2022 Freedumb Convoy(s) Thread

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I find it lacking that they don't have a single male educator in that whole group though, but just my opinion.

Can you blame them? These weirdos call average teachers pedophiles and groomers. Imagine the grief a male teacher specializing in sex education for younger children would get from those freaks?

[mrkajz44]

Originally Posted by flylock shox

Now that is super helpful (the PDF in particular). It provides real detail about topics at each level so a parent can largely understand what subjects are on the table at what ages.

But, like you, there are things on that list that give me significant pause. Why, exactly, would a 4 year old need to know about periods and wet dreams - things they have no context for or experience of, and won't for another 5 years (at least)?

I think lots of normal parents would look at that list and have some questions (which might have satisfactory answers, or might not). But at least it gives everyone a base of Information about the programming to work from.

I believe it's all about normalization. Teach the kids when they are young to understand that their bodies will change over time and there are things that come with that change that is completely normal and healthy. They will likely somehow interact with it before it happens to them via the internet somehow (TV, movies, YouTube, etc) so if you start young and explain that it's normal, then it's not as big of a deal when it starts happening to them.

As a counterpoint, why do you think it is too young for them to learn about periods or wet dreams? What is the harm in them learning about this at a young age when they will need to learn about it anyway? I don't really see a downside, yet there is very much an appreciable upside.

While I'm typing, I also find it interesting that for most things, we are often happy when our kids learn skills "early". Things like reading, writing, athletic ability, etc are all good to learn early, but for some reason they are too young to learn about how their body works and will grow?

[PepsiFree]

Knowledge and normalization (specifically of things that are completely normal parts of almost every person’s life) are absolutely key to healthy, functioning individuals and societies as a whole.

Think of how many problems come from ignorance or the idea that something normal is not normal. Racism, porn addiction, the way some individuals (incels) or entire cultures treat/view women, homophobia, self-esteem issues related to body type, etc. Think about why it is that some cultures and religions with the most puritanical views on sex and women are synonymous with homophobia, misogyny, certain sex crimes and sex-related issues and addictions.

The internet is vast and mostly uncontrolled. Your kids, whether you like it or not, will learn everything eventually without the controls of what is normal and what is not. Why wouldn’t you want them to learn about and normalize completely normal things in a completely safe space? Clearly parents aren’t comfortable doing it at the pace with which kids are learning it otherwise, but why not add the context you think is important and use it as an opportunity to educate your children and build that trust, instead of fighting it and creating more problems that you’re equipped to deal with?

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by mrkajz44

As a counterpoint, why do you think it is too young for them to learn about periods or wet dreams? What is the harm in them learning about this at a young age when they will need to learn about it anyway? I don't really see a downside, yet there is very much an appreciable upside.

While I'm typing, I also find it interesting that for most things, we are often happy when our kids learn skills "early". Things like reading, writing, athletic ability, etc are all good to learn early, but for some reason they are too young to learn about how their body works and will grow?

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Knowledge and normalization (specifically of things that are completely normal parts of almost every person’s life) are absolutely key to healthy, functioning individuals and societies as a whole.

Think of how many problems come from ignorance or the idea that something normal is not normal. Racism, porn addiction, the way some individuals (incels) or entire cultures treat/view women, homophobia, self-esteem issues related to body type, etc. Think about why it is that some cultures and religions with the most puritanical views on sex and women are synonymous with homophobia, misogyny, certain sex crimes and sex-related issues and addictions.

The internet is vast and mostly uncontrolled. Your kids, whether you like it or not, will learn everything eventually without the controls of what is normal and what is not. Why wouldn’t you want them to learn about and normalize completely normal things in a completely safe space? Clearly parents aren’t comfortable doing it at the pace with which kids are learning it otherwise, but why not add the context you think is important and use it as an opportunity to educate your children and build that trust, instead of fighting it and creating more problems that you’re equipped to deal with?

