[Rumour] Flames are keeping Markstrom for the rest of the season

[Royle9]

The issue I have is keeping Markstrom to try and push for a playoff spot when both Tanev and Hanifin will be gone is just such a Flames thing to do.

It puts us right back in the mediocrity middle of the pack 16th draft pick.

Trading him is not only about the assets we’d acquire but also giving Wolf a true look and not letting Markstrom win us games we have no business winning.

This team isn’t going to go far even if we make the playoffs, they’ve shown that to us already. I’m not surprised we did this but it honestly hurts when his Value is at an all time high and a number of teams want a goalie for the push.

He was such a fit for NJD and if we honestly turned down Holtz, Casey and a 1st then that’s officially a strike against Craig in my mind.

[memphusk]

I don't mind as long as they trade Vladar and make Wolf the backup. Good guy to learn from Markstrom is. Especially his competitiveness.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

I have been - and I continue to be absolutely and totally gobsmacked by people who suggest that Conny "should just trade Markstrom".

He can't.

Marky has an NMC and it is TOTALLY HIS DECISION as to whether he can be traded (or even wants to be) or not.

Maybe the message is "We're honouring a contract to which we are a party."

It might be tempered by "Marky has indicated that, if someone overpays massively and that deal is acceptable to the GM and the Flames, he'll.....CONSIDER.....waiving. But it is HIS decision, and we are happy to honour that regardless of circumstances. And right now he's playing well and the team loves him."


Wow. Just....wow.

From all accounts it sounds like he will waive for New Jersey. Even a ESPN report saying he thought he was staying in New Jersey last road trip.

I don't think the hang up is Markstrom, he seems like a competitive guy who wants to win, and that is not going to happen here for the remainder of his contract.

[memphusk]

Originally Posted by browntrout

Like does anyone really believe this retool will work....the team probably won't make the playoffs this year, so then we start unloading UFA's, but somehow will be a very good team in just a few years?....but our starting goaltender who is blocking the best goalie prospect outside of the NHL is untouchable....that makes sense

The first step is not hanging onto UFA's. Thats happening. Calm down concernicus.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by memphusk

I don't mind as long as they trade Vladar and make Wolf the backup. Good guy to learn from Markstrom is. Especially his competitiveness.

Seems risky to have a rookie as the backup, limited games...

Will that effect his development?

[devo22]

Originally Posted by Royle9

The issue I have is keeping Markstrom to try and push for a playoff spot when both Tanev and Hanifin will be gone is just such a Flames thing to do.

It puts us right back in the mediocrity middle of the pack 16th draft pick.

Trading him is not only about the assets we’d acquire but also giving Wolf a true look and not letting Markstrom win us games we have no business winning.

This team isn’t going to go far even if we make the playoffs, they’ve shown that to us already. I’m not surprised we did this but it honestly hurts when his Value is at an all time high and a number of teams want a goalie for the push.

He was such a fit for NJD and if we honestly turned down Holtz, Casey and a 1st then that’s officially a strike against Craig in my mind.

that's the thing though, we're not even 16th WITH Markstrom, Tanev and Hanifin. Trading the latter two and then keeping Marky "to send the right message" is just bonkers. He can't get you to the playoffs without the two if were comfortably out of the playoff spots with them.

[RedHawk12]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

While it might be ideal to trade Markstrom now while his value is high and a couple of teams have a serious need, why do we just assume that there will never be another situation where a team needs a goalie in the next 2 years? Did anyone see a team like New Jersey desperate for a goalie at the start of this year? In the last off-season?

Why do we assume that Markstrom's value will be crappy going forward? Other than a year where he was having a baby and Sutter was playing mind games with everyone, he's been solid if not spectacular. Other than the normal worries about injury or slightly declining, this seems like a lot of unnecessary hand wringing.

Seems like all of these thoughts about what a mistake this is are predicated off of a lot of assumptions and speculation, rather than hard evidence to suggest these things are true. We don't know the future. Chill.

