2024 Toronto Blue Jays Season Thread

[KelVarnsen]

Huh. Jays scoring runs in the first inning?

[KelVarnsen]

This team ####ing sucks

[The Fisher Account]

Trade everyone

[lazypucker]

The only interest I have for the Jays is to know which days they play at home so that I can get extra 10 cents off per litre of gas at Shell.

That's about it.

[Roof-Daddy]

The sell off will come.

The sooner, the better.

[flambers]

I fine with moving out a bunch of players....

However not with this GM,

[bluejays]

Originally Posted by browna

Vlad yes the Canadian angle, just seems for like the face of the franchise and would choose here.
Bo doesn’t seem like he would choose Toronto.

I’ve come up with this comment before, but an overpay for a fellow Dominican in Soto on an optioned filled long term deal which may end up being only 4 years, who at least seems has the door cracked for hitting the open market.

Next year for SP they would lose Kikuchi but still Berios Gausman and Bassit.

I dunno about Soto. At this point he's the type of player you add if you want to go for it for a prolonged period of time. At this point the Jays have to rebuild (not retool). The pipeline of prospects is looking mediocre. Shatkins' value proposition was to create a sustainable group, which they haven't done at all. So theoretically you add Soto and what about the rest of the lineup? In basketball you can do the top heavy thing and it'll work. In baseball you really need to have a full lineup along with pitching. It's a slower approach that requires patience. Atkins did pace the going for it, correctly. He just hasn't made the right moves to make it work, and hasn't drafted particularly well to sustain the constant dealings of prospects. The fail is on him. Anyway, I'm all for keeping Bo and Vlad but how do you recoup assets? Some pitcher trades may give some hope but you won't get the quantity/quality Vlad or Bo would bring you. With prospects it's a quantity game too. So all in all, we can blame coaches/players, etc. but the team assembled is truly bad. And a quick fix like a Soto or Ohtani won't fix it either. There's a quantity piece that needs to be solved long term through drafting, then add a big fish or two through signings.

[Samonadreau]

This team isn't a Soto away from being ultra competitive.

[DoubleK]

Anyone else going to the game tonight?

[browna]

Originally Posted by bluejays

I dunno about Soto. At this point he's the type of player you add if you want to go for it for a prolonged period of time. At this point the Jays have to rebuild (not retool). The pipeline of prospects is looking mediocre. Shatkins' value proposition was to create a sustainable group, which they haven't done at all. So theoretically you add Soto and what about the rest of the lineup? In basketball you can do the top heavy thing and it'll work. In baseball you really need to have a full lineup along with pitching. It's a slower approach that requires patience. Atkins did pace the going for it, correctly. He just hasn't made the right moves to make it work, and hasn't drafted particularly well to sustain the constant dealings of prospects. The fail is on him. Anyway, I'm all for keeping Bo and Vlad but how do you recoup assets? Some pitcher trades may give some hope but you won't get the quantity/quality Vlad or Bo would bring you. With prospects it's a quantity game too. So all in all, we can blame coaches/players, etc. but the team assembled is truly bad. And a quick fix like a Soto or Ohtani won't fix it either. There's a quantity piece that needs to be solved long term through drafting, then add a big fish or two through signings.

This is prefaced on the fact you trade Bo and get some good value out of him for an everyday player and picks and legit prospects and hope they hit.
Keep Vlad and sign Soto.

Adding a big fish still isn’t easy for Toronto, they can’t just do it when they want to, as it’s not up to their control more than any other team, even with the fact the Jays are right up there in MLB with how they take care of players and families in their facilities.

Soto seems to be buddies with Vlad, and again has said he’s basically in it for the money as opposed to team loyalty, so highest bidder wins…remains to be seen if it’s true but it seems but it’s more of a crack open of a door than other big time free agents give out as far as info, so in that sense it appears he is more available then many top FAs would be for the Toronto factor.

[bluejays]

Originally Posted by browna

This is prefaced on the fact you trade Bo and get some good value out of him for an everyday player and picks and legit prospects and hope they hit.
Keep Vlad and sign Soto.

Adding a big fish still isn’t easy for Toronto, they can’t just do it when they want to, as it’s not up to their control more than any other team, even with the fact the Jays are right up there in MLB with how they take care of players and families in their facilities.

