I don’t get all the clamouring to see Kadri moved right this instant. Sure, I get moving him in a couple years once his NMC goes to a modified NTC, but now? I don’t see what the big rush is. Apart from the “sell everyone to tank” opinion, which I’m not even going to entertain here.
Let’s put aside the fact that he doesn’t want to go and the team doesn’t want to move him and imagine we could easily move him now. What do we realistically expect to get back that’s significantly better than in a couple of years when we wouldn’t be handcuffed to sending him to his choice of team and nowhere else.
I personally doubt that the return we would get in 2 years’ time is way worse off than now. The cap will have gone up and I doubt Kadri’s play will have significantly declined in a couple of years, so his worth likely won’t go down significantly either. Add to that his deal - which is slowly starting to become excellent value due to the rising cap and going rate for players of his ilk - is only going to become better value as the cap rises.
Plus he is going to play a huge mentorship and leadership role for our young players who get to learn from a real gamer. I just don’t see the massively increased value in moving him now vs. in a couple of years.
I don’t get all the clamouring to see Kadri moved right this instant. Sure, I get moving him in a couple years once his NMC goes to a modified NTC, but now? I don’t see what the big rush is. Apart from the “sell everyone to tank” opinion, which I’m not even going to entertain here.
Let’s put aside the fact that he doesn’t want to go and the team doesn’t want to move him and imagine we could easily move him now. What do we realistically expect to get back that’s significantly better than in a couple of years when we wouldn’t be handcuffed to sending him to his choice of team and nowhere else.
I personally doubt that the return we would get in 2 years’ time is way worse off than now. The cap will have gone up and I doubt Kadri’s play will have significantly declined in a couple of years, so his worth likely won’t go down significantly either. Add to that his deal - which is slowly starting to become excellent value due to the rising cap and going rate for players of his ilk - is only going to become better value as the cap rises.
Plus he is going to play a huge mentorship and leadership role for our young players who get to learn from a real gamer. I just don’t see the massively increased value in moving him now vs. in a couple of years.
Trading Kadri, even for a subpar return (which I don’t think would happen), improves the value of Calgary’s 1st rounder. That’s why you do it now.
Flames have to maximize their draft value.
Flames minus Kadri and Andersson are a bottom-5 team (I think they may be even with them).
The fans gameplan doesn't appear to line up with the teams game plan. I sense a disturbance in the force, it's as if hundreds of fans screamed out in terror when the Flames end up picking 18th again next year.
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Rhett is 100% correct. You need special players to build a team that gives you an 8 year window. Drafting outside of the area of the draft that gives you those players isn't helpful. You might get some good players outside of that range, and a few misses as well .
And you aren't going to trade for those kinds of players. Never mind that teams almost never trade superstars (other than rentals), the Flames are probably on most NTCs.
It's fine if people don't want to root for a bottom feeding team for a few years. I get it, I prefer to see wins. But then buckle in the mushy middle lane for perpetuity... maybe make the playoffs one year, then barely miss for a couple of years, then peak when you actually win a round, and start all over.
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98% certainty Andersson is gone.
90% certainty Vladar is gone
85% certainty both Rooney and Hanley don’t return
30% chance Coleman moves via trade
30% chance Pospisil is moved via trade
0% chance Wolf is moved
I’d put RFA offer sheet at about <35%
Big name UFA at <10% chance
100% chance Calgary wants additional 1st round picks in next 3 draft
50% chance they trade up/down at this point - volatile after 3rd pick
98% chance we see Huska extended before season starts
90% chance we see Parekh up with the big club for the whole season
90% chance Klapka with the big club full time
Small sample size of course but this is what I’ve heard.
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Honest question, What does Toronto have that fits your definition of a ‘premium’?
Nothing. They have nothing. Just a bunch of tertiary assets.itd definitely be Phaneuf 2.0 where the Flames may get lucky and find a Stajan but I don't see a Stajan level player in Toronto's depth .
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Nothing. They have nothing. Just a bunch of tertiary assets.itd definitely be Phaneuf 2.0 where the Flames may get lucky and find a Stajan but I don't see a Stajan level player in Toronto's depth .
That’s how I see it.
It sounds unlikely the Flames would trade Kadri anyway
Trading Kadri, even for a subpar return (which I don’t think would happen), improves the value of Calgary’s 1st rounder. That’s why you do it now.
