2023/2024 Trade Rumors and Speculation Thread

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

What is wrong with term if you have Huby for term? Just don't give him any trade protection so you have options.

Same reason that they didn’t give Toffoli term. Kadri and Huberdeau take both spots for old guys tying up cap space. Trade protection doesn’t really matter if he is on a contract that no one else will touch.
Anyways, it is really a discussion for next year after we see how he is performing

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

So that I’m clear multiple people are saying if this ruskie finds real chemistry with our highest paid player and makes said player play up to his contract we should ship that guy out because he’s 29 and the assets we get back could be anything, even someone who helps Huberdeau play up to his contract?

Kuz only has 1 point (a goal) in his last 5 games after the hot start. There's not really any evidence that he's helping Huberdeau play up to his contract.

Huberdeau has just been better recently. IMO it's because no one is focused on criticising his lack of production as we've all been dreaming about trade scenarios.
Maybe he's just feeling more comfortable in flames red.
Maybe he is enjoying the city more.
who knows. But probably not directly related to Kuz.

[saillias]

Kuzmenko was a smart pickup for sure, because he is versatile as an asset to a team like the Flames. It's been reported it took a lot of convos with Conroy and Huska to convince him to waive for Calgary. I'm sure he was disappointed to go from 1st place team to a non-playoff team.

I'm just speculating but it seems like a "give this guy prime opportunity to get some goals and flip to a playoff team" handshake agreement is very possible.

[Redrum]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

So that I’m clear multiple people are saying if this ruskie finds real chemistry with our highest paid player and makes said player play up to his contract we should ship that guy out because he’s 29 and the assets we get back could be anything, even someone who helps Huberdeau play up to his contract?

I don't think I've seen that at all. That would still be doubling down on Huberdeau which it seems people don't want to do. I think people have realized he's not the key to taking us to the promised land, and dont want to plan the team's future around him.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Kuz only has 1 point (a goal) in his last 5 games after the hot start. There's not really any evidence that he's helping Huberdeau play up to his contract.

Huberdeau has just been better recently. IMO it's because no one is focused on criticising his lack of production as we've all been dreaming about trade scenarios.
Maybe he's just feeling more comfortable in flames red.
Maybe he is enjoying the city more.
who knows. But probably not directly related to Kuz.

I think it also helps that most people have accepted the Flames are bottoming out and Huberdeau will never live up to his contract.

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Or trading a player like that for futures is how you end up the Buffalo Sabres. It isn't like Kuz will be 37 when the Flames turn the corner, the goal is to be competitive by the time the arena opens. Kuzmenko will 32, he doesn't rely on his skating but his shot and his smarts which will be the same then as it is now. As long as you don't hand him a NMC you always have options to move him if it isn't working out. What you don't want is to build a team that is ready to compete except they are missing a Kuzmenko on the wing.

What's so special about the time the new arena opens? People are going to pay a ton of money to go there for the sheer novelty of seeing it no matter how good or bad the Flames are. Then after a few months it will be over, no matter how good or bad the Flames are.

The goal should be to develop an organizational structure where you are perpetually competitive regardless if the arena is 40 years old or brand new. Let's have as few bad contracts on the books as possible to be able to augment a young core with other players as needed.

[ResAlien]

Originally Posted by Redrum

I don't think I've seen that at all. That would still be doubling down on Huberdeau which it seems people don't want to do. I think people have realized he's not the key to taking us to the promised land, and dont want to plan the team's future around him.

Doubling down on Huberdeau? He’s making a million billion buyout proof dollars for like 8 years you don’t have a choice. Unless you’re accepting trash Atlanta Thrashers forever status that’s silly. Don’t like Huberdeau? Gotta inflate those numbers and get someone to trade for him. Don’t get him any help? Cool we can cry until someone’s 11 year old is in Uni that Huberdeau sucks and is a drain on the team.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

Doubling down on Huberdeau? He’s making a million billion buyout proof dollars for like 8 years you don’t have a choice. Unless you’re accepting trash Atlanta Thrashers forever status that’s silly. Don’t like Huberdeau? Gotta inflate those numbers and get someone to trade for him. Don’t get him any help? Cool we can cry until someone’s 11 year old is in Uni that Huberdeau sucks and is a drain on the team.

lol or you build around it like Dallas. What’s worse building around two bad forward contracts or three bad forward contracts?

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by butterfly

What's so special about the time the new arena opens? People are going to pay a ton of money to go there for the sheer novelty of seeing it no matter how good or bad the Flames are. Then after a few months it will be over, no matter how good or bad the Flames are.

The goal should be to develop an organizational structure where you are perpetually competitive regardless if the arena is 40 years old or brand new. Let's have as few bad contracts on the books as possible to be able to augment a young core with other players as needed.

The goal is to ice a competitive team when the arena opens.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Bonded

lol or you build around it like Dallas. What’s worse building around two bad forward contracts or three bad forward contracts?

