Ongoing General Automotive Thread 2.0

[Fuzz]

If you have space to stand a trailer up against a garage or something, that's also a good alternative to a truck for a lot of uses.


And bike racks were mentioned, when my dad does bike trips he takes his utility trailer and can get 6 on it. Just an alternative to consider vs an overloaded hitch mount. Plus you can load the trailer with other gear.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by woob

Does anyone have any experience with one of those aftermarket CarPlay self contained screens? I'm looking to understand how connections work. So in my mind, I would connect to the CarPlay unit via a USB-C cable with my phone, and then the CarPlay unit would connect to my vehicle Infotainment system with Bluetooth, which means it would use my in-vehicle microphone?

Also, if I'm listening to the radio currently and a call comes in, it brings up the phone mode on my Infotainment system so I can answer the call. Would this be the same with with CarPlay unit, in that it's intellgent enough to pass on that a call is coming in and would override the radio and pop me back to CarPlay mode? Or am I expecting too much?

Part of me is wondering if I'd have to be on the Bluetooth (media) setting on my Infotainment unit for calls, so if one came in while I was on radio, I'd have to switch to Bluetooth to answer.

CarPlay can be wired or wireless with a lot of those systems. Some of them are designed properly to allow you to decide whether your rely on vehicle Bluetooth or CarPlay streaming and an AUX plug, but you won't know unless someone who has bought the specific one you are purchasing has done it and reviews it.

Usually you get two choices:

CarPlay audio
- Phone connects to the CarPlay unit for Bluetooth, meaning both calls and music are sent to that unit. Audio output is handled using AUX (or very rarely, CarPlay unit can connect to vehicle Bluetooth for audio output only). CarPlay unit has a built-in mic.
- Phone does NOT join vehicle Bluetooth at all.

Pros: Navigation voice typically sounds better, since Bluetooth > AUX is higher quality than HFP (hands-free profile) which is sometimes used by phones to differentiate between music and navigation voice. Also applies to what you hear when taking a phone call.
Cons: AUX audio quality is usually ends up being inferior to Bluetooth for music streaming (doesn't apply if unit can use a Bluetooth A2DP connection for its audio). In-built microphone quality is not guaranteed. AUX won't allow using vehicle steering wheel controls for track switching.


Vehicle audio
- Phone connects to the CarPlay unit exclusively for CarPlay visual / control elements only.
- Phone connects to the vehicle Bluetooth for music and phone (using HFP).

Pros: Switching tracks with vehicle steering wheel controls is possible. Music audio quality will be superior since the amp in the vehicle handles all the processing which will be better than what exists in the CarPlay unit. Vehicle hands-free mic is used. CarPlay can still control the phone and switch tracks too.
Cons: Though this is sometimes configurable by app/platform, usually in this configuration the navigation voice will use HFP which means your song will get interrupted fully as the vehicle invokes the hands-free phone mode (which has a short delay). The resulting navigation voice will be of the same quality as though it came over a phone call, which is to say it sounds like crap comparatively even to a real phone call as the navigation voice isn't optimized for telephony codecs (think of the awful 'hold music over a cell phone' sound).

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

Your wallet is better off with a car and renting a truck for a day or two when you need one.

So there's one scenario that requires it... and most truck owners don't pull trailers. You can tell by the lack of marking in the hitch receivers from any sort of actual use.

Yeah, I know tons of truck-driving desk jockeys who get called out to drive through a bog so they can prepare their Excel spreadsheets.

I'll agree with this. Just have to pick your spots is all.

No, sorry, it's ######ed to think a guy with a truck only needs it one or two days a year. That guy is not buying a truck.

People with trucks doing truck stuff don't advertise to friends and acquaintances when they're using their truck for its truckiness. They just do it and carry on with their day/week/month.

I mean, maybe you guys know all these weirdos who own trucks and don't do truck stuff, but I'm not buying it. I'm 48 and know plenty of people. I know a grand total of zero people who have a truck and don't use it for doing truck things.

I will say I know people who should have a truck, but don't, and then their cars are a disgusting mess because they're putting things on upholstery that belong in the bed of a pick-up.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Table 5

FYI that’s not a Trabant, that’s a Polski Fiat.