Flames have to maximize their draft value.
Flames minus Kadri and Andersson are a bottom-5 team (I think they may be even with them).
I get the general sentiment that the Flames need to maximize our draft pick but I don’t agree that you do it by treading Kadri. It’s penny smart but dollar foolish and the reason why I said I wasn’t even going to entertain that line of thought, because IMO that potentially does more damage than good in the long run.
Calgary’s already not the most desirable destination for players to want to come play for, so you’d be taking a big gamble trading away a good player who actually wants to be here. It sends the wrong message to everyone and I think it actually hurts your position to attract talent here, which you’re eventually going to need to be able to do. I think you trade others if your goal is to weaken the team and still keep Kadri (for now) for all the benefits I listed above.
Now sure, if you trade Kadri and fully bottom out and get McKenna or a true franchise center out of it, then sure, it worked out and that player will help attract talent here. But that’s an awful big gamble to take and the potential downsides (and higher likelihood of them occurring) outweigh the benefits.
I’m not necessarily against the idea of making moves to try to actively have a bad season to get McKenna, but I think you do it by offloading Raz and Coleman and maybe a few others. Not Kadri.
That video is absolutely right. More tearing is needed. Rasmus gone. Coleman at the deadline. Maybe that opens up Kadri seeing the team tearing it down.
I get the general sentiment that the Flames need to maximize our draft pick but I don’t agree that you do it by treading Kadri. It’s penny smart but dollar foolish and the reason why I said I wasn’t even going to entertain that line of thought, because IMO that potentially does more damage than good in the long run.
Calgary’s already not the most desirable destination for players to want to come play for, so you’d be taking a big gamble trading away a good player who actually wants to be here. It sends the wrong message to everyone and I think it actually hurts your position to attract talent here, which you’re eventually going to need to be able to do. I think you trade others if your goal is to weaken the team and still keep Kadri (for now) for all the benefits I listed above.
Now sure, if you trade Kadri and fully bottom out and get McKenna or a true franchise center out of it, then sure, it worked out and that player will help attract talent here. But that’s an awful big gamble to take and the potential downsides (and higher likelihood of them occurring) outweigh the benefits.
I’m not necessarily against the idea of making moves to try to actively have a bad season to get McKenna, but I think you do it by offloading Raz and Coleman and maybe a few others. Not Kadri.
In the short term, you’re right. We may be less likely attract good players. But you get a good young stud team on the way up, who is winning and that all changes. Good players want to play with good players. Edmonton has proved that. They were a bad destination for many years, then they got McDavid.
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Honest question, What does Toronto have that fits your definition of a ‘premium’?
Yeah I dunno.
Depth picks + Reilly so we can flip Reilly?
I hope Treliving continues on with his stupidity on that defecit spending front.
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Originally Posted by Iniggywetrust
In the short term, you’re right. We may be less likely attract good players. But you get a good young stud team on the way up, who is winning and that all changes. Good players want to play with good players. Edmonton has proved that. They were a bad destination for many years, then they got McDavid.
This is how you get good players. Also the notion that you need good veteran to help teach kidsa how to win...you have to get the kids that have the skill to win first, then worry about surrounding them. If you do one before the other, you never get the kids you need.
Hague plays on the 3rd pairing in Vegas because they’re have one of the deepest blue-lines in the league. And he’s only available because they’re in win now mode and like to save their cap space to land whales. He’s a big, battle-tested, shut-down 2nd pairing LD. He’s Bahl with more bite in his game. I don’t know if the Flames will wind up with him, but he’s going to get paid wherever he does.
Hague is a top 4 D on the Flames zero question about that.
The worst part of the offseason is team tank's neverending bitching about the team not being the worst in the league and not blowing it up. Over and over...
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Originally Posted by dissentowner
The worst part of the offseason is team tank's neverending bitching about the team not being the worst in the league and not blowing it up. Over and over...
Yep
We need to trade everyone, starting with Wolf and Parekh for nothing so we can suck enough so we can draft players who might turn out to be really good……..
Maybe Kadri doesn’t want to go anywhere because he knows his buddy Makar is coming here in 2 years to play for his hometown team and open the new barn?
That could easily become one of f the worst trades of all time
Not really sure how, getting an offensive young forward, a solid RD you can move for further prospects, and 1st. Knies is a prospect you could couple with another pick to get a really high end young player.