Do the Flames have two bad forward contracts?

[ResAlien]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Do the Flames have two bad forward contracts?

I guess in this wholly hypothetical situation a potential kuzmenko contract, if he shows he gels with Huberdeau, is the bad contract? I don’t know I guess we just say F Huberdeau and eat those dollars on the fourth line. Fans are weird.

[memphusk]

Soon to only be 7 years left oh Huberdeau!

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Do the Flames have two bad forward contracts?

I don’t think you could trade Kadri’s contract today and it’s not going to get better as he ages.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by butterfly

What's so special about the time the new arena opens? People are going to pay a ton of money to go there for the sheer novelty of seeing it no matter how good or bad the Flames are. Then after a few months it will be over, no matter how good or bad the Flames are.

The goal should be to develop an organizational structure where you are perpetually competitive regardless if the arena is 40 years old or brand new. Let's have as few bad contracts on the books as possible to be able to augment a young core with other players as needed.

They don't have to just fill the new arena for a few months, they need to have good attendance long term, which will be hard when everyone sees how much more expensive the tickets are (new building, 10% ticket tax). The Flames will need a competitive team to be financially viable in the new arena.

[bax]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

Doubling down on Huberdeau? He’s making a million billion buyout proof dollars for like 8 years you don’t have a choice. Unless you’re accepting trash Atlanta Thrashers forever status that’s silly. Don’t like Huberdeau? Gotta inflate those numbers and get someone to trade for him. Don’t get him any help? Cool we can cry until someone’s 11 year old is in Uni that Huberdeau sucks and is a drain on the team.

Huberdeau contract is a sunk cost. It sucks, but let’s not make it worse by giving into the sunk cost fallacy.

Ride it out, hope he’s not completely useless, and work around it. Flames still need to rebuild and get much younger whether that contract is on the books or not.

With the rising cap it will only get more digestible with time. Nobody is trading for it though I can tell you that right now.

[bax]

Originally Posted by Bonded

I don’t think you could trade Kadri’s contract today and it’s not going to get better as he ages.

The buyout on that deal isn’t too bad in the last 2 or 3 years though if they need to pull that trigger. Not the case with Huberdeau.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by dammage79

Mangiapane should be traded to make room for wingers.

After that the Flames have Huberdeau, Coleman, Kuzmenko, Sharangovich, Zary, Coronato, Pelletier.

The framework is there. We need centers and defense.

Long term I think Kuzmenko is the odd man out. I think the Flames want Sharangovich inked long term. 5 years at 4.5 or something? That seems fair.

What do we think Mangiapane is worth? He is a first line winger at even strength, 67th amongst forwards in the league in even strength points. Ahead of guys like Jack Hughes, Zibanajed, Larkin, Toffoli, Kopitar, Cozens, Fiala, Elias Lindholm.

Hard to value such a 5 on 5 scoring stud who is a good defensive player. Hard to place a value on that but it must be high. Those other guys seemingly are worth a lot.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Bonded

I don’t think you could trade Kadri’s contract today and it’s not going to get better as he ages.

I don't think you could trade Kadri's contract because he doesn't want to leave. If they could make it work to fit him I think there would be plenty of interest in Kadri, that is a guy you win with in the playoffs. As for the length of his deal most GM's don't care, odds are it will be someone else's problem down the road.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Or trading a player like that for futures is how you end up the Buffalo Sabres. It isn't like Kuz will be 37 when the Flames turn the corner, the goal is to be competitive by the time the arena opens. Kuzmenko will 32, he doesn't rely on his skating but his shot and his smarts which will be the same then as it is now. As long as you don't hand him a NMC you always have options to move him if it isn't working out. What you don't want is to build a team that is ready to compete except they are missing a Kuzmenko on the wing.

I don't think that's how you end up like the Buffalo Sabres to be honest - the Buffalo Sabres just made some bad bets / didn't invest enough in their goaltending, and didn't have any veteran d-men to help their young guys. Last time I checked the Buffalo Sabres gave Jeff Skinner a huge contract because he played well with Jack Eichel...how did that work?

Signing a guy like Kuzmenko to a contract when he's 29 is always a risky proposition and unless it's less than 3 years and $6M you're going to regret it.

If you give him 5+ years, and $6M+ you probably don't have to worry about a NMC because the contract itself will be a NMC for a guy like him.

The team has organization depth at wing, on the roster, and in the propsects. And will likely add to that with all these picks they have. No team is lacking a Kuzmenko as the difference to being a contender or not. A team that is a contender just moved Kuzmenko because he's not that guy.

He's a guy that is very skilled but IMO isn't a play driver or impact player, the goal for him should be to pump up his value and trade him. Not give him a retirement contract.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by Bonded

I don’t think you could trade Kadri’s contract today and it’s not going to get better as he ages.

Solid 2C with leadership qualities at nearly PPG while playing with 2 rookies for 7M/yr? I think you could trade that, especially if some salary is going the other way.