[Trade] Habs trade Monahan to the Jets for a 2024 1st and cond 2027 3rd

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

There were worse moves but giving up a 2nd round pick for Curtis Lazar kind of cemented for me that Treliving was at best an average NHL GM. I'm finding it very easy to cheer for the moves that Conroy is making and really glad there is a new guy calling the shots.

If there is one trend that I see carrying over from the Treliving years is the reluctance to move players until they declare their intentions that they want out. Even now, I think the preference internally is to re-sign both Hanifin and Tanev. Toffoli, Zadorov and Lindholm are all gone because they made it clear they weren't coming back.

The organization is loyal to players which is great, as I'm sure that is done in an effort to build a reputation as a place where players want to sign. But maybe they bend too far in that direction.

Yeah I think the Gaudrea/Tkachuk thing has caused a "this is still a great place to play!" panic internally.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

Toffoli, Zadorov and Lindholm all wanted to stay, Conroy decided he didnt want to sign them.

On their terms I think that's fair.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

Toffoli, Zadorov and Lindholm all wanted to stay, Conroy decided he didnt want to sign them.

It's shocking how many people don't get this

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

Toffoli, Zadorov and Lindholm all wanted to stay, Conroy decided he didnt want to sign them.

Well I guess you are going to argue that they all wanted to stay if their price was met. That isn't saying much as I'm sure every player has a price where they would play for anyone.

IMO all three are examples of players who were very committed to testing the market unless the Flames did something stupid. DId Zadorov and toffoli not specifically say "trade me"?

When is the last time Flames traded a player that didn't want to go. Ferland? It doesn't happen.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Bingo

On their terms I think that's fair.

Yeah I don't know how people look at say the Backlund extension and say the Toffoli/Zadorov situation and think those players had equal interest in staying here and that it is 100% on the club turning them away.

Seems obvious which players are more interested in staying than others.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

No this one is for Jarome Iginla being traded a year too late.

Oh, so this is the Bennett thread then.

[Hockey-and_stuff]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Yeah I don't know how people look at say the Backlund extension and say the Toffoli/Zadorov situation and think those players had equal interest in staying here and that it is 100% on the club turning them away.

Seems obvious which players are more interested in staying than others.

Lindholm/Zads: We aren't doing this for money...... we're doing it for a ####load of money!!

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by 868904

I really feel like Gaudreau left his heart in Calgary. I think he would’ve continued his great play if he had stayed with the Flames. He chose Columbus because he thought that was best for his family.

I’ve watched him a few times as a Blue Jacket and he doesn’t look anything like the Gaudreau we saw in Flames silks. That spark is completely gone and I think he’s depressed at the decision he made.

Who'd've thougt the best thing for him was the pressure of a Canadian market.

The atmosphere around hockey doesn't get more "meh" than Columbus Ohio

Do great there? No one really cares.

Do poorly? No one really cares either.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

No one knows what Treliving offered Gaudreau coming off of two seasons at something like .7 PPG, at a time when lost of posters called Gaudreau a peripheral, complementary player, and not an elite player. And hardly anyone has said what would have been a fair offer at that time. Why is it assumed that Treliving was the one making unreasonable demands?

Tkachuk - my sense is that that kid knows how to play media. He says he was willing to take a long term deal, but if you look at what he says, his "long term" sounds like 5 years. And you know he wanted a lot of money. At the time he looked promising but no one saw a 100+ point season coming I think.

- Treliving had a history of being a very tough negotiator on his own guys

- Gaudreau was top 10 in points among all NHLers after his rookie onwards ahead of Ovechkin, Tavares, Kopitar and etc. He was not complimentary, he was very much elite.

- Tkachuk was definitely an elite power forward which was a rarity at the time. He really was just scratching the surface as a power forward. I’m steadfast in my belief that Tkachuk loved it here and would’ve been lifer here had it not been for that Muzzin incident. Something happened after that moment that completely soured him on teammates and organization. He wanted out after that and his feelings never wavered.

