[News] Calgary, Alberta, & CSEC agree in principle to $1.223bn Event Centre + infrastructure

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

CSEC also:

1) gets to use city's cost of financing for the owner's benefit rather than use the owner's own money or own borrowing capacity

2) gets all the non-flames venue revenue associated with the arena

3) gets all the upside on the facility's revenue generation over the next 35-years as the city grows

4) also gets land options on land around arena

5) also gets infrastructure upgrades on all that land options paid for by the city and province

6) also gets use of the "community arena" for further revenue opportunities


It's actually embarassing

I know a bunch of real estate developers that would have taken this deal too. One told me he would have put in 60 million for all the non CSECrevenue. Have them as an anchor tenant and make money off the other events and real estate opportunities around the arena.

Go to the Flames, let them know they will get the arena for free, just have to pay rent and sign a 30 year lease for the rent portion. Get the real estate developer to put up 60 million and collect all those revenue streams you cited. Taxpayer would have been 20 million ahead and the Flames would have stayed in Calgary.

[monkeyman]

Did the Mayor finally get CSEC to agree to pay the 4 mil for climate mitigation?

[Tron_fdc]

Edwards is no dummy. Is it a surprise to anyone that a billionaire businessman took two politicians to the woodshed?

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

IMO (2) and (3) is implied. (4) is assumed based on previous deal

I am still hoping that 2 and 3 aren't the case but I know they will be otherwise it would have been stated

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

This should, absolutely, get Gondek turfed at the first possible opportunity. I'm honestly very surprised she allowed this to happen.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Likely more on Sharp than Gondek.

[Muta]

Would love to see a feature 'main path' pedestrian corridor and plaza northeast of the new arena that directly connects the arena with the new Green Line station; where people can walk and congregate and celebrate. I feel there's a total opportunity there to do something really fun and lifestyle-based that welcomes transit commuters from that direction, and provides a new attraction point in that side of the district.

[topfiverecords]

Some cool AI generated renderings a user posted on reddit. All of them nicer than the last design we got from real architects. https://www.reddit.com/r/Calgary/com...tre_using_the/

[dissentowner]

Mods, I think a poll would be interesting to see who is happy with this deal and who are against it. Seems like an interesting divide and would be curious on the numbers.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Likely more on Sharp than Gondek.

Turf them both. They are equally useless.

[AC]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Some cool AI generated renderings a user posted on reddit. All of them nicer than the last design we got from real architects. https://www.reddit.com/r/Calgary/com...tre_using_the/

Cornbatrodi does have a nice ring to it.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by Muta

Would love to see a feature 'main path' pedestrian corridor and plaza northeast of the new arena that directly connects the arena with the new Green Line station; where people can walk and congregate and celebrate. I feel there's a total opportunity there to do something really fun and lifestyle-based that welcomes transit commuters from that direction, and provides a new attraction point in that side of the district.

Stampede Trail and 14th Ave are where all the action and cool stuff will be. The train station better be connected to the event centre by a nice, big tunnel walkway. If there is no tunnel the project is a failure. If they want to do something cool/interesting they can build a little plaza under there with some shopping/dining options.

[Boreal]

Originally Posted by csnarpy

Although I dislike the UCP, there is no frikkin way I vote NDP. So, ya the bribes are good. Cheers.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...htmlview#gid=0https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...htmlview#gid=0

Nothing like knowing the answer before you’ve heard the question.

But that sounds like a great plan. It would be somewhat logical if the NDP could hold a candle to the corrupt unending incompetence of this government.

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by Rutuu

I've been there actually...and agree. However they chose that location because of being near rail. It was part of a revitalization I can concede that. The hotels in the area provide foot traffic as well. Also baseball plays 81+ home dates in a 7 month window and the stadium is bigger.

The best stadium areas integrate into the community instead of standing as a monolith.

Agreed. Calgary has a chance to get to something like that instead of the monoliths like Kauffman Stadium or Canadian Tire Centre.

Those existing new hotels to the north by the river are a good start.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

What a terrible deal. Murray has to pay 40 million bucks up front and the taxpayer pays the other 900 million.

Out of thanks, but absurd as it sounds, this isn't even an unreasonable way to summarize it.

People seem to forget that pretty much any business has existential operating costs, usually meaning paying rent or mortgage+property taxes for some sort of physical space.

Obviously sports arenas are a bit unique as there isn't really a competitive market for landlords/tenants, but there is no special benevolence here - the Flames are simply paying rent to operate their business.

Originally Posted by GullFoss

CSEC also:

1) gets to use city's borrowing capacity and borrowing rate for the owner's benefit rather than use the owner's money or borrowing capacity

2) gets all the non-flames venue revenue associated with the arena

3) gets all the upside on the facility's revenue generation over the next 35-years as the city grows

4) gets land options on land around arena

5) gets infrastructure upgrades on all that land options paid for by the city and province

6) gets use of the "community arena" for further revenue opportunities


It's actually embarassing

7) immediate 9-figure franchise valuation increase

[FlamesAddiction]

Maybe I am just cynical, but tax dollars get wasted all the time on things that have no improvement on the lives of regular people. It will just get pissed away on other pet projects that people end up forgetting about. It's better to have one big bonfire than a bunch of little fires, at least once in a while. As long as they aren't slashing the budget on other things, and this project is on top of paying for municipal necessities, I say go for it.

Danielle Smith mentioned that the Edmonton entrainment district has already payed dividends that justify the use of public money. I came across one CBC article that said as of 2019, the entertainment district had already generated an additional $2 billion in economic activity downtown. It also gave a differing view saying that the additional economic activity was going to happen anyway and that they didn't need to build an entertainment district to do it. I wonder what the truth is... maybe somewhere in the middle as usual?

After Katz got the deal he did, I don't think the Flames owners were going to settle for less. The seal was kind of broken after that.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by AC

Cornbatrodi does have a nice ring to it.

That's Coronato's cousin Vinny.

[mile]

Originally Posted by topfiverecords

Some cool AI generated renderings a user posted on reddit. All of them nicer than the last design we got from real architects. https://www.reddit.com/r/Calgary/com...tre_using_the/

yes to the second, third, and last ones


the second one looks sinister

[MacDaddy77]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

This should, absolutely, get Gondek turfed at the first possible opportunity. I'm honestly very surprised she allowed this to happen.

Unanimously approved by Council.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Danielle Smith mentioned that the Edmonton entrainment district has already payed dividends that justify the use of public money. I came across one CBC article that said as of 2019, the entertainment district had already generated an additional $2 billion in economic activity downtown. It also gave a differing view saying that the additional economic activity was going to happen anyway and that they didn't need to build an entertainment district to do it. I wonder what the truth is... maybe somewhere in the middle as usual?

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmon...deal-1.5227897
It's more balanced than saying it was a great success