So what are they doing?

[Manhattanboy]

Ya Treliving & Company are still shell shocked. Feel terrible for him.

[activeStick]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

First line is missing a puck carrier - that was Johnny's job and that's what his camp complained about that nobody else was able to help.



Toffoli is just a finisher who needs a Gaudreau/Suzuki to feed him passes. He's a slower veteran now but can still contribute if he has a playmaker with him. I don't think he fits on the top line.

Hmm I think Tkachuk is now the best playmaker left on this team though.

[activeStick]

Originally Posted by Burning Beard

I feel like a lot of people discredit the contributions of Darryl Sutter here. He is going to use the walking of Gadreau as ammo to turn this team into an even tighter checking and more relentless team.



I remember all the people saying they were going to be terrible last off season too and it looks like they are right back at it again this off season. Trust Sutter hockey!

Yes, really great point. Sutter's always been a master motivator even in the absence of external "haters" but has that this coming season and you can bet he'll use it perfectly.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by activeStick

Hmm I think Tkachuk is now the best playmaker left on this team though.

Tkachuk is a good stationary playmaker. Not as good making a play in motion.

[flamesrule_kipper34]

The irony that Columbus produced this after Panarin and Bob ran away in FA in 2019.

If I'm Treliving and Sutter I'm plastering this hard and squeezing everything out of this group this upcoming year (and using it as a hard pitch for Chucky to stay):

https://twitter.com/user/status/1180258042912182272

[chedder]

Originally Posted by activeStick

Hmm I think Tkachuk is now the best playmaker left on this team though.

Lindy

[Macman]

It’s obviously created some uncertainty with Gaudreau leaving but now the team has to find a way forward. Thankfully the Flames have some good people to make decisions and possibly had a plan B. Treliving, Conroy, Sutter and others including the ownership group.

There doesn’t seem to be a lot available via free agency, Laine and Kadri?

I think Tkachuk will re-sign beyond the one year deal and Mangiapane will be traded and that’s where we’ll get a player or two for the top line.

[TheSquatch]

This has come down to being not quite a "worst case" scenario, but it's close. It's the Flamesiest thing ever - to go all in with a year where the team did really well, and then kinda sputter in the playoffs. Now Gaudreau leaves.

So. Whether Tkachuk stays or goes, the team isn't going to be better over the next two years - losing JG hurts.

The bad news is that the "all in" mentality this year *which was warranted* has left the team poor in terms of draft capital. You hate to see a Jarnkrok go elsewhere, when BT paid a LOT to get that guy here. Paid for Toffoli too. Hopefully he has a good year.

But there's no knight in shining armour coming, this team is worse than it was.

Light at the end of this year's tunnel though - Monahan and Lucic come off the books next year, freeing up all kinds of cap space and presumably signalling the end of the "Johnny and Monny" Flames, who basically did SFA over the years. We only got excited because compared to the "young guns" era, this was good.

So this year to me is just a holding-pattern, I don't expect a big trade, a big UFA, I hope not. Ditch the dead-weight contracts and try to do something good a year from now.

The biggest problem I see is that a good portion of the team is just... not great, and it's partly about value, guys like Coleman need to do more for their 5 million. Toffoli, Dube, these guys are going to need to bring more than the did last year.


So we'll see. It's the quintessential Flames, in some ways - grind hard, maybe make the playoffs, draft mid-pack if you have a draft at all, and wonder why the team isn't great.

[Macindoc]

Originally Posted by Goriders

Looking at the Flames in capfriendly. The Lucic and Monahan contracts will stop them from bringing in a Gaudreau equivalent.

Still need to get Tkachuk, Mangiapane and Kylington signed.

Somehow dumping monahan would be a blessing. He’s a big boat anchor at this point. You still get value out of Lucic in my mind.

I don’t see an easy way of replacing Gaudreau’s output unless Treliving can pull a rabbit out of a hat. Johnny leaving without getting anything in return is pretty devistating. To get an equivilent player we’d have to give up something else at this point. Or throw a boatload of cash at Kadri in desperation.

People have discussed Tkachuk resigning but Mangiapane has a lot more leverage now too.

Treliving is going to need a good therapist after all of this is over. I honestly think Johnny will end up getting him fired. Fun business to be in.

Monahan is currently on LTIR, and if they sign someone to replace him, precedents have been set in the NHL in the past few years in which a player simply waits on LTIR until there is cap space to fit them onto the roster, or until the playoffs. There are already rumours out there about a Lucic trade to a team trying to reach the cap floor. So there can be room for significant signings.

[combustiblefuel]

Originally Posted by TheSquatch

This has come down to being not quite a "worst case" scenario, but it's close. It's the Flamesiest thing ever - to go all in with a year where the team did really well, and then kinda sputter in the playoffs. Now Gaudreau leaves.

So. Whether Tkachuk stays or goes, the team isn't going to be better over the next two years - losing JG hurts.

The bad news is that the "all in" mentality this year *which was warranted* has left the team poor in terms of draft capital. You hate to see a Jarnkrok go elsewhere, when BT paid a LOT to get that guy here. Paid for Toffoli too. Hopefully he has a good year.

