[Trade] Flames trade Zadorov to Canucks for 24 5th and 26 3rd

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

If that is the case, Conroy will spend the picks and the cap space to pick up a player for the ‘run’ soon

Given everything that Conroy has said to date, this would surprise me. He has from the first day on the job set a very high priority on drafting, development, and getting kids into the NHL. It comes up in just about every interview, and the roster decisions being made every day reflect this mandate.

Whether or not the Flames end up extending Hanifin—this is still my hope—I don't think there is any chance that he is spending picks on veterans for a "run."

[flambers]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

If you were just retooling you’d consider keeping Hanifin at his age and ability. Lindholm, Tanev would still be moved for sure.

Flames need to retool, not sign lengthy contracts.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by flambers

Flames need to retool, not sign lengthy contracts.

Retooling never is all one type of deal. You will always have vets, and as soon as anyone’s an RFA, they will want long term contracts.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

If that is the case, Conroy will spend the picks and the cap space to pick up a player for the ‘run’ soon

Just the complete opposite, the Flames will work to acquire more picks.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Retooling never is all one type of deal. You will always have vets, and as soon as anyone’s an RFA, they will want long term contracts.

Agreed, vets with short term deals. (i.e. Backlund)

Flames need to hit the pause, and work to stock the system.

Might take a few years.

They definitely don't want any more huge contracts in my opinion at this time

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

I don't understand the wondering about the Flames organization and whether they will go full rebuild or can commit to a full rebuild. Nothing the organization has done, with various management in place and more or less the same ownership or majority ownership in place, since the Young Guns era has given any indication this organization ever wants to go full rebuild. It's not not an unknown answer to a simple question. The question has been asked, and the answer has been a definitive no for what, almost 25+ years?

Last rebuild, attendance plummeted, the dollar was trading low, and the team almost left town. I think a thread here has been tracking this season's sagging attendance (perhaps it's rebounded since the teams on-ice results have), and the dollar isn't doing too hot. Say what you will about Edwards and the group, and there's definitely a lot of bad to be said, they want to make the team work in Calgary. Which means they don't want to go through another stretch where the continued existence of the franchise here is in question. And as much as dedicated fans in spaces like this would be excited by a rebuild, the fanbase as a whole has shown little appetite for it.

Whether it's changing up the roster around the edges, or a near complete overhaul of the core like we have seen in the last two seasons, the path will never be full rebuild. It will continue to be focused on staying competitive now and adding for later when possible.

I don't recall any talk of leaving town in 2013-2016, we had 3 top 6 picks in those years. It was a rebuild in my eyes. I thought it gave this team a marketable product for ~10 years, and it could've been longer with a slightly better asset management.

I do agree that the answer regarding a rebuild in the last 25 years has been definitive, and so was the lack of success in that time period... and specifically the lack of success in the playoffs. I think that savvy businessmen, like the Flames ownership, understand that you need a product that people would want to buy, and constant retooling doesn't accomplish that without exciting play, and/or playoff success.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by flambers

Agreed, vets with short term deals. (i.e. Backlund)

Flames need to hit the pause, and work to stock the system.

Might take a few years.

They definitely don't want any more huge contracts in my opinion at this time

Hanifin is 26. Backlund’s short term deal ends when he’s 36. The longest contract Hanifin could sign takes him to 36. Would an 8 year deal be better if he was 24? Sure. But find another Dman as good who will be in his prime when all these 22 year old kids are in theirs.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Hanifin is 26. Backlund’s short term deal ends when he’s 36. The longest contract Hanifin could sign takes him to 36. Would an 8 year deal be better if he was 24? Sure. But find another Dman as good who will be in his prime when all these 22 year old kids are in theirs.

Key question, if the Flames are going to retool, and won't be making the playoffs for the next few seasons.

Why would Hanifin or the Flames want that type of contract?

Flames are at best a bubble team, signing Hanifin won't change that at all.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by AC

Man oh man, the number of f'ing losers in this city ripping into him on is IG page is frustrating to see. What kind loser rips on a guy's family for requesting a trade and doing what is best for himself financially and for his family? No wonder the list of players desperate to play for the Flames is small. Fans would do well to remember that next time a player wants out and they start whining as to "why did he leave". Thankfully a bunch of the posts got removed, but it was pretty nasty for a bit.


I thought Z was a pretty good player for us. Brought toughness and physicality the team desperately needed. And as mentioned, he literally abandoned his family in Russia when they sided with Putin. Both his kids are adopted. Did well in the community here. What is there not to like? None of his contracts ever broke the bank and he more than lived up to his billing. Trade request or not, it's his life to live and I'll never fault anyone for doing what is best for their family.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by flambers

Key question, if the Flames are going to retool, and won't be making the playoffs for the next few seasons.

Why would Hanifin or the Flames want that type of contract?

Flames are at best a bubble team, signing Hanifin won't change that at all.

