Flames Mount Rushmore Round Two

[CSharp]

NVM - just saw round 1

[the2bears]

After Iginla, McDonald and likely Kipper I think my 4th and final vote will be for Bearcat.

[CSharp]

McD with his 'stach on Mt Rushmore would be monumental, especially if a dash of red earth is added!

[CroFlames]

If we include Lanny's off-ice activity but not Theo's, that is being dishonest.

Lanny is a gem off the ice and has continued to build his Calgary legacy. His on-ice performance alone doesn't get him on Mt Rushmore. Lanny the person does.

Theo's on-ice performance should have got him on Mt Rushmore, but his off-ice legacy has tarnished his reputation to such a degree that he's a nonstarter for me. Theo the person, is trash.

My prediction is that it will be Iginla, Lanny, MacInnes and Kiprusoff.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Igottago

If its players only, Fleury has to be there in the 3 or 4 spot. He was an incredible player for the franchise. He also obviously overcame a lot to become an elite NHLer. There's a lot of merit in that. You can think he's an idiot, I tend to think he's an idiot, but it doesn't erase his contribution to the franchise. It's a shame that people can't put his twitter nonsense aside and give him credit for what he did achieve for the Flames. If this Flames mount Rushmore was for most illuminated human beings, then yeah, he should be nowhere near it. But for hockey performance, you can't ignore what Fleury did.

You don’t have to ignore it to believe it’s not among the top four contributions to the franchise as a whole.

I think both the “what he overcame” argument and the cup arguments are nonsense, personally.

If what he overcame counts for something, who he became counts at least as much. And while he didn’t have control over what happened to him, he did have control over who he became.

If having a cup ring is a trump card regardless of how important the player was to the cup win, then why have Iginla there at all? A cup is a team accomplishment. It’s glorified (often for good reason, it’s extremely difficult) but average and below average players win cups too. On an individual level it doesn’t mean anything. Conn Smythe, Vezina, Hart, etc. These tell you about a player and their contributions. A cup doesn’t.

[Lanny'sDaMan]

I think we all know who I voted for.

[Displaced Flames fan]

Iginla and Lanny are the clear #1 and #2, for me its wiiiiiiide open after that.

[looooob]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I think both the “what he overcame” argument and the cup arguments are nonsense, personally.

.

this isn't directed at you (specifically) or frankly anyone likely but the Cup argument is pretty interesting actually.

little doubt that core 85-90 (ish) group needs representation- that was the peak of the Flames

both Lanny (on his last legs but an emotional presence) and Theo (mid season call up and 4th line Center who to be fair did contribute pretty nicely esp on the PP when Suter went down) were sort of secondary to that accomplishment

the core of that group was some order of MacInnis, Vernon, Mullen, Nieuwendyk, Otto, Gilmour, Suter, Roberts, Loob, Sarge, Macoun and then some other glue guys like Pepper, Hunter, Patterson etc

anyways of that group seems like MacInnis and Vernon are the 2 that will be in discussion for the last 2 spots

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Show me where he trashed the organization many times? You are full of ####. His contributions off the ice is helping thousands of abuse survivors get through their struggles. Please tell me what Kipper's contributions off the ice are?

Right around signing in New York he trashed the org saying he was under appreciated etc.

The wiki cites a Duha article from '99

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

Right around signing in New York he trashed the org saying he was under appreciated etc.

The wiki cites a Duha article from '99

Also this:
https://www.matchsticksandgasoline.c...s-craig-conroy

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Also this:
https://www.matchsticksandgasoline.c...s-craig-conroy

Right after they had the feel good story of the 'comeback' too.

Yeesh.

[Jason14h]

But he was sort of right . Let’s not act like he was trashing a team that has been overly successful the past 30 years

Would be similar to trashing Lucic today and saying he hasn’t scored in 50 games .

I know people like Conroy and Fleury was old and out of shape and exhibition is exhibition , but that statement is a generalization of what a lot of people were thinking during that time and the mantra of the Flames

To me Vernon is an easy #3 , and then 4 becomes tricky. Big Al isn’t a Flame, he’s a Blue. For me the 4th is Fleury or Kipper

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Anyone who doesn't vote for Lanny will get a punch in the head.

Oh wait...in my opinion!

[Paulie Walnuts]

Thanks for doing the work me.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

But he was sort of right . Let’s not act like he was trashing a team that has been overly successful the past 30 years

Would be similar to trashing Lucic today and saying he hasn’t scored in 50 games .

I know people like Conroy and Fleury was old and out of shape and exhibition is exhibition , but that statement is a generalization of what a lot of people were thinking during that time and the mantra of the Flames

To me Vernon is an easy #3 , and then 4 becomes tricky. Big Al isn’t a Flame, he’s a Blue. For me the 4th is Fleury or Kipper

He probably says the same thing though if he makes the team and is getting third- or fourth-line minutes like he probably would have.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

But he was sort of right . Let’s not act like he was trashing a team that has been overly successful the past 30 years

Would be similar to trashing Lucic today and saying he hasn’t scored in 50 games .

I know people like Conroy and Fleury was old and out of shape and exhibition is exhibition , but that statement is a generalization of what a lot of people were thinking during that time and the mantra of the Flames

To me Vernon is an easy #3 , and then 4 becomes tricky. Big Al isn’t a Flame, he’s a Blue. For me the 4th is Fleury or Kipper

803 games as a Flame means nothing? All-time assists leader, and 3rd in points. The guy is the best d-man the Flames ever had, by a mile. Only Conn Smythe winner too.

[HighLifeMan]

To me it's pretty clearly Iginla, Lanny, MacInnis and Kiprusoff.

Iginla is an obvious lock and nothing needs to be said as to why.

MacInnis led the franchise to it's only cup with a Conn Smythe performance and Norris trophy season. He is the franchise leader in assists, and is by far the most productive defensemen in franchise history.

Kiprusoff is the franchise leader in all goaltending categories and was the best goaltender in the world at his peak.

Lanny while likely the least deserving due to his on ice impacts did captain the team to it's only cup victory, has the franchise record in goals in a season (66), and is truly the face and ambassador for the organization and city. He deserves to be there.

Fluery while a very good player holds no franchise records and his off ice antics speak for themselves. He should never represent this organization in any meaningful way.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

In your opinion, I assume?

Anytime anyone posts something, IMO, I think we can assume it's "in their opinion".

IMO, I don't think we need "opinion police" stalking every post.

So you're going to focus on me suggesting the insertion of "in my opinion" and not the person telling everyone how they have to vote?

And I'm the one guilty of being the opinion police?

Ok ...

[TheIronMaiden]

When it comes to historical legacies, and commemoration it is best practice to ask what someone's principal legacy is before taking action. As such the question is not about morality, or political views. The question is Theo's principal legacy his hockey, social work, or his political involvement? If his principal legacy is still hockey, then his politics shouldn't matter. I think there lots of gray area but rightly or wrongly his principal legacy is increasingly politics. Hard to say what the fans want, but I understand why the Flames don't want to open this can of worms.

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

803 games as a Flame means nothing? All-time assists leader, and 3rd in points. The guy is the best d-man the Flames ever had, by a mile. Only Conn Smythe winner too.

He identifies and a Blue and went into the Hall as a blue

Our Mount Rushmore shouldnt include a player who identifies his career with another team

That actually is really sad that we have so few real options in 40 years