But there's no knight in shining armour coming, this team is worse than it was.

Light at the end of this year's tunnel though - Monahan and Lucic come off the books next year, freeing up all kinds of cap space and presumably signalling the end of the "Johnny and Monny" Flames, who basically did SFA over the years. We only got excited because compared to the "young guns" era, this was good.

So this year to me is just a holding-pattern, I don't expect a big trade, a big UFA, I hope not. Ditch the dead-weight contracts and try to do something good a year from now.

The biggest problem I see is that a good portion of the team is just... not great, and it's partly about value, guys like Coleman need to do more for their 5 million. Toffoli, Dube, these guys are going to need to bring more than the did last year.


So we'll see. It's the quintessential Flames, in some ways - grind hard, maybe make the playoffs, draft mid-pack if you have a draft at all, and wonder why the team isn't great.

This is the way.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Macindoc

Monahan is currently on LTIR, and if they sign someone to replace him, precedents have been set in the NHL in the past few years in which a player simply waits on LTIR until there is cap space to fit them onto the roster, or until the playoffs.

Every team has to be cap-compliant on the first day of the season without LTIR, and only then can assign players to LTIR. Every year, teams go through extraordinary gyrations, papering players down to the AHL, announcing reduced opening-day rosters, placing their eligible players on LTIR and then calling the papered players back up again.

[Monahammer]

Ok, well. With the 2nd big nut kick out of the way, we now know for sure that the flames are without the two offensive drivers heading into next season. Hopefully this is enough to crush ownership's nagging belief that scratching into the playoffs is better than rebuilding.

I hope the team immediately goes to market with Markstrom: We have Wolf that could use NHL play time, a very strong 1 B in Vladar who can carry a load, and frankly playing both of them more in NHL should allow us to assess how we move forward. On the other end, Markstrom is a relatively young, consistent, Vezina candidate on a controlled contract. We should be able to get a reasonable asset for him.

Lindholm should be given the choice to stay or go to a contender around deadline.

Hanifin should be priority 3, followed by checking in with Coleman and seeing if he feels like moving on

[Jiri Hrdina]

The market for Markstrom is likely limited now. The goalie musical chairs game has already been played. He likely has value during the season or towards the deadline, as someone will need a goalie after realizing the goalie they bet on isn't good enough (cough Toronto). If not then next off-season.

Trading Markstrom now is probably the worst time.

[Monahammer]

I agree Markstrom's value was better a few weeks ago. But I think he's someone you need to shop for a while prior to moving. Just getting the ball rolling on that might be worthwhile.

[SeanCharles]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

Ok, well. With the 2nd big nut kick out of the way, we now know for sure that the flames are without the two offensive drivers heading into next season. Hopefully this is enough to crush ownership's nagging belief that scratching into the playoffs is better than rebuilding.

I hope the team immediately goes to market with Markstrom: We have Wolf that could use NHL play time, a very strong 1 B in Vladar who can carry a load, and frankly playing both of them more in NHL should allow us to assess how we move forward. On the other end, Markstrom is a relatively young, consistent, Vezina candidate on a controlled contract. We should be able to get a reasonable asset for him.

Lindholm should be given the choice to stay or go to a contender around deadline.

Hanifin should be priority 3, followed by checking in with Coleman and seeing if he feels like moving on

I agree with all of this other than playing Wolf in the NHL.

We should get another goalie back in a Markstrom swap to tandem with Vladar until Wolf has some more experience. I don't want to screw up the best goalie prospect we've had in ages by rushing him..

If he is ready sure but I don't want to force that upon him.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

The market for Markstrom is likely limited now. The goalie musical chairs game has already been played. He likely has value during the season or towards the deadline, as someone will need a goalie after realizing the goalie they bet on isn't good enough (cough Toronto). If not then next off-season.

Trading Markstrom now is probably the worst time.

I think Markstrom just needs to be gone regardless of the the value if they tank. Him and Lindholm will steal some games

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Bonded

I think Markstrom just needs to be gone regardless of the the value if they tank. Him and Lindholm will steal some games

Well they aren't going to tank.
I don't see that being the route. They are going to try to re-set things, but it's not going to be full tank.

[Jore]

Markstrom and Tanev should go as quickly as possible because they would likely keep the team from bottoming out completely

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I agree Markstrom's value was better a few weeks ago. But I think he's someone you need to shop for a while prior to moving. Just getting the ball rolling on that might be worthwhile.

I think if you are taking you move him right before the season, when a coupe teams have their caps more settled and then look at their goalies and say "ew".

It may take some convincing though, as well. Markstrom really wanted that NTC.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

The market for Markstrom is likely limited now. The goalie musical chairs game has already been played. He likely has value during the season or towards the deadline, as someone will need a goalie after realizing the goalie they bet on isn't good enough (cough Toronto). If not then next off-season.

Trading Markstrom now is probably the worst time.

That will change quick. A bunch of teams took on questionable starters. By the TDL, the market will be totally open again for a reliable goalie. Under Sutter, even with a fizzled out offence in front, Markstrom should be able to put up good numbers, which will increase his value.