[Trade] Markstrom (31.25% retained) traded to NJ for 2025 1st (top 10 protected) and Bahl

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by flamesgod

Why did you say get rid of? Boston is taking on 4 years of Korpisalo, with some retention by Ottawa, get a weaker prospect and a 1st. Flames clearly made out better then Boston did.

Yeah, if Calgary had had to absorb a contract, it’s closer. But they don’t. Every aspect of the trade is better.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

No idea, I just heard their offer was better than what we got. So maybe?

There is no way that Conroy turns down a better deal because of politics. No way.

I suspect that if TO's offer included a 1st, that it also included a cap dump (how else could TO bring on Markstrom?)

Will TOR fans think their offer is better? Of course - every fan base overvalues their own assets. But Conroy is taking the package he thinks is best for Markstrom. Every time. Edmonton excluded, of course.

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Conroy must like Bahl a lot, Toronto's offer included their 2024 1st.

I think I'd rather have NJ's 2025 (or potentially 2026). Bit more potential upside with those picks I wager. and I like the idea of spreading the premium picks out some (easier cap and roster management down the road)

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

There is no way that Conroy turns down a better deal because of politics. No way.

I suspect that if TO's offer included a 1st, that it also included a cap dump (how else could TO bring on Markstrom?)

Will TOR fans think their offer is better? Of course - every fan base overvalues their own assets. But Conroy is taking the package he thinks is best for Markstrom. Every time. Edmonton excluded, of course.

Yeah, I could see if the deals were equivalent then Conroy would go with New Jersey's over Toronto. Liljegren is probably the closest thing to Bahl and I don't mind the gamble that Jersey ends up being in the 15-20 range

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Bonded

Yeah, I could see if the deals were equivalent then Conroy would go with New Jersey's over Toronto. Liljegren is probably the closest thing to Bahl and I don't mind the gamble that Jersey ends up being in the 15-20 range

100% you take NJ's draft pick. They had a great year in 2022/23, but were a lottery team for the 4 years before that and finished below .500 this last year.

The Maple Leafs have been a top regular season team for 8 years running. The Maple Leafs 2025 pick is likely 25-30. That New Jersey pick is likely in the 15-25 range, but could be a top 10 pick.

[Enoch Root]

We don't know if Liljegren was offered. But let's assume he was for the sake of argument. Why would TOR include him? Because he is an RFA and may be wanting more money than he is worth. Does he get $3M? Would you rather have Liljegren at $3M or Bahl at $1M?

And again, any TOR deal has to include a cap dump.

[Icon]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

And again, any TOR deal has to include a cap dump.

Problem there is I'm not certain what the cap dump is from Toronto.

Safe to say it wouldn't have been any of their big names. After Matthews, Nylander, Tavares, Marner, Rielly, nobody else makes more than $2.4mil/yr.

None of these guys are really paid enough to make enough of a difference:
Kampf, 29yr old @ $2.4mil for 3 more seasons?
Jarnkrok, 32yr old @ $2.1mil for 2 more seasons?
Reaves, 37yr old @ $1.35mil for 2 more seasons?
McCabe, 30yr old @ $2.0mil for 1 more season?

I'm guessing the retain on Markstrom was likely 50% instead of 31.25% to make it work instead.

Markstrom (50% retained)
for
2024 1st (#23), Reaves?

Don't think I have any interest in that, would have had to have included another sweetener (Liljegren or a prospect or additional pick?)

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

There is no way that Conroy turns down a better deal because of politics. No way.

I suspect that if TO's offer included a 1st, that it also included a cap dump (how else could TO bring on Markstrom?)

Will TOR fans think their offer is better? Of course - every fan base overvalues their own assets. But Conroy is taking the package he thinks is best for Markstrom. Every time. Edmonton excluded, of course.

No cap dump from what I heard

[dissentowner]

Here is what they are saying in an Athletic article

1. The Leafs were runners-up for Flames netminder Jacob Markstrom last week, losing out to the New Jersey Devils despite having what some might consider a better package of assets on the table. At the very least, they were offering something comparable in a very real bid for the 34-year-old.

