Tank for Celebrini

[bigrangy]

If the Flames can go 0-3:

Ottawa needs 2 points from two games to pass
Arizona needs 1 point from 2 games to pass (accounting for beating the Flames)
Montreal needs 4 points from 2 games

Overall I think 0-3 probably earns the Flames a better spot than they have right now.

If the Flames go 3-0, they could conceivably still catch Minnesota for 12th assuming everyone else loses out. 2-1 guarantees them no worse than 9th.

Overall this has been a spectacular tank since the deadline period, it would have been all too easy to find themselves back in 12th-15th like usual but some smart coaching decisions (Rooney on PK1 thank jesus) have given the team a good chance to pick up a future core piece.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Ba'alzamon

The rumor I remember hearing at the time was that the Flames were trying to trade up to 3rd (Columbus's pick) to get Tkachuk OR Puljujarvi. The rumor mongers weren't sure which, but they knew it was one of the two

Pretty sure it was in Burkes book. It was Tkachuk the whole time. They tried to trade up to take him, but they got intel on the Blue Jackets taking Dubois and knew Edmonton would take JP. So they backed off the trade.

I think they knew Vancouver wanted position over BPA as well.

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Pretty sure it was in Burkes book. It was Tkachuk the whole time. They tried to trade up to take him, but they got intel on the Blue Jackets taking Dubois and knew Edmonton would take JP. So they backed off the trade.

I think they knew Vancouver wanted position over BPA as well.

Vancouver may have wanted a Dman but their scouting staff screwed it up bad, there were 4 other defenseman that were consensually ranked higher than Juolevi.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Vancouver may have wanted a Dman but their scouting staff screwed it up bad, there were 4 other defenseman that were consensually ranked higher than Juolevi.

Lying to yourself is fun!


https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/juni...aft-prospects/


https://www.tsn.ca/matthews-goes-wir...spect-1.511597


https://www.espn.com/nhl/insider/sto...2016-nhl-draft (Pronman is an idiot though, so this hurts my argument)


http://www.mynhldraft.com/2016-draft...nsus-rankings/


Olli Juolevi was usually considered to be the top defence man available in the draft. There are one or two that had Chychrun ahead of him, but that's usually it. I can't find a single one that has four ahead of Juolevi.


Juolevi is a case of illness and injury combining to never let a player develop. It's a situation you see on a regular basis. Hindsight is 20/20 but don't act like at the time this was a wild pick.

[jayswin]

Your fans and a lot of media seemed stunned when they picked him over Tkachuk. That's all I have to go by.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by jayswin

Your fans and a lot of media seemed stunned when they picked him over Tkachuk. That's all I have to go by.

I am not saying he was the right or wrong pick over Tkachuk.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

I am not saying he was the right or wrong pick over Tkachuk.

Oh yeah sorry, just read back a bit. No that guy was wrong. But I do love how he used the word consensually in reference to, I guess, experts agreeing with each other. Like they got each others consent for their feelings towards the draft pick order.

involving or carried out by mutual consent: a consentual divorce.

Maybe should have gone with concensus, lol.

[dammage79]

The juolevi situation felt like a case of over scouting. That Knights team was stacked and they were a monster apnd I think juolevi just being on the team pumped his rankings up far too high. It's insane Juolevi was the first London Knight taken in that draft.


I've always been a bit weary of drafting juggernaut teams players. There's a lot of over inflation of value. As was the Juolevi case

[albertGQ]

Originally Posted by dammage79

The juolevi situation felt like a case of over scouting. That Knights team was stacked and they were a monster apnd I think juolevi just being on the team pumped his rankings up far too high. It's insane Juolevi was the first London Knight taken in that draft.


I've always been a bit weary of drafting juggernaut teams players. There's a lot of over inflation of value. As was the Juolevi case

Agree with this. And that is why I didn’t want Tkachuk

I’m embarrassed to say that even after the Nucks picked Juolevi, I was texting my buddy and saying I hope we draft Alex Nylander.

Boy was I wrong

[bigrangy]

Originally Posted by dammage79

The juolevi situation felt like a case of over scouting. That Knights team was stacked and they were a monster apnd I think juolevi just being on the team pumped his rankings up far too high. It's insane Juolevi was the first London Knight taken in that draft.


I've always been a bit weary of drafting juggernaut teams players. There's a lot of over inflation of value. As was the Juolevi case

Juolevi was also on the juggernaut Finnish u20 team that year, which is where a lot of hype came from.

[Erick Estrada]

Joulevi had red flags to me for a top 10 prospect. Was good at everything, great at nothing. I was terrified the Flames would pick him had the Canucks taken Tkachuk. I’m not surprised in the least that he was a bust.

[Jiri Hrdina]

I think there were reports that the Flames would have taken Sergachev if Tkachuk hadn’t been there

[CFO]

Would be nice for hockey gods to have Flames win the draft lottery this year and 2 years from now. Franchise center and D.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by CFO

Would be nice for hockey gods to have Flames win the draft lottery this year and 2 years from now. Franchise center and D.

Are you passing on Celebrini or McKenna?

[Blaster86]

A lot of hindsight scouting (Official "Erick Estrada didn't hindsight scout" stamp of approval here) going on in here. I doubt Juolevi ever reaches the highs Tkachuk has, but if he stays healthy I would be shocked if he didn't develop into an every day NHLer

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

A lot of hindsight scouting going on in here. I doubt Juolevi ever reaches the highs Tkachuk has, but if he stays healthy I would be shocked if he didn't develop into an every day NHLer

lol

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

lol

Not sure what's funny about it? The kid got absolutely ####ed over from pretty much day one. Multiple knee injuries, mono, a mental health issue.

Was he going to be an all-star? Probably not. But the raw ability was there.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

A lot of hindsight scouting going on in here. I doubt Juolevi ever reaches the highs Tkachuk has, but if he stays healthy I would be shocked if he didn't develop into an every day NHLer

Not really ...

Here is the page when the Canucks took Juolevi. Lots of relief that Calgary got Tkachuk but also a lot of "LOL"s.

No hindsight 10 seconds after the selection.

CP Live Draft Thread : 2016

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

lol

Originally Posted by Bingo

Not really ...

Here is the page when the Canucks took Juolevi. Lots of relief that Calgary got Tkachuk but also a lot of "LOL"s.

No hindsight 10 seconds after the selection.

CP Live Draft Thread : 2016

Not because people thought Juolevi was a bad pick or a bust, because everyone wanted a forward. The entire thread about had a meltdown when Poolparty went to the Oilers.

People here are posting like everyone knew Juolevi was going to fall apart.

You're not just hindsight scouting, you're hindsight misremembering your own thread you linked

[dammage79]

Rumors around the draft had the Flames locking in Juolevi and ppl were not pleased. Canucks did the Flames a solid. End of story. Canucks have done a couple of solids for the Flames over the years.

Letting BMO go, letting Tanev and Marky go, picking Juolevi, selling a couple acres of the farm for Lindholm.

I got no ill will for the Canucks post sedins.