[PGT] Flames lose Heritage Classic - Oilers 5 Flames 2

[MillerTime GFG]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Not sure why you are grouping me with him. I don't mind Dino. He can do what he wants, but I've never been someone to shy away from being critical of the team.
I've been pro re-build for years, but have recognized the team wasn't going to do it unless dragged into it.
I've called this franchise one of the worst run in the entire NHL.
i was pro BT yes, which I guess is the unforgivable sin for some around here.

I could be wrong, but I’m confident you’re one of the ones that has ragged on me in the past for being negative about this group.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

No, not at all.
Was just commenting that it gave people that similar feeling of glee as the I told you so's are getting now and hopped off from your post to make that note. Wasn't implying it was you.

Thanks for clarifying.
I hate the "told you so"' that comes from both sides.
But part of my frustration with the "i was right about being negative crowd" is that I have a different view of where this fan base has been. I don't think there have been many in the community that has been happy with the state of affairs or particularly optimistic about the future. But some chose to accept the reality of the team not re-building and therefore try to look forward to what could have been a rebound season.

So the told you so's are largely mis-guided in my view.

Moreover, I just don't think being right on a hockey board matters squat either way. So those keeping score just aren't that additive to the discussion in my view.

But yes stuff like the wall of shame, is just as bad or worse. That was a bad moment.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

What about making a "wall of shame" for anyone that had a negative opinion of anything last season?
That seemed like some good #### too.

I don't blame "negative" people for giving it back a little now that (almost) everyone can see they were right all along.
It's funny to see the same posters who were so gleeful doing wall of shame crap last year now twisting into knots about what's going on with the perfect roster.

Who ####ing cares?

The pleasure of being right, especially as it pertains to negative outcomes that generally suck for everyone involved is such low hanging fruit to chase or boast about.

[TheIronMaiden]

Any moves the Flames make should be with an outcome three year down the road in mind.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

I think this is the first time the Flames have ever been as low as 31st in the league this deep into the season.

Beautiful. They are on the right track.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by MillerTime GFG

I could be wrong, but I’m confident you’re one of the ones that has ragged on me in the past for being negative about this group.

My objections to you to has been when you've made fun of and looked down at people for cheering for or even following the team. You've, at times, bragged about how you don't even watch, and laughed at people who continue to do so.

I have no problem with those that offer well thought out criticisms.

I've seen very little of that from you. Since you asked.

It's not about being negative. It's about the other stuff.

[Locke]

Well...when you want to sign the players that you love, this is what you get.

We just got manhandled by the worst team in the League. And now we...are the worst team in the League.

And the roster is inflexible, old and expensive.

They want to lock up Hanifin and Lindholm into this??

We should never have signed Kadri, we should have taken our picks, we should have traded Weegar and Huberdeau when we had the chance. Hell, look at what we got for Tkachuk, they should have landed Huberdeau signed him to 8 years and immediately flipped him.

Huberdeau is the physical embodiment of driving a brand new car off the lot. He is worth substantially less now than when we kicked his tires.

I bame Brad Treliving for all of this. This team is an elderly, untalented, expensive monstrosity.

[MillerTime GFG]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

What about making a "wall of shame" for anyone that had a negative opinion of anything last season?
That seemed like some good #### too.

I don't blame "negative" people for giving it back a little now that (almost) everyone can see they were right all along.
It's funny to see the same posters who were so gleeful doing wall of shame crap last year now twisting into knots about what's going on with the perfect roster.

And the difference always in my case is I would have been HAPPY to admit I was wrong. Well guess what…I wasn’t, as were a lot of other posters.

All the Captain Positivities have a lot of crow to eat for their embarrassing attacks over the years, but they won’t.

So yea…you know who you are. Eat it.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by MillerTime GFG

And the difference always in my case is I would have been HAPPY to admit I was wrong. Well guess what…I wasn’t, as were a lot of other posters.

All the Captain Positivities have a lot of crow to eat for their embarrassing attacks over the years, but they won’t.

So yea…you know who you are. Eat it.

So yeah stuff like this.
This adds nothing to the board.
The concept that someone should be told to eat crow for being an optimistic fan is just such a junk attitude.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

This season could be a true fork in the road. We've argued this is an organization that needs to be dragged into a re-build, and dear god that could be happening. A bad start coupled with the player contracts in place, that really will make it hard to do anything to improve the team, could be just want is needed.

Just have a disaster of the season, and get a high 1st, high 2nd and clarity to deal off as many of the UFAs as you can. If the season is as bad as this, Hanifin and Lindholm wont' re-sign no matter what the number. Good.
Then add guys like Tanev, Zadorov to the pending UFA trade table and you've got a massive opportunity.

I don't think I've been someone to ever actually cheer for losses, but I found myself feeling happy about the loss. I don't like it, but that's where we are.

Keep it going.

I don't really believe the bolded but I agree with the sentiment. It is a consolation.