From what we can gather, Conroy's M.O. is about doing right by the organization, but also doing right by his players. A G.M. that cares a lot about the guys he employs is a sign of good leadership and culture building. Being ruthless is fine if you're behind a keyboard or watching the games from the stands, but it neglects the human element in trading players. If Markstrom doesn't want to move unless it's a good situation for him, Conroy should honor that, if for no other reason than Markstrom has a NMC. Plus, Markstrom has done everything asked of him and more, especially this year, all with a good attitude despite trade rumors swirling. How can you not take care of a guy like that?

If the offers aren't there, pull the asset off the table. It will also serve notice that the next time you negotiate with Craig, you need to find a way to meet the ask or don't bother negotiating. To me, that's good to see because it shows he will not just take whatever you offer just to make a deal.

I would have loved to see the N.J. deal happen, but clearly the ask wasn't met, and there aren't a lot of places out there that fit the criteria:
-need a goalie desperately
-have assets to give
-are willing to meet the ask
-is a destination Markstrom would waive for.

It was always going to be a tough ask to trade Markstrom. I don't think any of us expected it to happen this year. The plan to move a goalie for Wolf always meant Vladar. I don't fully understand why we all expect this to happen now when there are so many factors going against it.

While there are teams every year that need a goalie, very few have been traded for a package as good as the rumoured Holtz + 1st. That's the main reason I consider it a missed opportunity.

Yes, there might be teams just as desperate as NJ for a goalie in the next 2 years, but do they 1) have assets to offer that is as good as Holtz + 1st and 2) will they actually be willing to offer it.

This NJ rumour felt like the perfect storm of a team desperately needing a goalie and having a system deep enough with young talent where they can offer what they offered.

[TheIronMaiden]

Just going to parrot everyone else here. I think it the Flames need to trade Vladar if they are keeping Markstrom.

[Shazam]

We want to be bad next year due to Tre's insane Monahan trade, keeping Markstrom is not good.

[Royle9]

Originally Posted by devo22

that's the thing though, we're not even 16th WITH Markstrom, Tanev and Hanifin. Trading the latter two and then keeping Marky "to send the right message" is just bonkers. He can't get you to the playoffs without the two if were comfortably out of the playoff spots with them.

You’re right the messaging behind this really doesn’t make sense.
This to me if anything means that Markstrom after the whole NJD fiasco walked in Craig’s office and said I’m not waiving now for the deadline, leave me be and we’ll revisit in the offseason perhaps.

Wish we had solid evidence as to what the exact offer was.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by flambers

Personally I don't understand the rational to keep him the rest of the season

If that's the case, I would not be shocked if he was still a Flame for the start of next season

I see the rational for keeping him for rest of season. I truly believe flames want a young centre coming back in trade for one of tanev, hanifin or Markstrom. Tanev has been traded. Hanifin is more than likely going to be traded for rental prices. That leaves only Markstrom left to try and get that young centre. I have no problem if they wait till summer to see if they can get that. Now I will admit just because more teams might be interested in him , doesn’t mean he will waive to go to them.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by flambers

In 3 years maybe, i.e. retooling and not rebuilding

I would bet the master plan is to be competitive when it opens

Then they are not competitive in 3 years then

They were barely competing for a wild card team before trading all these guys

Keeping Markstrom may only make them bottom 10 instead of bottom 5. That’s not competitive.

[Matty81]

I get keeping him if the offers aren't good enough, makes total sense, you can't force a trade. Also that this is just speculation so probably nonsense.

But if it's true that they are not even listening it seems like such a terrible call. Basically the flames will end up with worse draft picks, fewer futures and a longer rebuild ahead all to send a message to the team that they're committed to an an unlikely playoff push.

Sad to say that it's pretty classic Flames behavior staying committed to a middling to poor roster and torpedoing their draft pick though

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

What Jacob Markstrom?

2023/24 or 2022/23?

2021/22 or 2020/21?

