[PGT] Vegas 3, Flames roll craps

[Enoch Root]

Would love to see the full stats - how many chances have they had, compared to other teams? And total minutes of course

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by NewFan

I think Kuzmenko and Sharangovich type players need a special roles to reach their potential. In other word, they will play better with certain types of players which they can use their strength. Unfortunately most coaches don't want or don't know how to use them properly. I think Huska is one of those coaches.

This sort of ignores Sharangovich's entire season last year and Kuzmenko's 2nd half with the Flames.

What's more likely IMO is Sharangovich is off from his injury / not fully recovered and Kuzmenko is who he's always been.

[Goriders]

Getting an injury in training camp and falling behind everyone else is typically a big deal. I remember mangiapane having a similar problem when he was injured in TC

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

The tweet doesn't say what the range is for other teams. A 5-on-3 rarely lasts the full two minutes, since it's usually the result of taking a second penalty while a team is already shorthanded. If the length is randomly distributed from zero to two minutes, it should average about a minute, and if the old stat I read is still roughly true, a team should expect to score about 25% of the time in 60 seconds of 5-on-3. So yes, 19% is bad, but context is needed to see just how bad.

100%. But the context that we DO have is that the Flames have the worst percentage.

Considering that it is 15 years of data, I would assume that the average time per 5 on 3 is largely evened out for all teams. Until we see the data we don't know, but the baseline assumption would be that all teams would be pretty close for time per PP opportunity.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Funny how people are crapping on Kuzmenko

He’s missed the last 5, coming off a lower body injury. He gets 4th line duty then mid game bumped to 3rd line. No time on the PP (which probably could use skill like he has), and gets less than 10 minutes.

He accomplished as much as the entire team offensively, although he did feed Zary for the one good chance they had. He didn’t cost them in any way

Sure he has struggled this year, but simply being dressed isn’t exactly being put in a position to dazzle

I am not sure what everyone expected from him because the whole team had nothing going. He got very little time, didn’t cost them, and didn’t stand out much in a bad or good way

People are funny

For me the frustration wasn’t just last night’s game. It was the whole season. Guess I had higher hopes for him based on the end of last season

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Would love to see the full stats - how many chances have they had, compared to other teams? And total minutes of course

All of this is easily accessible on the NHL stats page (sort for team stats, power play time, season range from 2009-10, and sum results). No print articles needed.

Since 2009-10, the best 5-3 team is ~36% and the worst is ~19%, the best 4-3 is ~30% and the worst is ~12%, and the best 5-4 is ~21% and the worst is ~16%. Obviously, most teams fall within these numbers over the last decade, and while there are outliers at the top and bottom every year, it kind of gives you a range. But you can look it up and dig deeper into any numbers there.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Funny how people are crapping on Kuzmenko

He’s missed the last 5, coming off a lower body injury. He gets 4th line duty then mid game bumped to 3rd line. No time on the PP (which probably could use skill like he has), and gets less than 10 minutes.

He accomplished as much as the entire team offensively, although he did feed Zary for the one good chance they had. He didn’t cost them in any way

Sure he has struggled this year, but simply being dressed isn’t exactly being put in a position to dazzle

I am not sure what everyone expected from him because the whole team had nothing going. He got very little time, didn’t cost them, and didn’t stand out much in a bad or good way

People are funny

The heart of the issue is that the Flames (and the fans) are counting on Kuzmenko and Sharangovich to be key offensive players and the truth is that both are complimentary players at best. Unfortunately we do not have any key players so those two will continuely be put into a position where it is difficult to succeed.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by NewFan

I think Kuzmenko and Sharangovich type players need a special roles to reach their potential. In other word, they will play better with certain types of players which they can use their strength. Unfortunately most coaches don't want or don't know how to use them properly. I think Huska is one of those coaches.
Kuzmenko - Kadri - Pospisil will be as good as or better than Huberdeau - Kadri - Pospisil now.

Haha no. Why would that ever be the case?

BTW, Sharangovich had his best year last year. Who was his coach? Kuzmenko did better in 29 games with Calgary than in 43 games with Vancouver last year. Who was the Calgary coach?

