Practice notes March 24 - Monahan & Lewis to be scratched next game?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Yeah this is Darryl Sutter giving the player a soft landing. He's on top of everything, he didn't just realize he blew it in handling Monahan.

He could still be hurt, for sure. But this is the coach setting the table to scratch a veteran player without humiliating him.

Maybe. Sutter’s comments usually have a gain of truth to them, even when he’s playing the press. Monahan all year has taken very short shifts. And his better games have often come with some time between. I think while he is technically recovered he maybe has stamina issues.

Game management is a thing that teams should do if they can afford to, like the Raptors with Leonard.

Though it’s certainly possible his wrists or hips are permanently damaged such that he just can’t do it any more, rest or not.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Not from me. I have argued that both need to go and have certainly showed my displeasure for Backlund since MacKinnon basically destroyed him in the playoffs.

It's kind of laughable how you always singled handled blamed that on Backlund.

Look at the head to head at 5v5 in that series.

Backlund vs MacKinnon:

TOI: 51 Minutes
Corsi For: 52.1%
xGF: 54.0%
HDCF: 66.7%
On Ice Shooting: 0.00%
On Ice Save: .914
PDO: .914

Goals For: 0
Goals Against: 3

Backlund got unlucky that series and got PDO'd against a guy that is a top 5 player in the league. His +/- has been poor in the playoffs recently, but when you are getting defensive matchups against top players in the league that will happen. It wasn't just on Backlund that Mackinnon found a way to get behind our defense for breakaways / odd man rushes in that series.

Acting like that somehow makes him a bad player is hilarious.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

I don’t think his shot is the problem at all. Anyone remember the last goal he scored? That absolute rocket on Hellebuyck? He still has a hard shot and he was still very productive on the PP before he was removed. So his skills are still there.

The problem in my opinion has always been his ability to get it off. The majority of his scoring in the past came off of getting open/lost in the slot. But now, without Gaudreau creating time and space for Monahan, he’s not getting the same type of opportunities anymore. It was the biggest fear I had for Monahan coming into the season and the main reason I predicted a very serious goal scoring dip for him.

If he had developed better one vs one skills over his career such as masking his shot, shooting at angles and being more unpredictable, then he’d probably have more goals today. But as of now, his shots are all telegraphed and very easy to defend. Quite simply put, there’s just not enough weapons in his arsenal.

This sounds true, and he does seem to get blocked more and/or not get his shot off quickly. But if so, the solution is not to play him with guys that create no time and space on his line. It’s either play him with the Mangiapanes, Colemans, Toffolis white whom he’s at least been on the positive side of both fancy stats and plus minus, or as is happening now, don’t bother playing him. Expecting him to be productive between Lewis, who is 100% a defensive player and Lucic, who has hit a serious wall since December, is a little unrealistic.

[SuperMatt18]

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Tkachuk
Coleman - Backlund - Toffoli
Mangiapane - Monahan - Jarnkrok
Lucic - Carpenter - Dube

I would really like to see those 4 lines...but it would require Lewis coming out of the lineup which is very unlikely to ever happen.

[Dude Where's Makar?]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Gaudreau - Lindholm - Tkachuk
Coleman - Backlund - Toffoli
Mangiapane - Monahan - Jarnkrok
Lucic - Carpenter - Dube

I would really like to see those 4 lines...but it would require Lewis coming out of the lineup which is very unlikely to ever happen.

I love the look of that lineup. Maybe two players with good motors like Jarnkrok and Mangi could help Sean thrive. I hope this healthy scratch lights a fire under him. Can't help but root for the guy after all he's given to this franchise.

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

It's interesting that Monahan gets so much negative coverage, but Backlund gets the perpetual pass. Is it simply because the expectations were so much higher for Monahan? Backlund has had better linemates all season long, plus powerplay time, and has 7 points more than Monahan in fewer minutes. Even defensively, I see heavy lifting being done by Coleman, and I though I saw more backchecking energy from Jarnkrok than I've seen from Backlund all season.

Is there really such a huge discrepancy between these two players? Both wear a letter. Both are 'nice guys'. One guy gets a pass, and hasn't been the defensive stalwart we have seen years past. The other guy has taken his defensive deficiency and turned it into league average. Our second line center has 29 points. Our fourth line center has 22 points.

I don't even know where to begin with this post and I'm amazed it got three likes as I type this.

If you cannot see the vast differences between Backlund and Monahan this season then I wonder if you own a TV.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

I don't even know where to begin with this post and I'm amazed it got three likes as I type this.

