[Signing] Flames sign Mangiapane (3 yrs, $5.8 mil AAV)

[oldschoolcalgary]

Good deal... I think it was a bit of an overpay as I was hoping more for 5.25-5.5 but that's just haggling over pretty small numbers.

Good player and good person.

Solid signing.

the 3 years isn't a fluke; a lot of the Flames are coming due at that point. I think that's the Flames current window...but we'll see.

[GreenLantern2814]

You’re only as valuable as your contract in the NHL, and I suspect that at no point will we be lamenting this deal.

[Vansmack]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

Arizona's past deals would say otherwise.

they still need to hit the salary cap floor. Paying .875 to get above the floor is the easiest way for them to achieve this.

You are trying to compare contracts with larger actual dollars owing to this, this is not apples to apples.

The most comparable trade they have made to a potential lucic swap IMO is:
Gostisbehere a 2nd and a 7th for Future Considerations.

Gostisbehere had two years at 4.5 mil per year (with a 2.25 million signing bonus already paid by philly)
Lucic gives them that cap with, with only paying 0.875 million for one year. Surely it would cost significantly less than a 2nd and 7th.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

You’re only as valuable as your contract in the NHL, and I suspect that at no point will we be lamenting this deal.

I think we will all be lamenting the term of this deal in 2 years. He might not outperform it, but he would have been worth another year or two for sure, even if his production plateaus he will be snapped up by the highest bidder as a UFA and there's little chance he's back.

[Atodaso]

Hitman approved.

[CSharp]

Originally Posted by howard_the_duck

Mangi also has a game where I’m not sure how it ages into his 30s. Definitely skilled, but he’s an all effort guy, is undersized, falls about 15 times every game, that all adds up in your 30s (speaking from experience).

Between this and Kylington, this is some tidy business from Tre if you ask me.

LOL, it's either someone comments on a player's skating abilities or falling down on their arses. However, if the guy can score 35 goals on his arse, he's better than a smooth skater guy who lets opposition go right by him and scores. If Mangi scores 30, 40, and then 50 goals mostly on his arse and knees in this next 3 years, I'd be stoked!

[Jason14h]

Originally Posted by Vansmack

they still need to hit the salary cap floor. Paying .875 to get above the floor is the easiest way for them to achieve this.

You are trying to compare contracts with larger actual dollars owing to this, this is not apples to apples.

The most comparable trade they have made to a potential lucic swap IMO is:
Gostisbehere a 2nd and a 7th for Future Considerations.

Gostisbehere had two years at 4.5 mil per year (with a 2.25 million signing bonus already paid by philly)
Lucic gives them that cap with, with only paying 0.875 million for one year. Surely it would cost significantly less than a 2nd and 7th.

It doesnt just have to be a team trying to get to the floor

https://www.spotrac.com/nhl/cap/

Any team significantly below the cap could acquire Lucic and pay him 900$K to play on their 4th line, bring leadership, AND be a nuclear deterent

From a pure real dollar amount, Lucic is the equivalent of any 4th liner.

The question is does cap space have any real value at this point if you are way below the cap. If not, then Lucic would be better then most 4th liners.

You don't get to bank the cap space and take it with you the next season.

Looking at where teams are Arizona, Buff, Anaheim, Hawks and maybe Wings seem to all be potentials

Also - The Flames could take a salary back in the form of a player and actually save the team money.

If a team has a winger with 3 million and 1 year left they want to trade/dump, the Flames could save 2.5 million in cap, and the other team save 2 million in real $$

Lots of options (On paper)

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by Vansmack

they still need to hit the salary cap floor. Paying .875 to get above the floor is the easiest way for them to achieve this.



You are trying to compare contracts with larger actual dollars owing to this, this is not apples to apples.



The most comparable trade they have made to a potential lucic swap IMO is:

Gostisbehere a 2nd and a 7th for Future Considerations.



Gostisbehere had two years at 4.5 mil per year (with a 2.25 million signing bonus already paid by philly)

Lucic gives them that cap with, with only paying 0.875 million for one year. Surely it would cost significantly less than a 2nd and 7th.

