several reasons, and they allowed ‘culture’ or ‘good vibes’ to muddy the waters. Shame.

If there is a silver lining I suppose is that the deal is not done yet and the Flames very well may come out of this with a handsome return but I am starting to side with those who would like to see a more purposeful direction we can see. The longer the Flames nibble around the edges the longer I think this period of adding organizational depth/non-era defining talent we will see. Enough of the McDavid/Draisatl jerseys at the ODR. Let’s see a Flames jersey with a McKenna or a DuPont, please?

Huberdeau is likely still unmovable
Coleman could/should be dealt
Backlund could/should be approached about what he wants. Chase a cup or legacy?
Kadri should be dealt if possible (ie he accepts)
Lomberg should be traded at the TDL.
Andersson should have been dealt last deadline. Lesson learned.
Weegar is probably the only guy I would prefer to keep.

All this doesn’t need to happen this year, in some cases yes, but if I’m CC, I’m looking to move 3 of the 6 this year.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Royle9

The scary thing is that Adam’s and Craig are both pulling the “he’s still on our team” card and acting like they don’t need to trade the respective players.
It’s uncanny how similar the situation is, coupled with the fact that both teams have interest in the other sides player in this situation.

Calgary’s interest is contingent on moving Rasmus, Rasmus won’t extend in Buffalo though as we know.

It’s a dangerous game, we went from a position of power heading into the deadline last year, then again at the draft but that quickly changed and now we’re stuck with a long drawn out stalemate.

Things were close, on both fronts but now sadly have cooled off.
Rasmus’s stance on wishing to not extend prior to his UFA status has essentially pigeonholed Calgary once again (Hanifin 2.0) which counters the leverage of a good trade prior to the start of the year. This could turn into a situation where he’s held to the deadline to try and maximize value.. but not the value he’s had previously.

I hate to say it but I feel like the false hope last year and holding onto Andersson for the stretch run will come back to haunt us.

I do know that it’s not lost on the group and there are players wondering what their own situation looks like should Andersson be moved. Which is why it’s advantageous from CGY perspective to get this handled ASAP.

Sorry guys, TLDR: it’s complicated now.

There’s a risk to the player here also, though. If he has a significant injury, he winds his contract down and that impacts any deal he signs. It’s probably a good idea for both sides to get things wrapped up sooner rather than later.

[CliffFletcher]

It seems Andersson and his agent feel his play last season hurt his value, and they want to go to market next summer after an improved season rather than extend now at lower value. It’s a risk for all parties involved. But the Flames need to move on from the expectations of an extension and shop him purely as a rental.

Best case scenario: Andersson has a strong season, and one of the contending teams pays a nice package for him as a rental.

Bad scenario: Andersson struggles out of the gate, loses PP time to Parehk, we have a repeat of the bad vibes from 2023-24, and he’s sold as a distressed asset at the deadline.

Worse scenario: Andersson struggles, but the team is in a playoff spot approaching the deadline, and management decides to keep him as an own rental, justifying it later by saying other teams didn’t meet their asking price and they didn’t want to just give him away.

Worst scenario: Serious injury.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Slava

There’s a risk to the player here also, though. If he has a significant injury, he winds his contract down and that impacts any deal he signs. It’s probably a good idea for both sides to get things wrapped up sooner rather than later.

This also raised an eyebrow for me. What was the contract offer the Kings had for Andersson? If it was anywhere near what he’s asking for, I’d have to say that is/was a ballsy decision.

His fellow countrymen John Klingberg would have probably advised him to take the deal.

[taxbuster]

Current scenario: all the Usual Suspects on CP are out of their minds bc Conny didn’t do something LAST season for “reasons” that make sense only to them.

I’m prepared to judge based on results, not fantasy. My assumption is that the GM and the player are FAR better poised to decide what works…or doesn’t…for themselves. So far, the GM has done exactly what he said he would, to the extent possible. It won’t please Team Tank, but that’s not his stated intention either.

Prepare for more whinging! It could be a long summer.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

Current scenario: all the Usual Suspects on CP are out of their minds bc Conny didn’t do something LAST season for “reasons” that make sense only to them.

I’m prepared to judge based on results, not fantasy. My assumption is that the GM and the player are FAR better poised to decide what works…or doesn’t…for themselves. So far, the GM has done exactly what he said he would, to the extent possible. It won’t please Team Tank, but that’s not his stated intention either.

Prepare for more whinging! It could be a long summer.

Yes. Your assumption……

[Major Major]

I've got no serious issue with how the team or player is handling this. Although I would have moved Ras last off season or trade deadline 23. Even the Hanifin deal included the only unprotected 1st in a future draft that I can remember and I'd be happy with that for Andersson. I think he will be very valuable at the deadline though and I would be happy to take on the risk to get there at this point.

The actual worst case scenario for me though is Brock Boeser... no one wants you and no one wants us so let's want each other. That would be gross. Move on, get what you can. Keep the asset churn alive and don't fumble the ####ing bag with Coleman and kadri.

[Dienasty]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

Current scenario: all the Usual Suspects on CP are out of their minds bc Conny didn’t do something LAST season for “reasons” that make sense only to them.

I’m prepared to judge based on results, not fantasy. My assumption is that the GM and the player are FAR better poised to decide what works…or doesn’t…for themselves. So far, the GM has done exactly what he said he would, to the extent possible. It won’t please Team Tank, but that’s not his stated intention either.

Prepare for more whinging! It could be a long summer.

Go read the trade deadline thread. There were plenty of reasons stated. Now one of the reasons is coming to fruition see Royale post. On top of that this reason isn't revisionist as we saw it play out the year prior with Hanafin, and before that with Jarome (although if anyone earned the right to choose his spot it was him).

Two playoff runs on an inexpensive contract is much greater than 1. Overall happy with Conroy but holding Andersson was a mistake.

Conroy has been a elite drafter (which is the most important trait right now.)
He as been an average to below average trader
He has been a good ufa signer (which means basically stay out of that market)

Overall happy with him, but holding onto Andersson out of some sort of loyalty to the veterans was a mistake. His loyalty should be to Wolf, Parekh, Coronato and Zary.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

What .makes more sense...

1) tanking, then drafting top 3 picks, then building a cast of home grown supporting players around them.

Or

2) building a cast of home grown supporting players, then tanking and drafting top 3 picks?

Id suggest it doesn't matter. You build a supporting cast both prior to and immediately after drafting your franchise players. You need both supporting players and franchise players and you play the cards you've been given.

Just because the flames haven't drafted top-3 draft picks yet doesn't mean they won't.

In a different discussion someone mentioned Kane and Toews and I fought up the fact that when 21 year old Kane and 22 year old Toews won the cup, they had a ton of good mid 20s guys to support them - Keith, Seabrook, Sharp, Ladd, Versteeg, Brouwer, Byfuglien (plus some vets like Hossa and Campbell).