Soto seems to be buddies with Vlad, and again has said he’s basically in it for the money as opposed to team loyalty, so highest bidder wins…remains to be seen if it’s true but it seems but it’s more of a crack open of a door than other big time free agents give out as far as info, so in that sense it appears he is more available then many top FAs would be for the Toronto factor.

I'm in no way arguing if they can or can't sign Soto. I'm saying that they shouldn't because there's a time and a place for that and they simply are far from contenders. So you're spending money on a top heavy lineup without drafting. So you're going to be in limbo with huge contracts on the books. If you're not a contender, is there really an expectation to push hard each night if you're a guy like Soto, or do you know you can get away with simply being better than average? I ask all these questions because it's a disaster when it comes to long term contracts (personally I don't believe any players should be getting that absurd money), more even more than that, certain moves need to be done to recoup prospects that aren't there which should be there. So perhaps this is all a blessing in disguise, to hit the reset button. If we had numerous prospects on the cusp of coming up, this would all be fine - buy a season or two and go for it again. But there really aren't any game changers expected soon, so you have to look to the future of 3-4 years, getting new young potential, drafting well, and hoping it all aligns again. One thing for sure is you just can't continually deal young guys for a quick push. Baseball continually shows us teams can age in a blink of an eye, and guys at their mid careers can just fall off. You trade enough prospects and suddenly your team looks old. It happened with AA's moves at the end, and it's showing even worse with Atkins' moves all this time. They really do have to create sustainability.

[KelVarnsen]

Clement is the new E5

[KelVarnsen]

What. A. ####ing. Catch.

[DoubleK]

Lots of Bluejays fans. Lots of empty seats

[DoubleK]

How was that safe?

[flamingred89]

Luis Castilla on the mound. Of course it's going to be a no hitter.

[KelVarnsen]

Turns game back on after COPA. Sees Bo GIDP. Sighs.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by bluejays

I'm in no way arguing if they can or can't sign Soto. I'm saying that they shouldn't because there's a time and a place for that and they simply are far from contenders. So you're spending money on a top heavy lineup without drafting. So you're going to be in limbo with huge contracts on the books. If you're not a contender, is there really an expectation to push hard each night if you're a guy like Soto, or do you know you can get away with simply being better than average? I ask all these questions because it's a disaster when it comes to long term contracts (personally I don't believe any players should be getting that absurd money), more even more than that, certain moves need to be done to recoup prospects that aren't there which should be there. So perhaps this is all a blessing in disguise, to hit the reset button. If we had numerous prospects on the cusp of coming up, this would all be fine - buy a season or two and go for it again. But there really aren't any game changers expected soon, so you have to look to the future of 3-4 years, getting new young potential, drafting well, and hoping it all aligns again. One thing for sure is you just can't continually deal young guys for a quick push. Baseball continually shows us teams can age in a blink of an eye, and guys at their mid careers can just fall off. You trade enough prospects and suddenly your team looks old. It happened with AA's moves at the end, and it's showing even worse with Atkins' moves all this time. They really do have to create sustainability.

What would you do instead though? Signing lower end free agents on 1 year deals doesn't get you much in terms of prospect value in trades. If they sell at the deadline how much do you think they get for KK?

If you can sign a guy like Soto I think you do it. You won't get the #1 guy to come to Canada very often, so whenever you can I think you should. This year they signed IKF, Turner, and KK for $31 MM. I'd rather have Soto, and 2 internal choices even if they're only so-so (eg Soto takes KK spot in the OF, put Barger at 3B and DH Horowitz) instead of IKF/Turner/KK. Maybe $31MM isn't enough for Soto, but I bet it's close, and that lineup probably wins more often and is more exciting to watch.

Obviously being able to promote quality prospects is key to any success, but I don't think sucking to draft high is that big a requirement for MLB. Take the Orioles - sure, Adley was a #1 pick but Gunnar Henderson was the second rounder, which means every MLB team passed on him at least once. Or Elly De La Cruz and his sub-$100k signing bonus.

[Inferno]

Stop putting in Pop.

[Samonadreau]

oh boy