What makes it hard to really embrace a rebuild for me just yet:

The Kadri and Huberdeau anchors. At least Kadri is two years shorter, and so he could be dealt with retention or bought out in say four years. Both my kids will be out of college by then so maybe I will have more time for hockey.

The first round pick we will eventually lose in the Monahan trade. It's just infuriating to be at the bottom of the standings knowing you gave up draft capital to get there.

The fact that there seems to be a culture issue with the team. Which is fine for accumulating losses and draft position but actually has to be fixed at some point.

The gnawing fear that we won't really commit to building through the draft after the first sign of success.

[dino7c]

lol imagine being that gleeful the team you supposedly like sucks

posters here have been saying the Flames are a bottom 5 team for a decade now...they might actually be right for once (although I still have doubts)

congrats to all, enjoy every loss!

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I don't really believe the bolded but I agree with the sentiment. It is a consolation.

What makes it hard to really embrace a rebuild for me just yet:

The Kadri and Huberdeau anchors. At least Kadri is two years shorter, and so he could be dealt with retention or bought out in say four years. Both my kids will be out of college by then so maybe I will have more time for hockey.

The first round pick we will eventually lose in the Monahan trade. It's just infuriating to be at the bottom of the standings knowing you gave up draft capital to get there.

The fact that there seems to be a culture issue with the team. Which is fine for accumulating losses and draft position but actually has to be fixed at some point.

The gnawing fear that we won't really commit to building through the draft after the first sign of success.

The last part is my biggest fear.
I think the bad contracts are actually key to this team being forced to rebuild. Otherwise they would spend to try to compete and end up in the same place. I shudder to think of what they would be doing IF they had cap space right now. ick.

But will they have the patience? That's the big question. But perhaps those punshing contracts will require it. Dare to dream.

[MillerTime GFG]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

My objections to you to has been when you've made fun of and looked down at people for cheering for or even following the team. You've, at times, bragged about how you don't even watch, and laughed at people who continue to do so.

That makes no sense, cuz I’ve never stopped following the team. I would never question anyone following this team.

My negativity is because I’m deeply passionate about this franchise. The writing has been on the wall for years. We don’t have it.

Me saying “I don’t know how people watch” (or however I said it) was mostly said in jest. As in I don’t know how you do it.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by MillerTime GFG

And the difference always in my case is I would have been HAPPY to admit I was wrong. Well guess what…I wasn’t, as were a lot of other posters.

All the Captain Positivities have a lot of crow to eat for their embarrassing attacks over the years, but they won’t.

So yea…you know who you are. Eat it.

Gross.

Get over yourself. You're not important, and neither are your opinions.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by Rejean31

Dear Lord, if that is what Backlund actually said, we are in trouble. This is a horrible team, with a not great coach and and a rookie GM. The only reason they even had a slight chance at the playoffs last year was because they had a hall of fame coach coaching them. They got rid of him and this is the result.

As captain, what should he say?

Would kicking his team while they're down to the media be the right thing? No captain, or at least no good one would do this.

Leave the drubbings for in the locker room.

[Elkyiv]

I have a theory about Huberdeau. I think the way he was traded from Florida has changed him as an athlete. That FU reaction to the trade we heard about was probably the genesis of him realizing there is no loyalty in this league and he said to himself, I'm going to collect the bag and not GAF anymore.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by dino7c

what the hell are you talking about??

market was soft...guy wanted a retirement contract or a trade

trade certainly wasn't the worst option

Aydar Suniev looks like a fun prospect too

Of all the things to complain about Toffoli ain't it

You said a third round pick was giving a player away for nothing. I was just pointing out by your own definition the Flames got nothing for Toffoli then.

[dino7c]

To say the writing has been on the wall for years...I mean the team on the ice currently has played about 90 games.

Looks like a disaster but like I said people have been calling them a bottom 5 team for a decade on CP. 2 Division titles. I mean eventually they have to suck right?

Since they came to Calgary they have been a bottom 5 team 1 time right?

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Elkyiv

I have a theory about Huberdeau. I think the way he was traded from Florida has changed him as an athlete. That FU reaction to the trade we heard about was probably the genesis of him realizing there is no loyalty in this league and he said to himself, I'm going to collect the bag and not GAF anymore.

You're probably not wrong. He was deeply committed to that franchise, and was one he followed as a child. I remember seeing him in interviews days after the trade and it looked like nothing in his world made sense any longer. He was shook for sure, and said as much.

I don't think that should give him a pass for his terrible play since then, but a sports psychologist could probably write a best selling book purely by analyzing him.

[MillerTime GFG]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

So yeah stuff like this.
This adds nothing to the board.
The concept that someone should be told to eat crow for being an optimistic fan is just such a junk attitude.

I’m referring to the posters that created the wall of shame like winsor pointed out, or the posters constantly jumping on any negative comments about this team. And you were one of them.

Just admit you were wrong and move on.