In that offer was Toronto’s first-round pick for the coming draft, which shows just how seriously Treliving was pursuing the upgrade in net. (Making trades with the Flames, however, remains complicated by Treliving’s abrupt exit from Calgary last spring.)

[blankall]

My guess is that it's also a major battle with ownership every time Conroy retains on any contract. So coming back to the owners with 31.25% vs 50% is a huge deal.

Also, can someone explain how the signing bonus works. Is the $2.5 owed in signing bonuses paid on July 1 or was it paid when Markstrom signed the contract? This could have been a major issue too, if other teams were not willing to make a deal before July 1.

[TheIronMaiden]

Gotta laugh at BT trying to give away a first rounder already.

[YyjFlames]

Originally Posted by blankall

100% you take NJ's draft pick. They had a great year in 2022/23, but were a lottery team for the 4 years before that and finished below .500 this last year.

The Maple Leafs have been a top regular season team for 8 years running. The Maple Leafs 2025 pick is likely 25-30. That New Jersey pick is likely in the 15-25 range, but could be a top 10 pick.

I doubt New Jersey's top 10 protected pick is valued higher than the Maple Leaf's pick this year at 23. At best, it's equal. A healthy New Jersey, with Markstrom, is likely top three in the east next year (New York, maybe Florida or Carolina ahead of them). They had REALLY bad injury luck last year and terrible goaltending.

In saying that, I'm glad Calgary dealt with New Jersey rather than Toronto. I don't want to see the Leafs make a deal with Calgary to address their biggest need.

[Flames Fan, Ph.D.]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Here is what they are saying in an Athletic article

Sorry, are you suggesting it was just the first in 24?

[Icon]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

Sorry, are you suggesting it was just the first in 24?

The athletic article mentions a "package" so I presume it was that pick and... something.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Icon

Problem there is I'm not certain what the cap dump is from Toronto.

Safe to say it wouldn't have been any of their big names. After Matthews, Nylander, Tavares, Marner, Rielly, nobody else makes more than $2.4mil/yr.

None of these guys are really paid enough to make enough of a difference:
Kampf, 29yr old @ $2.4mil for 3 more seasons?
Jarnkrok, 32yr old @ $2.1mil for 2 more seasons?
Reaves, 37yr old @ $1.35mil for 2 more seasons?
McCabe, 30yr old @ $2.0mil for 1 more season?

I'm guessing the retain on Markstrom was likely 50% instead of 31.25% to make it work instead.

Markstrom (50% retained)
for
2024 1st (#23), Reaves?

Don't think I have any interest in that, would have had to have included another sweetener (Liljegren or a prospect or additional pick?)

That's WAY worse than the NJD deal.

Replace Reaves with Liljegren, and I still like the NJD deal (likely a better pick, less retention, and don't have the uncertainty of Liljegren's new contract)

I don't see how TOR makes a better offer than NJD did. And until someone actually presents one, this is just TOR fans doing TOR fan things.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

TOR 2024 1st with Liljegren might be a little better, but not if the retention is 50%. I am confident Conroy went with the best offer.

(All based on speculation and assumptions. Let's hear more about the proposed deal)

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Here is what they are saying in an Athletic article

If the source is Treliving himself, we all know he has a long track record of offering low value, and then claiming it was just as good or better than what was taken.

Not bashing Treliving here, but Conroy isn't taking less just to avoid dealing with his old boss.

[YyjFlames]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

That's WAY worse than the NJD deal.

Replace Reaves with Liljegren, and I still like the NJD deal (likely a better pick, less retention, and don't have the uncertainty of Liljegren's new contract)

I don't see how TOR makes a better offer than NJD did. And until someone actually presents one, this is just TOR fans doing TOR fan things.

Maybe the 2024 first and Topi Niemelä. That would be pretty close depending on how Calgary's scouts see Bahl and Niemela.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by YyjFlames

Maybe the 2024 first and Topi Niemelä. That would be pretty close depending on how Calgary's scouts see Bahl and Niemela.

It would be close, but again, we need to know how much retention is involved. And it isn't better.

[Naitix]

I bet it was Robertson + this years first. I will still take NJ offer