[Shazam]

Over/under on if the Flames will score against VGK this season?

[NewFan]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

The heart of the issue is that the Flames (and the fans) are counting on Kuzmenko and Sharangovich to be key offensive players and the truth is that both are complimentary players at best. Unfortunately we do not have any key players so those two will continuely be put into a position where it is difficult to succeed.

Most players play better when they used in the proper position. Like Coleman with Kadri line - not the best, but with Backlund line - much better.

If Kuzmenko is healthy, I would put him with Kadri and Pospisil and he will have same point as Huberdeau in 5 on 5.
Reason - I want Kuzmenko add his points until the trade deadline.
Zary and Pelletier doesn't fit well with Sharky.
Klapka or may be Duehr/Hunt will help both Sharky and Zary.

[NewFan]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Haha no. Why would that ever be the case?

BTW, Sharangovich had his best year last year. Who was his coach? Kuzmenko did better in 29 games with Calgary than in 43 games with Vancouver last year. Who was the Calgary coach?

So Kuzmenko is playing in the same line and used same situation this year?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by NewFan

So Kuzmenko is playing in the same line and used same situation this year?

You suggested the coach was the issue. It's the same coach.

And no, he'd not get Huberdeau's points. Huberdeau has gone to the net a ton 5 on 5. Kuzmenko is a perimeter player.

[Karl]

And, most importantly, Kuzmenko isn't even half as talented as Huberdeau is. He just isn't.

Don't be fooled by Kuzmenko's 35 goal season with the Nucks. That was an outlier for him.

[Locke]

Eastern Europe is really letting down the team.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

One is a pending UFA who might be playing in Europe next season and the other just signed a contract extension and will be around a few years.

Gotta try getting the one sticking around going offensively and hope for the best.

edit: beaten to it

Don't disagree with the logic, I just think the leash is too long for what he's bringing. It hurts the output of the team when a guy that clearly isn't feeling it is eating the most PP time. Reward someone who is showing some jam.

[getoverit]

Sharangovich was atleast noticeable. he is best utilized for his shot , one timer. Not once last night a pass was not shootable, behind, in his feet etc, he needs someone who can feed the puck..........

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Toonage

This sort of ignores Sharangovich's entire season last year and Kuzmenko's 2nd half with the Flames.

What's more likely IMO is Sharangovich is off from his injury / not fully recovered and Kuzmenko is who he's always been.

Sharangovich isn't some consistent 30 goal scorer though. He did it once in a year with a career high shooting percentage. He might only be a 20 goal scorer on average whose line generally gets outscored significantly at even strength.

I would definitely think he is better than he has shown this season. What has changed this year? Coming off injury and a big new multi year contract.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by Locke

Eastern Europe is really letting down the team.

The new whipping boy

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Sharangovich isn't some consistent 30 goal scorer though. He did it once in a year with a career high shooting percentage. He might only be a 20 goal scorer on average whose line generally gets outscored significantly at even strength.

I would definitely think he is better than he has shown this season. What has changed this year? Coming off injury and a big new multi year contract.

I think the injury in TC really derailed him.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by NewFan

I think Kuzmenko and Sharangovich type players need a special roles to reach their potential. In other word, they will play better with certain types of players which they can use their strength. Unfortunately most coaches don't want or don't know how to use them properly. I think Huska is one of those coaches.
Kuzmenko - Kadri - Pospisil will be as good as or better than Huberdeau - Kadri - Pospisil now.

Kuzmenko-Kadri-Pospisil was the line where Kuzmenko had most of his success at 5v5 last season, so we do have samples of both these lines we can look at:

Huberdeau-Kadri-Pospisil: 208 minutes, 62% xGF, 12 GF , 9 GA

Kuzmenko-Kadri-Pospisil: 232 minutes, 53% xGF, 11 GF, 11 GA

So the Huberdeau version has been better and it would be a bit foolish to break up Huberdeau and Kadri right now based on how well they've been playing but if things dry up again then I do think there is a world where:

Kuzmenko-Kadri-Pospisil
Coleman - Backlund- Coronato
Huberdeau - Zary - Sharangovich
Pelletier - Rooney - Lomberg

Is a lineup worth looking at.