[Trade] Flames trade Toffoli to NJ for RFA rights to Sharangovich and 80th OA - Page 48 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

dissentowner · 06-29-2023, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spurs

I would say that he isn't really a young player and not sure there is much or any upside.

That is why I am disappointed, not mad.

I think this guy is going to surprise you. He has an elite release.

Spurs · 06-29-2023, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stampede2TheCup

Are you sure?

At 25, Carter Verhaeghe had 13 points in career 52 games.

At the same age, Jonathan Marchessault had one NHL point.

And for good measure, Pekka Rinne didn’t score his first NHL goal until he was 37 and everyone called him such a beast!!

I am not sure that exceptions are a good reason to think that the same will happen with Sharangovich.

Is it possible he explodes, sure. Is it likely, I don't think so.

liamenator · 06-29-2023, 08:34 AM

Sharangovich only turned 25 three weeks ago. This was a futures deal, and a good one.

Spurs · 06-29-2023, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I think this guy is going to surprise you. He has an elite release.

I hope he does, but my concern is that even if he does surprise it doesn't really result in much because this Flames team is not built to compete with a good, mediocre or bad Sharangovich.

Scroopy Noopers · 06-29-2023, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I think this guy is going to surprise you. He has an elite release.

And that isn’t hyperbole.

Psytic · 06-29-2023, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locke

What is with some of these guys? Toffoli wanted 6 or 7 years?

He's not an idiot. He knows that the likelihood of him ever replicating his 73 point season is essentially nil which is why he wants to bank on it.

But he must realize that everyone else isnt an idiot either. I mean, other than Ken Holland.

Nobody is paying a 31-year old coming off a career year assuming he's going to keep it up for the next half-decade or so.

What world do these people live in?

He just missed Treliving by a few months.

Bonded · 06-29-2023, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Locke

What is with some of these guys? Toffoli wanted 6 or 7 years?

What world do these people live in?

the one where this happens pretty much every offseason?

2016 is the best example of it but all of these contracts were dumb the minute they were signed.

https://www.dailyfaceoff.com/news/20...-agent-tracker

Hackey · 06-29-2023, 10:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spurs

I hope he does, but my concern is that even if he does surprise it doesn't really result in much because this Flames team is not built to compete with a good, mediocre or bad Sharangovich.

I don't think they're rebuilding. They're trying to win now, be competitive, whatever you want to call it. But I think they're also trying to do it in a way that kind of looks like re-tooling. So they're not quite all in either direction. Which I personally think is a very poor strategy. It's one foot in on the rebuild and one foot in one the win now. Which likely keeps them in the middle, and you're neither getting high-end prospects or getting deep playoff runs, or potentially even making the playoffs. I think they want to test the waters first and see if they can overachieve before tearing it down. The problem with that is they're wasting a lot of really good assets that could have been used for a rebuild. So if they eventually go the rebuild route in a few years, I think it's going to be far more difficult. Tkachuk has already been wasted. If Lindholm and Hanifin are used with a similar strategy I fear those guys will be wasted as well. And those were your best pieces to help jump start your rebuild. The more this goes on though the more I think they have no interest in trading those guys for futures.

TheIronMaiden · 06-29-2023, 11:27 AM

Knowing the Flames were not getting the offers they wanted, I am glad they traded Toffoli. Waiting through the draft with no trades would have been torture.

dino7c · 06-29-2023, 11:28 AM

Trade is looking even better...pick was ranked in the 2nd

Macho0978 · 06-29-2023, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dino7c

Trade is looking even better...pick was ranked in the 2nd

2nd round in a deep draft that might be late 1st round calibre from last years draft.

Stampede2TheCup · 06-29-2023, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spurs

I am not sure that exceptions are a good reason to think that the same will happen with Sharangovich.

Is it possible he explodes, sure. Is it likely, I don't think so.

Well, I am sure what you call exceptions are very numerous, so stating that a player who has 3 NHL seasons under his belt and just had his 25th birthday has no room for improvement is pretty ridiculous. Sharangovich’s 46 points is one better than Elias Lindholm put up in his 5 seasons in Carolina. The list of players who have improved after 25 is enormous, not just a couple guys.

Spurs · 06-29-2023, 12:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stampede2TheCup

Well, I am sure what you call exceptions are very numerous, so stating that a player who has 3 NHL seasons under his belt and just had his 25th birthday has no room for improvement is pretty ridiculous. Sharangovich’s 46 points is one better than Elias Lindholm put up in his 5 seasons in Carolina. The list of players who have improved after 25 is enormous, not just a couple guys.

LOL no the list of forwards is not enormous. No need to exaggerate.

Stampede2TheCup · 06-29-2023, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spurs

LOL no the list of forwards is not enormous. No need to exaggerate.

The list who have popped like Verhaeghe and Marchessault is short. The list of players who have shown some success in the league like Sharangovich and still improved noticeably after their 25 birthday is very large. It’s not an exaggeration.

dino7c · 06-29-2023, 12:53 PM

The thing is he already had a 24 goal season in the league...it's not like it would be coming totally out of left field

Spurs · 06-29-2023, 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dino7c

The thing is he already had a 24 goal season in the league...it's not like it would be coming totally out of left field

I think him returning to the production of his 2nd season wouldn't be a surprise or something people couldn't expect. But I think at this point he is a 2nd/3rd line guy, probably a 2nd liner on a lower team but a 3rd line for the top teams.

I don't expect we will see him improve on that in his time here and don't think that is a negative spin, just the reality of guys with his age/experience.

ComixZone · 06-29-2023, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dino7c

Trade is looking even better...pick was ranked in the 2nd

Yep.

Just get picks. If we aren’t going to tank (…ever), the next best thing is to amass a significant quantity of picks to increase your chances of unearthing a gem.

cral12 · 06-29-2023, 01:08 PM

Conroy just talking about he wanted to trade up to late 2nd rnd to pick this lad. He loeved him as much as Upside's chief of scouting, E-Mac.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1674452887861329926

Redrum · 06-29-2023, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spurs

LOL no the list of forwards is not enormous. No need to exaggerate.

I'd have to disagree that it's rare to improve after 24 years old.

Locke · 06-29-2023, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Psytic

He just missed Treliving by a few months.

Also, I have a sneaking suspicion that a lot of these impending UFAs complaining about "Never hearing from management about contract negotiations" had a lot to do with Treliving knowing he wasnt going to be here so he brushed them off.

What a crapshow.