American Politics 4.0 - Orangeyou Glad He’s Back?

[Dion]

The energy 'nuclear' option

One of the most valuable assets in Canada's arsenal is energy.
North-eastern US states like Vermont, New York and Maine significantly rely on electricity sold to them by neighbouring Canadian provinces. British Columbia and Manitoba also supply energy to western and Midwestern regions of the US.

About 30 states receive some of their electricity from Canada, according to Canadian government data.

Canada is also the top supplier of crude oil to the US, making up 60% of total oil imports, according to the US Energy Information Administration.

Doug Ford, Ontario's premier, has suggested that Canada cut off Americans' supply to pinch Americans at the petrol pump.

The only thing that would really sting in the immediate to short-term is if energy prices went up, because Trump himself campaigned on bringing energy prices down very quickly

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c93qnk92174o

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Flabbibulin

I thought it was 10% “less” on O&G, so presumably 15%?

Seems like Trump thinks they can develop a strategy to offset the effect of this, ie find more barrels in their own internal sources, by feb 18? Or does it just take that long to develop a mechanism to charge the tariff?

Apparently, his special envoy met with Maduro today. Obviously doing something in two weeks seems unlikely, but I wouldn’t consider that a good sign if things go further there.

[blender]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Is Redwoods golf course more important than the Canadian economy?

Is local / regional indigenous group more important?

No?

Canada’s trade surplus with the US is ENTIRELY covered by oil and gas. It’s by a long shot in first place and the biggest piece they fear retaliation of, because their refineries need it. Therefore- it really is basically our biggest piece of leverage.

So if tariffs are to stay Canada has to, if we want an economy or economic future. Notice how Trump said this is the level of tariffs “for now”. Aka could go up. The States can absolutely crush Canada if we don’t find other customers for our oil and gas. We need pipeline capacity.

So, I’m sorry, this is what I would consider an economic emergency and NIMBYs concerns need to be shelved and basically ignored unless you want to become an American in a few years. That’s the strategy. Make our economy crushed until we capitulate to join them.

So I guess pick your poison. Emergency act measures to build pipeline capacity or become American in a few years because that’s how I view this thing headed. We need leverage.


NIMBY concerns are not relevant at all. Like whatsoever.

If you call it Nimbyism, it's easy to be dismissive. If you call it careful consideration of our natural environment and respect for indigenous rights it's actually good policy and governance.

Declaring an emergency to bypass due process and panic building a bunch of infrastructure is not the correct way forward. In fact, it sounds like exactly how Trump's crew would do it. As has been mentioned, the infrastructure wouldn't be available for purpose for years anyway.

Don't get me wrong; I'm a pragmatist, so I can support
building out a better energy infrastructure to support a
national energy policy, but it would need to be done responsibly.

[ripTDR]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Is Redwoods golf course more important than the Canadian economy?

Is local / regional indigenous group more important?

No?

Canada’s trade surplus with the US is ENTIRELY covered by oil and gas. It’s by a long shot in first place and the biggest piece they fear retaliation of, because their refineries need it. Therefore- it really is basically our biggest piece of leverage.

So if tariffs are to stay Canada has to, if we want an economy or economic future. Notice how Trump said this is the level of tariffs “for now”. Aka could go up. The States can absolutely crush Canada if we don’t find other customers for our oil and gas. We need pipeline capacity.

So, I’m sorry, this is what I would consider an economic emergency and NIMBYs concerns need to be shelved and basically ignored unless you want to become an American in a few years. That’s the strategy. Make our economy crushed until we capitulate to join them.

So I guess pick your poison. Emergency act measures to build pipeline capacity or become American in a few years because that’s how I view this thing headed. We need leverage.


NIMBY concerns are not relevant at all. Like whatsoever.

Have we asked how they feel? They are the gatekeepers for most of what is proposed. We talk about how we should do this and that quickly but it ain't gonna happen cause of things

[blender]

Originally Posted by ripTDR

Have we asked how they feel? They are the gatekeepers for most of what is proposed. We talk about how we should do this and that quickly but it ain't gonna happen cause of things

Anyone who has a clue or makes policy in this country is engaging with indigenous groups.
Wingnuts on the internet are spouting off about acting without their participation.