This isn't like other years. Arizona is at $59.5 right now, they aren't even close to not making the floor as they were in the past. They still need to sign Crouse and a goalie. Crouse alone gets them to the cap floor.

[SuperMatt18]

I think Anaheim might want Lucic.

Zegras had some teams take some runs at him late in the year last season and I think they could think having Lucic in the lineup might deter some of that.

22 players signed, no remaining RFAs they have to sign. And $18M in cap room.

So for them the $5.25M cap hit doesn't mean a whole lot. They can probably send over a 6th round pick to get Lucic on what is really a 1 year - $1 Million dollar deal for them, and then if they need they can probably move him at the deadline with 50% retained (which is nothing in real money) and get a better pick back.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Jason14h

The question is does cap space have any real value at this point if you are way below the cap. If not, then Lucic would be better then most 4th liners.

You don't get to bank the cap space and take it with you the next season.

You can use it to get assets from other teams having cap problems. Either later in the summer or in mid-season.

[Naitix]

I think Mang scores 40 this year

[GioforPM]

I agree teams have no issue getting to the floor. But some teams have lots of cap because they are in early rebuild stage and have kids on ELCs. They might like a guy to protect them at a low price.

[Kipper_3434]

Love this deal, thought we would have had to give more years for this low of AAV.

[Macman]

Originally Posted by Atodaso

Hitman approved.

Looks like someone misspelled Brett’s name and didn’t even recognize him.

I saw him at the gym once, he said hi to me and I wasn’t even being a fanboy.

But Brett’ s a legend.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

No discount. Term is fine. The time to take advantage was his last contract, not now.
Would be a big shock if Mangi has another gear. He was having problems keeping up with his hot start.

His play driving and chance generation was steady.

Everything went in in the first half, and the luck evened out in the second half ... the result was a 35 goal season.

That's who he was last year. No point in diminishing it.

In the last three seasons he's the 57th most productive forward five on five. That's elite.

It's not a first half of last season blip.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by Bingo

His play driving and chance generation was steady.

Everything went in in the first half, and the luck evened out in the second half ... the result was a 35 goal season.

That's who he was last year. No point in diminishing it.

In the last three seasons he's the 57th most productive forward five on five. That's elite.

It's not a first half of last season blip.

So you are saying he has another gear?

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Bingo

His play driving and chance generation was steady.

Everything went in in the first half, and the luck evened out in the second half ... the result was a 35 goal season.

That's who he was last year. No point in diminishing it.

In the last three seasons he's the 57th most productive forward five on five. That's elite.

It's not a first half of last season blip.

His scoring really didn't translate to the playoffs though. He was nowhere near as bad as some of their other forwards but streaky scorers are hard to depend on.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

I think we will all be lamenting the term of this deal in 2 years. He might not outperform it, but he would have been worth another year or two for sure, even if his production plateaus he will be snapped up by the highest bidder as a UFA and there's little chance he's back.

Eh. By then he’ll be 30.

I don’t want to be paying non-franchise wingers into their 30s.

We get the best years of Mangiapane, and someone else overpays him for 6 or 7 years.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

His scoring really didn't translate to the playoffs though. He was nowhere near as bad as some of their other forwards but streaky scorers are hard to depend on.

Are any scorers in the league who don't regularly see PP1 dependable though? I would say very few at any rate. It's really hard to score consistently when you're not getting 3-4 minutes per night with the team's most gifted players. With Mangiapane, you at least always see him making an impact at both ends, working his tail off and trying.

I would say he will likely fall into the 30/30 category more often than not, but he's definitely capable of more in the right circumstances. Even if he's a 20/30 guy, he's brining so much more to the table that he's easily worth his AAV for the next 4-5 years, let alone this 3 year deal.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

So you are saying he has another gear?

I'm saying he doesn't need one.

With 32 teams having three first line forwards each at 57 you're on average the 2nd best or 3rd best forward on the average NHL team.

You were pointing to his drop in production in the second half as a red flag, I pointed out there isn't one. He's value.