- Lastly, if previous year’s stats are so important to everyone and Treliving, then I guess we all deserve that $10.5M Huberdeau contract for the next 8 years. Guess it’s too much to ask for a professional NHL general manager to look beyond the numbers from time to time.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by dino7c

It's shocking how many people don't get this

CaLgArY eXoDuS!

Yeah actually we just didn't want to dish out more Huberdeau-esque contracts and these guys wanted to figure out their long term homes where their lofty demands could be met. But carry on..

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Yeah I think the Gaudrea/Tkachuk thing has caused a "this is still a great place to play!" panic internally.

Yeah, if all management ever cares about is what UFAs think. The Flames should just focus on drafting well which is what our amateur scouts have proven they can do. Expensive UFAs and overpaying for guys who’ve never played in a Flames jersey is the reason why the Flames are in the mess they are in.

I’m just realizing now the true extent of the Flames history of cap troubles. It just hit me that there’s a chance this franchise could be saddled with ugly money for 15 years. Dating all the way back to 2016, if memory serves, Mason Raymond was bought out in 2016. Then there was the Bouma buyout and Troy Brouwer the next year. Then came the James Neal contract which ultimately turned into Lucic. Then right as Milan’s contract mercifully ended, Huberdeau’s 8 year deal kicks in and now, this franchise gets to bask in that glory until the early 2030’s. That’s basically 15 straight years of dead or ugly money. The only hope is that Huberdeau eventually figures it out and plays like an 8 figure hockey player, whatever that is.

[dino7c]

Nearly every team has dead cap to be fair

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Is this the Jankowski thread? Asking for a friend.

AHL Player of the Month for January!

Get on it, Connie....

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Yep, without that colossal mistake that was James Neal, the team would easily have enough money to ink Tkachuk to a long term 8 year deal with plenty of cap left over to add another quality player. But because of the Troy Brouwer buy out and the awful James Neal/Lucic contracts, the team had too much dead money on the books to afford the necessary raises and extensions for their homegrown guys.

And what would have been required to sign Tkachuk for 5 years? Or 6 or 7?

[Jason14h]

It’s always better to take a chance and risks overpaying your core / stars

If it doesn’t work out you suck
If they leave early cause you don’t sign them you suck
If they improve / perform you have a chance

This is my biggest issue . Locking JG and MT up as long as possible isn’t risky to me

Worst case is both suck and we are exactly where we are today .

The bigger issue is overpaying on average / complementary players which restricts your ability to acquire extra elite talent . Which is actually what BT did

[Hackey]

Giving Tkachuk a bridge deal was such a huge mistake. Especially with the deal structured in a way that gave Tkachuk all the leverage after the 3 years. And having the contract end the same year as Gaudreau was another big mistake. At a very minimum if he wanted out at least you would have had better leverage when it came to trading him. They wouldn't have had to make a panic trade and be where they are today. Seems like most teams have smartened up with this though.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Well I guess you are going to argue that they all wanted to stay if their price was met. That isn't saying much as I'm sure every player has a price where they would play for anyone.

IMO all three are examples of players who were very committed to testing the market unless the Flames did something stupid. DId Zadorov and toffoli not specifically say "trade me"?

When is the last time Flames traded a player that didn't want to go. Ferland? It doesn't happen.

Zadorov really wanted to stay the Flames didn't even make him an offer...then on the advice of his agent he thought he was being buried as the "best dman" in Calgary and requested a trade to showcase himself. Now he is the 6th dman in Vancouver. It wouldn't have taken anything too crazy to ink Zadorov in the summer/fall but I'm certainly glad they didn't. Unless he has some great playoffs he is going to be hard pressed to get his current number with any term.

Toffoli was a trade that should have been made anyway, looks like a massive win vs. signing him even to a reasonable contract

[Sylvanfan]

How long until Chevaldaeof starts panicking that he might have traded the 14th pick for Sean Monahan?

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

How long until Chevaldaeof starts panicking that he might have traded the 14th pick for Sean Monahan?

Uh, what?

Right now the Jets are in a divisional playoff spot, 11 points ahead of St. Louis and Nashville with games in hand on both. They would have to fall a long, long way for that to be the 14th pick.