[afc wimbledon]

The great thing about Trump and the MAGA's is they are all dumb as rocks, you don't have to build anything, you just have to say your building it, sign a deal with the EU to ship everything we have to Europe, dig a few holes in the ground, we live in an age of performative bull#### counting as reality

[ripTDR]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

The great thing about Trump and the MAGA's is they are all dumb as rocks, you don't have to build anything, you just have to say your building it, sign a deal with the EU to ship everything we have to Europe, dig a few holes in the ground, we live in an age of performative bull#### counting as reality

Dunno, I guess that's supposed to make us feel better?

[chummer]

Originally Posted by scotty2hotty

When do the Boos start during the American national anthem? You know that’s coming soon if this escalates.

I could absolutely see that happening in Canadian rinks.

Of course the Americans will reciprocate. This could get ugly real fast, ####ing Trump.

[Bunk]

One of the lowest of low hanging fruits would be to (along with the EU hopefully) ban twitter as a propaganda tool of a hostile foreign government. A platform owned by a senior government official attacking the country.

There are plenty of other platforms.

[blender]

Originally Posted by Bunk

One of the lowest of low hanging fruits would be to (along with the EU hopefully) ban twitter as a propaganda tool of a hostile foreign government. A platform owned by a senior government official attacking the country.

There are plenty of other platforms.

A good start for sure.

[mogg]

Don’t worry everyone he’s going to fix the fires by moving all the water:

https://sjvwater.org/trumps-emergenc...-county-lakes/

Indeed, President Trump boasted about the releases on his X page Friday posting a photo of a river and writing: “Photo of beautiful water flow that I just opened in California. Today, 1.6 billion gallons and, in 3 days, it will be 5.2 billion gallons. Everybody should be happy about this long fought Victory! I only wish they listened to me six years ago – There would have been no fire!”

Tulare County water managers were perplexed and frustrated, noting both physical and legal barriers that make it virtually impossible for Tulare County river water to be used for southern California fires.

…

It was no game on Thursday when area water managers were given about an hour’s notice that the Army Corps planned to release water up to “channel capacity,” the top amount rivers can handle, immediately.

The Army Corps later agreed to more measured releases, alleviating a mad scramble to alert first responders and have crews on standby in case river banks were breached and levees overtopped, as happened during the 2023 floods.

It was being held for farmers.

[puffnstuff]

Originally Posted by Looch City

So I happened upon a WH press secretary video on the news.

Is this a joke? Is she a joke?

Are we all living in one big giant joke?

You mean this person?

When asked about the tariff war between Canada and the United States after#the prime minister of Canada said he would consider#cutting off electricity to America if#Donald Trump#continues to impose tariffs, she referenced Jesus Christ.
"They want you to panic, but President Trump wants you to remember Jesus didn’t have electricity either and he did just fine," Leavitt said.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by blender

If you call it Nimbyism, it's easy to be dismissive. If you call it careful consideration of our natural environment and respect for indigenous rights it's actually good policy and governance.

Declaring an emergency to bypass due process and panic building a bunch of infrastructure is not the correct way forward. In fact, it sounds like exactly how Trump's crew would do it. As has been mentioned, the infrastructure wouldn't be available for purpose for years anyway.

Don't get me wrong; I'm a pragmatist, so I can support
building out a better energy infrastructure to support a
national energy policy, but it would need to be done responsibly.

We disagree, all good. Nobody who wants this country to have an economic future for their kids or future generations is a “wingnut”. The pendulum has swung too far to favour environmentalists and indigenous groups because guess what? We don’t need to consult them because I’ll tell you what they say- they don’t want it. They strongly oppose it. They will not have pipelines. So what, the 40 million Canadians get ####ed because of the desires of a few?