The biggest reason to sign Hanifin for a rebuilding team is that it takes 5-7 years to develop a dman like Hanifin, takes a much shorter period of time to develop forwards.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

Man oh man, the number of f'ing losers in this city ripping into him on is IG page is frustrating to see. What kind loser rips on a guy's family for requesting a trade and doing what is best for himself financially and for his family? No wonder the list of players desperate to play for the Flames is small. Fans would do well to remember that next time a player wants out and they start whining as to "why did he leave". Thankfully a bunch of the posts got removed, but it was pretty nasty for a bit.


I thought Z was a pretty good player for us. Brought toughness and physicality the team desperately needed. And as mentioned, he literally abandoned his family in Russia when they sided with Putin. Both his kids are adopted. Did well in the community here. What is there not to like? None of his contracts ever broke the bank and he more than lived up to his billing. Trade request or not, it's his life to live and I'll never fault anyone for doing what is best for their family.

I don't rip into anyone, but he made a target of himself with the way his agent handled things.

I think he did some damage internally with the "not everyone is on the same page" stuff earlier in the season.

Asking for a trade request behind the scenes wouldn't get the attention in my mind.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by flambers

Key question, if the Flames are going to retool, and won't be making the playoffs for the next few seasons.

Why would Hanifin or the Flames want that type of contract?

Flames are at best a bubble team, signing Hanifin won't change that at all.

Key question, why are you ignoring the years between “next few seasons” and 8 years from now?

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Bingo

I don't rip into anyone, but he made a target of himself with the way his agent handled things.

I think he did some damage internally with the "not everyone is on the same page" stuff earlier in the season.

Asking for a trade request behind the scenes wouldn't get the attention in my mind.

Seems the locker room felt he was a hypocrite which is totally understandable. This isn't Johnny Gaudreau torn between staying with the Flames or being close to family. This is a guy that no longer wanted to be a Flame and made that public through his agent after earlier in the season calling out other players for being individuals playing by themselves. Not a great look at all.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Seems the locker room felt he was a hypocrite which is totally understandable. This isn't Johnny Gaudreau torn between staying with the Flames or being close to family. This is a guy that no longer wanted to be a Flame and made that public through his agent after earlier in the season calling out other players for being individuals playing by themselves. Not a great look at all.

Yeah that hard coach, soft coach speech had to alienate a player or two.

Might have been true though!

But it's a publicly patting yourself on the back, and then heading into the room to face your teammates.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Retooling never is all one type of deal. You will always have vets, and as soon as anyone’s an RFA, they will want long term contracts.

Hanafin is 26 and signing him long term would take him through his prime. Rebuilding or retooling you still need players under contract in their prime years.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

I don't recall any talk of leaving town in 2013-2016, we had 3 top 6 picks in those years. It was a rebuild in my eyes. I thought it gave this team a marketable product for ~10 years, and it could've been longer with a slightly better asset management.

I do agree that the answer regarding a rebuild in the last 25 years has been definitive, and so was the lack of success in that time period... and specifically the lack of success in the playoffs. I think that savvy businessmen, like the Flames ownership, understand that you need a product that people would want to buy, and constant retooling doesn't accomplish that without exciting play, and/or playoff success.

I think that window from 2013-2016 *may* have been planned as a rebuild, if not for that playoff series win against the Canucks. I think that win changed the blueprint moving forward. Pure speculation on my part.

As for a product people want to buy, the only time the willingness to buy reached dangerously low levels was during the Young Guns rebuild. Which is why we haven't seen one since.

[Finger Cookin]

Originally Posted by flambers

Key question, if the Flames are going to retool, and won't be making the playoffs for the next few seasons.

Why would Hanifin or the Flames want that type of contract?

Flames are at best a bubble team, signing Hanifin won't change that at all.

The whole point of a "retool" isn't to miss the playoffs for multiple seasons. It's to remain on the bubble, sneak in, and hope for the best. Pretty sure we've heard versions of that mantra from the organization for years and years.

[flambers]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

The whole point of a "retool" isn't to miss the playoffs for multiple seasons. It's to remain on the bubble, sneak in, and hope for the best. Pretty sure we've heard versions of that mantra from the organization for years and years.

I would disagree,

When they retool, my guess assets like Lindholm and Hanifin etc. will be moved for draft picks and prospects and players under 25 type of thing.

If a retool occurs, Flames will miss.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by flambers

I would disagree,

When they retool, my guess assets like Lindholm and Hanifin etc. will be moved for draft picks and prospects and players under 25 type of thing.

If a retool occurs, Flames will miss.

I would consider what the Canucks did a bit of a retool. They sent Horvat away for futures, then used the futures to get Hronek. While also moving away from guys like Pearson, and Schenn.

I think it depends on what are the Flames going to spend the future assets they get back on.

[afc wimbledon]

I never understood why people expect players to have any loyalty to a team when we all know the team would sell a player, any player, for a bag of pucks if it was of the slightest advantage to the team, on top of that every last one of us would take a better job with better prospects if it was offered, hockey is just a business, being a player is just a job, a job with a very short term uncertain earning potential and a high potential for long term health problems, the guys have to earn what they can when they can