That all sounds very idealistic and vague. Is there any sexual content you think 5 or 6 year olds shouldn’t be exposed to?

If you think there is, where do you think the line should be drawn?

[mrkajz44]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

That all sounds very idealistic and vague. Is there any sexual content you think 5 or 6 year olds shouldn’t be exposed to?

If you think there is, where do you think the line should be drawn?

I'll leave that determination to the experts (like the ones that were linked a few posts above) as they know much better than me.

Based on that PDF it's pretty obvious the "line" moves as they age, starting with the basics of how the their bodies work, moving to explaining what puberty will be like as they approach it, followed by explaining healthy sexual practices as they start to hit puberty. Seems like a reasonable progression and having a good foundation about how the body works when they are young makes the rest of the steps easier.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

That all sounds very idealistic and vague. Is there any sexual content you think 5 or 6 year olds shouldn’t be exposed to?

If you think there is, where do you think the line should be drawn?

To put it in perspective my mom is a grade 3 teacher, last year and she caught a student showing another pornography. Both kids by all account came from straight lace normal families.

So yeah, 8-9 year old's are educating themselves. It is uncomfortable as #### but it is the way the world is now.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

That all sounds very idealistic and vague. Is there any sexual content you think 5 or 6 year olds shouldn’t be exposed to?

If you think there is, where do you think the line should be drawn?

Stuff that hasn't been OK'd by educational and pedagocial experts. Eg. what their cousin shows them from his dad's colelction.

At least if it's in class, it's in a controlled environment, without ignorant misinformation.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by opendoor

Can you blame them? These weirdos call average teachers pedophiles and groomers. Imagine the grief a male teacher specializing in sex education for younger children would get from those freaks?

I can't disagree with that. For sure there would be some grief.

Aside from the physics of sex ed and body science however, gender identity issues form a large component of the program. Not having male educators in the program creates a bit of a void. If it was an all male group of educators teaching female children about gender identity, I think a lot of people would have issues with that.

[Maritime Q-Scout]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

To put it in perspective my mom is a grade 3 teacher, last year and she caught a student showing another pornography. Both kids by all account came from straight lace normal families.

So yeah, 8-9 year old's are educating themselves. It is uncomfortable as #### but it is the way the world is now.

Grade 3? I was grade 7. Times are a changin'

That said, I recall there being sex education in grade 3.

As a parent of a kid in grade 1, I have no issues with that. I also have no issues with children learning that LGBTQ2S+ people exist.

Does my 6 year old find it confusing? Sure. He's completely confused about why people give a flying f*** that people are LGBTQ2S+ and confused that we all just can't get along.

[Barnes]

We had some sort of sex ed in grade 3. My son and his class mates were handed slips of paper with porn addresses written on them by another class mate so that advanced our plans of having the talk with him.

It sucks to look at your kid and think that this is something they need to know. They seem so young but they will get exposed to something well beyond what they are prepared for at some point.

I guess the other option is just learn out about sex at school like we all did. By finding magazines hidden in the woods next to the school.

[Galakanokis]

We have had a trans kid in school since kindergarten or grade 1. I am not up on my vernacular around LGTBQ but I guess you would say they started as questioning. Name was the same for a year or two but more dresses and "girl" attire. Then came a temp name change. And now, by grade 7 they have gotten a new name and identify as she/her. It has not and does not phase the kids one bit. They talk about it, and understand but only to explain it to parents. Otherwise it is just their friend. This stuff is not really a big deal unless we make it a big deal.

Kids already know more than we think they do. They will be fine if we stay out of their way.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

Grade 3? I was grade 7. Times are a changin'

That said, I recall there being sex education in grade 3.

As a parent of a kid in grade 1, I have no issues with that. I also have no issues with children learning that LGBTQ2S+ people exist.

Does my 6 year old find it confusing? Sure. He's completely confused about why people give a flying f*** that people are LGBTQ2S+ and confused that we all just can't get along.

I'm guessing you're right around the same age as me or similar.

