Teachers are at the end of their rope.

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by Matata

9/10 a teaching career is built on top of an undergrad degree that has very little financial upside. People from humanities, history, sociology, arts, literature, etc. are commonly funnelled into teaching because they don't have many options.

That is complete BS

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Spurs

Well to be clear I am not sure any teachers in Alberta make 100k and nowhere in Canada is that the salary either so the 100k number is flawed to begin with. I used it as an easy number to go by but if it becomes a number used to we can easily go with I doubt teachers make more than most people with similar educational backgrounds.

Well, they make more so you're kind of right.

As of September 2022, with 10 years of experience, they make $103,111 with a masters of teaching (six years' education). With four years of education at 10 years they make $95,562. Five years of education they make $99,082.

Here is the salary grid: https://local38.teachers.ab.ca/SiteC...ALLOWANCES.pdf

[wireframe]

Originally Posted by Slava

Well there was that one teacher who was accused of sexual assault and basically was shuttled around without losing his license (IIRC). Then when he was charged this year, or last year, he committed suicide. So, you do wonder...when someone accused of that is still licensed and teaching, what does it take?

This is hearsay, so take it for what it's worth. I have heard of several teachers who were fired from the CSSD or CBE for sexual relationships with students (all over 16 y.o.). All of those teachers are still working in private schools. It's hard to remove a teaching license.

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Well, they make more so you're kind of right.

As of September 2022, with 10 years of experience, they make $103,111 with a masters of teaching (six years' education). With four years of education at 10 years they make $95,562. Five years of education they make $99,082.

Here is the salary grid: https://local38.teachers.ab.ca/SiteC...ALLOWANCES.pdf

How many teachers have a masters? I would think that is a small number so most will max out at less than 100k.

[wwkayaker]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

Just curious , what sort of things cause a teacher to lose their certification ? Just curious what gets a teacher fired and lose their certification

Two teachers had inappropriate relationships of varying degrees with students. One guy’s conduct spiralled out of control to the point where he was abusive to kids and staff.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Spurs

Well to be clear I am not sure any teachers in Alberta make 100k and nowhere in Canada is that the salary either so the 100k number is flawed to begin with. I used it as an easy number to go by but if it becomes a number used to we can easily go with I doubt teachers make more than most people with similar educational backgrounds.

Okay. This is where I step in. You are absolutely, conclusively, 100% incorrect.

I have well over 100 teachers as clients and have been doing taxes for 20 years. I see their T4s.

I can tell you that there are a significant number of teachers in Calgary alone who make that. With absolute certainty.

And thats okay, I just dont understand why you wouldnt believe it. Its just their pay-scale.

If you've been a teacher for a minimum of 10 years you make $103K. Thats just how it is.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Spurs

How many teachers have a masters? I would think that is a small number so most will max out at less than 100k.

It isn't technically a masters in teaching, it's 6 years of post secondary.

So a 4 year degree and a 2 year teaching after-degee qualifies, and that's a pretty common path for people entering the profession.

[wwkayaker]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Okay, but a teacher doesn't work a full-year; they work 3/4 of a year. I know in this thread we like to pretend that isn't a perk or a component of their compensation, but I don't know how many of you guys are going to be showing up everyday for work over the next two months, but I know zero teachers will be.

I'm aware that above fact will make some people angry. I don't understand why, but I don't think that's a me problem.

Do some professions pay more? Yes.

Do some professions get equal or more time off? No.

That time off is an incentive for people to get into (and stay in) teaching. Again, I know in this thread we are pretending that isn't the case, but I've yet to hear a teacher IRL not mention summers, Christmas and spring off as a major life perk they could never do without.

We could always pro-rate that salary to just three weeks off a year instead of 12 to get a better idea of what an annual salary would look like versus working 0.75 of a year.

I agree that the holidays are a perk and is an incentive for some. What would you like to do? You can change the school calendar so that instead of 194(ish) instructional days and 200(operational days). Add 25 more days to each of those numbers and increase teacher pay accordingly. Now kids are in school and lose out on a break they really need and I think is necessary so kids can be kids. Are those grade 2s you referenced earlier better served with that schedule? I don’t think so.

You need to rethink your math on that 0.75 FTE but we’ve had that discussion previously so I’ll end that debate now.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by wwkayaker

I agree that the holidays are a perk and is an incentive for some. What would you like to do? You can change the school calendar so that instead of 194(ish) instructional days and 200(operational days). Add 25 more days to each of those numbers and increase teacher pay accordingly. Now kids are in school and lose out on a break they really need and I think is necessary so kids can be kids. Are those grade 2s you referenced earlier better served with that schedule? I don’t think so.

You need to rethink your math on that 0.75 FTE but we’ve had that discussion previously so I’ll end that debate now.