Moreover, personally I think this is a super critical juncture in this nation’s history. I believe our sovereignty is at stake. The US strategy here is to crush us economically and then come in and say hey, join us, and you won’t have economic pain. In that context, how do indigenous think it’s going to be after being taken over by the USA? Will the billions in reconciliation transferred to Canadian First Nations continue with a country that has no economy or worse doesn’t even exist? Hell, the FN groups should be begging for this to be built.

Honestly, the ones who sound like wingnuts are the ones still thinking that Canadian environmental and oil and gas regulatory frameworks that got us into this disaster are the perfect recipe to get us out of it. Yeah let’s go poll people who hate pipelines to see if they’ll let us have an economic future.

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by mogg

Don’t worry everyone he’s going to fix the fires by moving all the water:


It was being held for farmers.

[Fuzz]

Exclusive: Musk aides lock government workers out of computer systems at US agency, sources say

The two officials, who spoke to Reuters on condition of anonymity for fear of retaliation, said some senior career employees at OPM have had their access revoked to some of the department's data systems.

The systems include a vast database called Enterprise Human Resources Integration, which contains dates of birth, Social Security numbers, appraisals, home addresses, pay grades and length of service of government workers, the officials said.

"We have no visibility into what they are doing with the computer and data systems," one of the officials said. "That is creating great concern. There is no oversight. It creates real cybersecurity and hacking implications."

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/mus...ay-2025-01-31/


This seems like maybe someone didn't follow procedure.

[WideReceiver]

Originally Posted by Dion

Trump said she was a "10"

Maybe her IQ? It’s at least a 30.

[WideReceiver]

Originally Posted by Bunk

One of the lowest of low hanging fruits would be to (along with the EU hopefully) ban twitter as a propaganda tool of a hostile foreign government. A platform owned by a senior government official attacking the country.

There are plenty of other platforms.

I use Twitter but I support this idea.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

That WH press secretary is a real piece of work.

So smug, so brainwashed. Perfect little soldier peddling that propaganda for his exaltedness.

[mogg]

I guess it just squeaks me out that so much of our food comes from this increasingly unstable region.

[blender]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

We disagree, all good. Nobody who wants this country to have an economic future for their kids or future generations is a “wingnut”. The pendulum has swung too far to favour environmentalists and indigenous groups because guess what? We don’t need to consult them because I’ll tell you what they say- they don’t want it. They strongly oppose it. They will not have pipelines. So what, the 40 million Canadians get ####ed because of the desires of a few?

Moreover, personally I think this is a super critical juncture in this nation’s history. I believe our sovereignty is at stake. The US strategy here is to crush us economically and then come in and say hey, join us, and you won’t have economic pain. In that context, how do indigenous think it’s going to be after being taken over by the USA? Will the billions in reconciliation transferred to Canadian First Nations continue with a country that has no economy or worse doesn’t even exist? Hell, the FN groups should be begging for this to be built.

Honestly, the ones who sound like wingnuts are the ones still thinking that Canadian environmental and oil and gas regulatory frameworks that got us into this disaster are the perfect recipe to get us out of it. Yeah let’s go poll people who hate pipelines to see if they’ll let us have an economic future.

I don't think you are a wingnut, but you do sound like one.

You make it an all or nothing binary argument. Not all indigenous groups are against pipelines. Some support them and support has started popping up since the orange administration.

You have an opinion about about how this scenario will play out. You may be correct, but most likely you will be wrong. Either way, one man's opinion is no reason to act irresponsibly.
Some people who support pipelines are against them in certain places. I have a close friend who is a CEO of a large pipeline corporation. He would disagree with you even though his business is to move oil and he wants to see a more pipeline-friendly regime in this country. He just also happens to have respect for the natural environment and the rights and traditions of the people who were here first. Its about building concensus and finding solutions to problems, not just dropping the hammer and forcing people to accept things they don't want, even if they are wrong. That's what got us in this mess in the first place.

Honestly, you've been making this same argument for years; it's not really a Trump thing for you.

And to be clear, I get it. I understand what you are saying, and why you are saying it. Like you said, we disagree, but I feel that you are wrong in the way you would have your ideas implemented moreso than the ideas themselves.