I will always have a soft spot for the commie cars, but there’s a reason they were a joke.

Again...this is the difference between 'Car People' and 'Not Car People.'

Those old commie cars? They were largely garbage. But they had character! They'll break down constantly but you can fix them with debris from the side of the road.

You're like a team! You and the car. Fighting towards a finish line together! Its not an 'item' its your brother!

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

If you have space to stand a trailer up against a garage or something, that's also a good alternative to a truck for a lot of uses.

The foldable trailers are kind of neat (but rattle a lot when not loaded):

https://apogeetrailers.com

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Having the option to buy things because you want them, not just because you need them, is one of the best part of living in a capitalist society. That whole "each according to need" BS is what leads to everyone driving a Trabant.

I don't think either extreme is great.

There's an element of "your liberty to swing your fist ends just where my nose begins" here too.

People choosing monstrous vehicles with poor visibility is infringing on other people's rights. This includes the right to pay less tax (road wear, road size increases) and the right to live which is taking a hit because of this trend:

[Table 5]

My comment was a bit tongue in cheek, so I don't necessarily disagree with you...although if we ARE picking extremes, I know which side I'm on (freeeeedom!).

Couple of items, looking at your chart:

• They had plenty of big old boats in 2000s too, when fatalities were trending down.

• I would say that these days that screen distractions are much more of an issue than the giant cars/trucks. Looking at that chart from 2009-2018, I would bet that would correlate fairly well to the general trend of jamming giant screens and apps into every new car, beltlines getting higher, and all the nannies and cameras conditioning people to pay less attention.

I'm not saying size isn't an issue, but I think if you want to focus on safety, start with removing the giant tablets and tech distractions in every car. Then add more windows, a manual transmission, and a general sense of danger.

[PepsiFree]

The “people that own trucks don’t need them!” thing is so lame. Like sure, some people don’t. Some people need them only sometimes. And some people make good use of them regularly. But like… we’re talking about a utility feature.

You want to get bent out of shape over people driving things they don’t need, focus on people driving overpriced Land Rovers and Mercedes that have no objective, meaningful advantage over a similar style vehicle half to 1/3 the price, or focus on the sudden trend of turning SUVs into all out busses (Yukon, Escalade, etc).

[Brendone]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

So there's one scenario that requires it... and most truck owners don't pull trailers. You can tell by the lack of marking in the hitch receivers from any sort of actual use.

Judge me by my receiver do you? Pristine it is. Plate on my 5th wheel hitch, not so much.

[Bill Bumface]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Then add more windows

Totally agree with the tablet/phone comments as well.

Yes there were boats in the 2000s, but they were not quite as bad as what we have now, and more importantly they were much less common. In 2000, US car sales and light truck sales were about 50/50. It's now 70/30 trucks.

The window part you mention is a big aspect that has changed too. As vehicle heights have grown, so have belt lines to protect passengers when the newest, biggest thing rams into them. Windows are tiny and visibility is terrible now.

Look how much lower the windows went on a 2006 Expedition compared to a current model:

Spoiler!

The approach to safety is that success is keeping the person in the vehicle alive. There is no consideration to what happens outside the vehicle.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I know a grand total of zero people who have a truck and don't use it for doing truck things.

Really? Exact opposite for me. Almost all the people I know that drive full size pickup trucks haul less around than I do in my Civic. The only time my brother uses his bed is when hes taking bottles and cans to the depot. I'm surprised you are even arguing this considering Calgary is the land of pristine pickup truck beds. I've always been on board with all full size trucks having a luxury tax applied if not used for business reasons.

[Ryan Coke]

Originally Posted by Bill Bumface

That just looks like a chart of smart phone adoption from 2009, I doubt that says much about vehicle size at all. And Im not a “truck guy”. But it looks like the safety gains for many years leading up to 2009 have been completely decimated by distracted driving.

The more curious part of that chart is the dip between 2005 and 2011….like why it dropped and returned to the same level in only 6 years.