You didnt have a cell phone or the internet.

Times are a changin' indeed. And it sucks, but I'd rather kids be educated by their teachers and parents than....*shudder* the internet.

We're on the Internet!! 'Tis a silly place!

[Maritime Q-Scout]

Originally Posted by Locke

I'm guessing you're right around the same age as me or similar.

You didnt have a cell phone or the internet.

Times are a changin' indeed. And it sucks, but I'd rather kids be educated by their teachers and parents than....*shudder* the internet.

We're on the Internet!! 'Tis a silly place!

Yeah, I believe we're about the same age.

I didn't have a cellphone until I was 22 (literally just did the math to figure it out).

Although I did have the internet when I was 11. Mind you, it's not like anyone would be tying up their parents' phone line for 4 hours to download dirty pictures (not video, pictures) using their 16.6K modem.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

Yeah, I believe we're about the same age.

I didn't have a cellphone until I was 22 (literally just did the math to figure it out).

Although I did have the internet when I was 11. Mind you, it's not like anyone would be tying up their parents' phone line for 4 hours to download dirty pictures (not video, pictures) using their 16.6K modem.

My brother did, and he was pretty horrified when I explained how the cache worked(back then it saved a local copy of the image without even changing the file name).

[Galakanokis]

Things have changed for sure. In my day the internet was your buddy that had an older brother or two. You we get the stories and lingo and maybe a magazine or two. The stuff you learned but word of mouth in the early 80's was incredible. Now, pretty much anything a kid wants to know is at their finger tips.

The sooner you normalize things the sooner they are no longer a big deal. I am an old man and still think the word penis is so damned awkward. It was just the way we were taught.

[Geraldsh]

Official sex education didn’t happen until grade 9 for me. The shop teacher sweated and stammered through a 10 minute talk that ended with “keep your tools in your own shed”. Our real education was from talking to the older guys on the hour-long bus ride every morning.
My daughter tells me kids are reaching puberty earlier now than previous generations which, if so, would rationalize the younger age education.

[undercoverbrother]

Sex Education was so much better back in the early '80's.


For example one of the weirder kids in elementary school brought a used condom to school the end tied up.

He charged kids $0.25 to see/hold it.


Such a simpler time.

[Ozy_Flame]

The problem with parents being teachers is they can't be experts on everything, even if they think they have expertise on some topics and it doesn't extend past their world view (many parents suffer the Dunning-Kreuger effect especially when it comes to training a human on how to navigate life).

Mom and Dad are not always right and don't have all the answers.

I agree with Galakanokis - you have to get children and kids brought up to speed on what is out there in a constantly evolving world and how the challenges of those world should be addressed (e.g. always get both sides of a debate, collect facts, validate with SME's, etc.)

The thing that grinds my gears with many parents is that they are are 20-30 years older than their kids and expect their kids to have the same frame of reference, context, and baseline cultural experience they had at their kids age.

One thing I think we can all agree on is ensuring children get taught early and often to listen to other people, acknowledge different opinions, and respond with tact, etiquette, and relationship-building skills. And that it's OK to be humble on matters they aren't themselves experts in. That includes learning about not only sexualization and what that means but also misinformation, the importance of change and diversity, appropriate cultural etiquette and social cues, and balancing their world views.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

Although I did have the internet when I was 11. Mind you, it's not like anyone would be tying up their parents' phone line for 4 hours to download dirty pictures (not video, pictures) using their 16.6K modem.

... hi, hello! I did exactly this lol. Remember that scene in the simpsons where comic book guy is downloading that dirty photo and it's rendering line by line? That was literally me after my parents went to bed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSKBRWoGvL0

[Bring_Back_Shantz]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

... hi, hello! I did exactly this lol. Remember that scene in the simpsons where comic book guy is downloading that dirty photo and it's rendering line by line? That was literally me after my parents went to bed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSKBRWoGvL0

Captain Janeway!
Lace, the final brassiere.