Only one of those years was bad. 20-21 he was great, got hurt, came back too soon which affected his play and then was great again.

Markstrom is a remarkably consistent goalie stats wise. 22-23 was a terrible year to be no good and that was coming off a bad loss in the POs (after a great win).

I'm pretty comfortable GMs know what Markstrom is.

[Poe969]

The Flames need to keep Markstrom, they need to be just good enough to draft #14-15

[TheIronMaiden]

There is an argument to be made that Markstrom is the second best goalie in franchise history. He is certainly the best goalie since Kiprusoff. It is very difficult to walk away from a player like that. Especially when they say they want to be here.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

While it might be ideal to trade Markstrom now while his value is high and a couple of teams have a serious need, why do we just assume that there will never be another situation where a team needs a goalie in the next 2 years? Did anyone see a team like New Jersey desperate for a goalie at the start of this year? In the last off-season?

Why do we assume that Markstrom's value will be crappy going forward? Other than a year where he was having a baby and Sutter was playing mind games with everyone, he's been solid if not spectacular. Other than the normal worries about injury or slightly declining, this seems like a lot of unnecessary hand wringing.

Seems like all of these thoughts about what a mistake this is are predicated off of a lot of assumptions and speculation, rather than hard evidence to suggest these things are true. We don't know the future. Chill.

From what we can gather, Conroy's M.O. is about doing right by the organization, but also doing right by his players. A G.M. that cares a lot about the guys he employs is a sign of good leadership and culture building. Being ruthless is fine if you're behind a keyboard or watching the games from the stands, but it neglects the human element in trading players. If Markstrom doesn't want to move unless it's a good situation for him, Conroy should honor that, if for no other reason than Markstrom has a NMC. Plus, Markstrom has done everything asked of him and more, especially this year, all with a good attitude despite trade rumors swirling. How can you not take care of a guy like that?

If the offers aren't there, pull the asset off the table. It will also serve notice that the next time you negotiate with Craig, you need to find a way to meet the ask or don't bother negotiating. To me, that's good to see because it shows he will not just take whatever you offer just to make a deal.

I would have loved to see the N.J. deal happen, but clearly the ask wasn't met, and there aren't a lot of places out there that fit the criteria:
-need a goalie desperately
-have assets to give
-are willing to meet the ask
-is a destination Markstrom would waive for.

It was always going to be a tough ask to trade Markstrom. I don't think any of us expected it to happen this year. The plan to move a goalie for Wolf always meant Vladar. I don't fully understand why we all expect this to happen now when there are so many factors going against it.

I agree with this. Markstrom isn't a pending UFA. Conroy can wait for his price to be paid. And if it drops by a bit because the market isn't in fact better, whatever. The difference won't be a big deal at the end of the day, I bet.

[Robbob]

I say Monday morning Fitz calls back. Potentially after the weekend NJ can be 1 point back of Philly with the same amount of games played. How can you not up your offer and get that goalie you need. They even have one head to head left, although it is near the end of the season and Philly might be sunk by then.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Robbob

I say Monday morning Fitz calls back. Potentially after the weekend NJ can be 1 point back of Philly with the same amount of games played. How can you not up your offer and get that goalie you need. They even have one head to head left, although it is near the end of the season and Philly might be sunk by then.

Then he better be offering mercer .

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by flambers

Personally I don't understand the rational to keep him the rest of the season

If that's the case, I would not be shocked if he was still a Flame for the start of next season

Originally Posted by kyuss275

I see the rational for keeping him for rest of season. I truly believe flames want a young centre coming back in trade for one of tanev, hanifin or Markstrom. Tanev has been traded. Hanifin is more than likely going to be traded for rental prices. That leaves only Markstrom left to try and get that young centre. I have no problem if they wait till summer to see if they can get that. Now I will admit just because more teams might be interested in him , doesn’t mean he will waive to go to them.

Ugh! It's rationale. (sorry, but this one drives me nuts)

Rational is what you are being (or not being)

Rationale is a noun, the reasons for your actions.