[bossy22]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

If you have space to stand a trailer up against a garage or something, that's also a good alternative to a truck for a lot of uses.


And bike racks were mentioned, when my dad does bike trips he takes his utility trailer and can get 6 on it. Just an alternative to consider vs an overloaded hitch mount. Plus you can load the trailer with other gear.

I saw this in Denmark. No trucks, but people pulling trailers when they need to haul stuff. It's brilliant. You get to drive something fun, and when you need that go buy that couch, you just take your trailer with you. It's what made me decide to get rid of my truck. I used the box to haul bikes and get mulch once a year. Maybe get other gardening items, but for the most part, aside from bikes, the box only got used maybe 4 times a year for different things. I bought a wagon and got a trailer hitch for it.

[Fuzz]

Ya, and if society shifted just a little, you wouldn't need to even own a trailer. You'd just be able to rent one from Home Depot, or the Brick, or the garden centre. Order online, have the trailer loaded and ready to go when you arrive for pickup.


The only flaw here is that people are involved, and their ability to drive without a trailer is limited enough, so this could just be a disaster before we have autonomous cars. And by that point, we'd have autonomous deliveries making it pointless to DIY.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

You want to get bent out of shape over people driving things they don’t need, focus on people driving overpriced Land Rovers and Mercedes that have no objective, meaningful advantage over a similar style vehicle half to 1/3 the price, or focus on the sudden trend of turning SUVs into all out busses (Yukon, Escalade, etc).

You’re talking about buying a luxury brand over a non-luxury brand, which doesn’t impact usability. I think we all know people buy them out of want — not need — and they’d be the first to admit that they could have gotten a similarly-sized vehicle for a third of the price, but it simply wouldn’t be as nice inside, wouldn’t drive as nicely or ride as quietly, etc.

The truck discussion is one aimed at form factor, which is directly tied to usability and particularity in-town usability where some of them can’t even fit in parking garages, and fitting them in a parking space is seemingly impossible for their owners (or at the very least makes the space beside them unusable). Although I also agree that the North American brands making their full-size SUVs as big as primary schools on wheels are an awful trend. I think the same applies to vehicles on the whole, but it is especially bad with the Big 3’s trucks and GM and Ford’s SUVs.

[woob]

I do find it crazy that the new GMC Canyon hood height and bed height seem to be slightly taller than my 2016 GMC Sierra. Not sure if the one I was next to in traffic was an AT4 model but that’s just wild.

[Fuzz]

Ya, even the mid size are so tall now. Do people not consider it a truck if they don't need to climb up into it, and the bed height is at their chin? So dumb.

[kevman]

The high hood thing isn't just a truck problem though, it's plaguing all modern vehicles. High belt lines, tiny windows and squared off hoods make visibility terrible across all form factors.

[I-Hate-Hulse]

Just a reminder - the annual Calgary Auto and Truck show is on now right now and runs through the weekend:

https://www.autoshowcalgary.com

It's a lot smaller than it used to be, but still a great way to kick tires.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

You’re talking about buying a luxury brand over a non-luxury brand, which doesn’t impact usability. I think we all know people buy them out of want — not need — and they’d be the first to admit that they could have gotten a similarly-sized vehicle for a third of the price, but it simply wouldn’t be as nice inside, wouldn’t drive as nicely or ride as quietly, etc.

The truck discussion is one aimed at form factor, which is directly tied to usability and particularity in-town usability where some of them can’t even fit in parking garages, and fitting them in a parking space is seemingly impossible for their owners (or at the very least makes the space beside them unusable). Although I also agree that the North American brands making their full-size SUVs as big as primary schools on wheels are an awful trend. I think the same applies to vehicles on the whole, but it is especially bad with the Big 3’s trucks and GM and Ford’s SUVs.

I’m aware, I was specifically addressing the “they don’t need it” objection. There are specific brands/models people literally never need more than a cheaper, more sensible choice, so you can just throw the entire point out the window.

It’s also not like people have much choice about form factor. Nobody is saying “I’m only buying an F-150 if they increase the size another 20%” it’s just that companies make them and people buy them, but people would buy them regardless.