If you cannot see the vast differences between Backlund and Monahan this season then I wonder if you own a TV.

Ugh sadly some fans will never get away from defending a player like Monahan to the grave for no rational reason. Once they've stooped to dragging a guy like Backlund into the mud, you know they're in full delusional spin mode with no way out.

[bdubbs]

Sometimes I see the Backlund haters and wonder if it's not Where RU Chris o Sullivan hiding under a different name

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

It's interesting that Monahan gets so much negative coverage, but Backlund gets the perpetual pass. Is it simply because the expectations were so much higher for Monahan? Backlund has had better linemates all season long, plus powerplay time, and has 7 points more than Monahan in fewer minutes. Even defensively, I see heavy lifting being done by Coleman, and I though I saw more backchecking energy from Jarnkrok than I've seen from Backlund all season.

Is there really such a huge discrepancy between these two players? Both wear a letter. Both are 'nice guys'. One guy gets a pass, and hasn't been the defensive stalwart we have seen years past. The other guy has taken his defensive deficiency and turned it into league average. Our second line center has 29 points. Our fourth line center has 22 points.

Backlund has been doing a superb job shutting down opposition top players on a nightly basis. Monahan has not.

[howard_the_duck]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

It's interesting that Monahan gets so much negative coverage, but Backlund gets the perpetual pass. Is it simply because the expectations were so much higher for Monahan? Backlund has had better linemates all season long, plus powerplay time, and has 7 points more than Monahan in fewer minutes. Even defensively, I see heavy lifting being done by Coleman, and I though I saw more backchecking energy from Jarnkrok than I've seen from Backlund all season.

Is there really such a huge discrepancy between these two players? Both wear a letter. Both are 'nice guys'. One guy gets a pass, and hasn't been the defensive stalwart we have seen years past. The other guy has taken his defensive deficiency and turned it into league average. Our second line center has 29 points. Our fourth line center has 22 points.

By what measure are you saying he isn't holding up as strong defensively?

He plays against the toughest competition every night and the team's record is on pace to be top 3 all-time in the history of the franchise.

You want to compare what he brings to the team vs Monahan? THIS season? It's not even close.

[CsInMyBlood]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

Ugh sadly some fans will never get away from defending a player like Monahan to the grave for no rational reason. Once they've stooped to dragging a guy like Backlund into the mud, you know they're in full delusional spin mode with no way out.

Honestly it's been crazy reading some of the posts since it was announced Monahan might be sitting out. I cannot understand why would anyone be surprised or upset that this is happening.

Sean Monahan deserves to sit.

[TheSquatch]

He deserves physio and a nap.

Hopefully he can get it.

[Hack&Lube]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

It's interesting that Monahan gets so much negative coverage, but Backlund gets the perpetual pass. Is it simply because the expectations were so much higher for Monahan? Backlund has had better linemates all season long, plus powerplay time, and has 7 points more than Monahan in fewer minutes. Even defensively, I see heavy lifting being done by Coleman, and I though I saw more backchecking energy from Jarnkrok than I've seen from Backlund all season.

Is there really such a huge discrepancy between these two players? Both wear a letter. Both are 'nice guys'. One guy gets a pass, and hasn't been the defensive stalwart we have seen years past. The other guy has taken his defensive deficiency and turned it into league average. Our second line center has 29 points. Our fourth line center has 22 points.

Its because Backlund isn't costing us $6,375,000 in cap and being the most expensive 4th liner center in the league.

[CalgaryFan1988]

Its like people seem to forget that the recovery for Monahan's hip surgery is a season. I'm a Monahan fan and I'm fine with him being scratched, Flames have the depth now, so why not?

[CalgaryFan1988]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

Its because Backlund isn't costing us $6,375,000 in cap and being the most expensive 4th liner center in the league.

Injuries happen, some of you act like the money is coming out of your own wallet.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

It's kind of laughable how you always singled handled blamed that on Backlund.

Look at the head to head at 5v5 in that series.

Backlund vs MacKinnon:

TOI: 51 Minutes
Corsi For: 52.1%
xGF: 54.0%
HDCF: 66.7%
On Ice Shooting: 0.00%
On Ice Save: .914
PDO: .914

Goals For: 0
Goals Against: 3

Backlund got unlucky that series and got PDO'd against a guy that is a top 5 player in the league. His +/- has been poor in the playoffs recently, but when you are getting defensive matchups against top players in the league that will happen. It wasn't just on Backlund that Mackinnon found a way to get behind our defense for breakaways / odd man rushes in that series.