I'm not asking to change anything. I'm just posting facts to clear up misconceptions.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Spurs

How many teachers have a masters? I would think that is a small number so most will max out at less than 100k.

IDK, man. You seem to have a lot of opinions on this yet know very little. Masters of teaching is basically the standard-issue qualification for teachers and has been for a decade or two. I believe it's the only option at UC to becoming a teacher. Some people used to go to UofL to get their certificate quicker, but I don't really know if that's still the case.

A Masters of teaching is not a Masters degree; it's beneath it in the little academic hierarchy.

[wireframe]

Originally Posted by Sliver

IDK, man. You seem to have a lot of opinions on this yet know very little. Masters of teaching is basically the standard-issue qualification for teachers and has been for a decade or two. I believe it's the only option at UC to becoming a teacher. Some people used to go to UofL to get their certificate quicker, but I don't really know if that's still the case.

A Masters of teaching is not a Masters degree; it's beneath it in the little academic hierarchy.

It's usually a secondary bachelor's degree, not a masters. Still 6 years of education but a different word on the degree. https://werklund.ucalgary.ca/undergr...n-after-degree

[wwkayaker]

You can get a masters or doctorate of education but that isn’t required to move teachers up the pay scale. Teachers submit their university transcripts to the school division to have the courses/credits assessed. Obviously you need to have your degree but if you amassed an extra year or two of credits you are placed on the pay scale at that level.

A masters degree in education is a real thing. So is a doctorate. You can even have the initials on your business card.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by wwkayaker

You can get a masters or doctorate of education but that isn’t required to move teachers up the pay scale. Teachers submit their university transcripts to the school division to have the courses/credits assessed. Obviously you need to have your degree but if you amassed an extra year or two of credits you are placed on the pay scale at that level.

A masters degree in education is a real thing. So is a doctorate. You can even have the initials on your business card.

Sure, you can get a Masters degree, but a Masters of Education is not a Masters degree.

[you&me]

Originally Posted by wireframe

This is hearsay, so take it for what it's worth. I have heard of several teachers who were fired from the CSSD or CBE for sexual relationships with students (all over 16 y.o.). All of those teachers are still working in private schools. It's hard to remove a teaching license.

Sounds highly unlikely... I've never heard of any issues with finding staffing for private schools and it's rare for a teacher to leave the public system (that nice pension and all), so it seems incredibly unlikely that a private school would hire a teacher with that kind of history and take on that sort of risk.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by wireframe

This is hearsay, so take it for what it's worth. I have heard of several teachers who were fired from the CSSD or CBE for sexual relationships with students (all over 16 y.o.). All of those teachers are still working in private schools. It's hard to remove a teaching license.

I would hope that's not the case, because it's literally criminal. It's pretty insane to me though. Here we have a discussion about whether teachers can lose their certificate if they're incompetent or whatever, and the examples are basically "well this guy lost his for molesting kids" so the system works. Abhorrent.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Sliver

IDK, man. You seem to have a lot of opinions on this yet know very little. Masters of teaching is basically the standard-issue qualification for teachers and has been for a decade or two. I believe it's the only option at UC to becoming a teacher. Some people used to go to UofL to get their certificate quicker, but I don't really know if that's still the case.

A Masters of teaching is not a Masters degree; it's beneath it in the little academic hierarchy.

The UofL program was highly recognized (years ago and I have no idea about today). It's a 5 year, combined degree program.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Slava

The UofL program was highly recognized (years ago and I have no idea about today). It's a 5 year, combined degree program.

One daughter went through it and the other is going through right now.

Can confirm, its first rate.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Matata

9/10 a teaching career is built on top of an undergrad degree that has very little financial upside. People from humanities, history, sociology, arts, literature, etc. are commonly funnelled into teaching because they don't have many options.

I think you meant to say Lawyers not teachers here.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Probably the first step would be to recognize that, in fact, nobody is against improving workplace conditions and ultimately delivering better education.

We're how deep into this thread and - to my knowledge - nobody has posted what the specific issue is teachers have with the government's proposal. Do we even know? How far apart are the two sides? Is it publicly available? I understand teachers don't like the offer, but what is the offer and what is it they want? Maybe knowing that will help people either support the teachers or support our representatives in government.

The issue is they haven’t offered the same contract to the CCSD as they have the other boards. It’s ridiculous. So you are saying you just came in here complaining about teachers and how great they have it without reading the article?

[wwkayaker]

Originally Posted by Sliver

Sure, you can get a Masters degree, but a Masters of Education is not a Masters degree.

Is that akin to an Arts degree not being a degree at all?


This thread has been great. I don’t think the OP has posted since the thread was started. Until the next teacher thread, take care.