Acting like that somehow makes him a bad player is hilarious.

Before this year he goes AWOL for half a season every season and this year he has done it the whole year. He is not a 2nd line player, he is not the player he was offensively or defensively for that matter, and he makes at least 2.5M a year more than he should on a team that is tight on cap. I never said he was a bad player, I said he is a bad player for half a year and then outstanding for the other half up until this year. This year the bad player ended up staying. Why must some of this fan base always make excuses for veterans players when they fall off a cliff?

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Mathgod

Backlund has been doing a superb job shutting down opposition top players on a nightly basis. Monahan has not.

This is simply not true and a total fabrication based on the players abilities in the past. Elias Lindholm has been superb defensively, Backlund loses his coverage a lot this year.

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Before this year he goes AWOL for half a season every season and this year he has done it the whole year. He is not a 2nd line player, he is not the player he was offensively or defensively for that matter, and he makes at least 2.5M a year more than he should on a team that is tight on cap. I never said he was a bad player, I said he is a bad player for half a year and then outstanding for the other half up until this year. This year the bad player ended up staying. Why must some of this fan base always make excuses for veterans players when they fall off a cliff?

Backlund's GA/60 5 on 5 among regular forwards is 10th best in the NHL and best on the Flames. His xGA/60 is 26th best in the NHL and 2nd best on the Flames. I'd say he's performing his role and doing so extremely well.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

This sounds true, and he does seem to get blocked more and/or not get his shot off quickly. But if so, the solution is not to play him with guys that create no time and space on his line. It’s either play him with the Mangiapanes, Colemans, Toffolis white whom he’s at least been on the positive side of both fancy stats and plus minus, or as is happening now, don’t bother playing him. Expecting him to be productive between Lewis, who is 100% a defensive player and Lucic, who has hit a serious wall since December, is a little unrealistic.

That’s right. I thought the ideal linemate for him going into the season was Blake Coleman who has a ton of pace to his game and can forecheck effectively. But the coaching staff seems to have pinned him to Backlund for most of the season.

I could actually see a Mangiapane-Monahan-Coleman line being pretty good, but the problem is, Backlund in my opinion is the better option with those guys. So Monahan in the end is kind of SOL here.

There’s probably still the old Sean Monahan somewhere in the NHL, but I don’t think it’ll be under Darryl. Maybe a Clayton Keller, Blake Wheeler or a Jakub Voracek can get Monahan back on track. I’m sure some GM will give him a shot with a great playmaker and I wouldn’t be surprised if he gets back to 20+ goals again.

Monahan is just a very weird player to me. He has a hard accurate shot, but a very small little window in which he can get it off. He’s a pretty good passer and has surprisingly good vision, but again seems to have a very limited window. His top speed is actually pretty good, but it takes him too long to get to that gear. He’s almost the exact opposite of Johnny in that regard.

He’s got a lot of good tools, but his components are seemingly incomplete. It might stem from his lack of agility and a poor first step. But it’s hard to pinpoint. The one thing he does have that could turn around his career offensively is his hockey IQ. He can play with top tier players and compliment them which not everybody can do. So, I don’t think this is the end of the road for him yet. Maybe his career goes the Sam Bennett route or it could just as easily end up going the Kyle Turris route. I don’t know how it’ll work out for him, but it’ll be interesting to follow.

[gvitaly]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Before this year he goes AWOL for half a season every season and this year he has done it the whole year. He is not a 2nd line player, he is not the player he was offensively or defensively for that matter, and he makes at least 2.5M a year more than he should on a team that is tight on cap. I never said he was a bad player, I said he is a bad player for half a year and then outstanding for the other half up until this year. This year the bad player ended up staying. Why must some of this fan base always make excuses for veterans players when they fall off a cliff?

He didn’t fall off a cliff, his offense dropped without Tkachuk on his line, which is understandable. He was never given a chance on PP1, and he has been used intermittently on PP2.

He is a part of one of the best PK’s this year. He consistently plays more at the opposition’s end than his own, while playing against top competition. Not to mention that Coleman - Backlund - Mangiapane was one of the best lines this season.

I think that you have your opinion already made up about Backlund, so his mistakes get magnified. Meanwhile, all the good plays he makes get shrugged off. At his cap hit he definitely helps this team win more than the average $5M UFA forward.