2022 Freedumb Convoy(s) Thread

[wireframe]

I agree 100% that the Russians are doing what they can to stoke the flames. I'm saying that the house is already on fire.


If Russia is not the primary cause, we need to move past blaming them and address the real source of the problem. I personally think that the US conservative media machine did more to promote the Freedom Convoy than any other group.

[TopChed]

Originally Posted by Raekwon

Is it an online bubble though? I don't see too many legitimate news sources on TV anymore or any I would trust as only reporting the facts. Yes online is the biggest issue but its in mainstream TV media now also and its sad.

I haven't had a huge issue with the Canadian TV coverage of the convoy, and actually thought CBC and CTV did a good job of it.

From what I've seen covering Ukraine, it seems fairly accurate as well.

I think it's a huge reach to say that mainstream media is anywhere near as much of a problem as social media for misinformation. Unless you're strictly speaking about Fox.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by wireframe

I agree 100% that the Russians are doing what they can to stoke the flames. I'm saying that the house is already on fire.


If Russia is not the primary cause, we need to move past blaming them and address the real source of the problem. I personally think that the US conservative media machine did more to promote the Freedom Convoy than any other group.

Right, who are heavily influenced by?

Again, I didn’t mean to imply that this was 100% blame on Russian influence. Not at all. Just fanning the flames as you say of a problem that exists already.

[powderjunkie]

I see at as Russians providing the connective tissue for these radical movements to grow. There have always been conspiracy theorists scattered all over the place, but rarely could they gain any traction with others.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by wireframe

I totally believe that social media algorithms are guiding vulnerable people toward extremism. People are clearly escalating from disliking Justin Trudeau to insane conspiracy theories. I also believe that the Russian state is trying to spread dis-information these platforms.



Where I'm skepitcal is that Russia is the primary cause of this rising extremism online. There are people in North America spreading the same level of disinfomation, then the Twitter or Facebook algorithm points the terror-curious further and further down the rabbit-hole. I don't see why it has to be Russia. Is Russia that much more effective at spreading dis-information than Fox News + Joe Rogan + Jordan Peterson?


Does anyone have a source to suggest that Russia is the original source of any of this? Seems like wishful thinking by people who want to blame an outside actor.

Fox News literally didn’t drop pro-Russian talking points until the sanctions cut off the money.

These trolls are sitting in a building somewhere doing nothing but interacting with inflammatory content in inflammatory ways. The algorithm doesn’t have a defense for that.

A non-conspiratorial example - for months, I was getting a clip entitled “Major Lennox Answered with his LIFE” on YouTube. It was from an old British show called Sharpe, with Sean Bean.

I didn’t watch it for weeks. I’d see the thumbnail with some old man doing crazy eyes, and I’d consciously decide “nope, not doing it”.

Well, eventually I did find out what Major Lennox had answered with his life for, and without clicking a like button or leaving a comment, I had (and still have) Sharpe videos clogging up my feed.

Now imagine that multiplied by a thousand. Or ten thousand. Or a million. And apply it to posts about immigrants, Black Lives Matter, Hunter Biden, Justin Trudeau, the EU, pronouns, etc.

The Russians don’t even need to create this stuff - Americans do it for them. They just need to like and share. Hit The angry emoji. Leave a comment.

The damage is done.

[GreenLantern2814]

The current top-29 twitter trends in Canada make no mention of Justin Trudeau. Tamara Lich is 15th, ahead of “Brian Jean” and “Bernier”. No rallying cries about freedom, or “resign Trudeau”.

Silence.

It cannot be a coincidence.

These people stopped having their voices amplified, and their reach has vanished.

[badradio]

I don’t doubt Russia had it’s hand in creating chaos, but at what point do these social media companies take responsibility? Facebook enabling, profiting, and encouraging social divide should be held accountable. I’m hoping a socially responsible company comes along and wipes out the cesspool like Facebook and the internet can go back to cat videos, and not sharing other peoples cat videos but actual content creation, this whole “sharing” thing is just lazy and people don’t take full ownership in the things they “share.” But do we wait until the market dictates that? Or do we start regulating these companies that are hurting society?

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by badradio

I don’t doubt Russia had it’s hand in creating chaos, but at what point do these social media companies take responsibility? Facebook enabling, profiting, and encouraging social divide should be held accountable. I’m hoping a socially responsible company comes along and wipes out the cesspool like Facebook and the internet can go back to cat videos, and not sharing other peoples cat videos but actual content creation, this whole “sharing” thing is just lazy and people don’t take full ownership in the things they “share.” But do we wait until the market dictates that? Or do we start regulating these companies that are hurting society?

Well, with the invasion of Ukraine, they blocked Russian access to their platforms.

When the MAGA heads had their insurrection on January 6th, they deplatformed Trump.

Both times, things got better right away.

We might actually figure out a solution to this social media mess once the shooting stops - there will certainly be the public appetite and will for it.

[Red Slinger]

Originally Posted by badradio

I don’t doubt Russia had it’s hand in creating chaos, but at what point do these social media companies take responsibility? Facebook enabling, profiting, and encouraging social divide should be held accountable. I’m hoping a socially responsible company comes along and wipes out the cesspool like Facebook and the internet can go back to cat videos, and not sharing other peoples cat videos but actual content creation, this whole “sharing” thing is just lazy and people don’t take full ownership in the things they “share.” But do we wait until the market dictates that? Or do we start regulating these companies that are hurting society?

That would be great but as long as profit is the primary motive it won't happen.

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by Red Slinger

That would be great but as long as profit is the primary motive it won't happen.

But but but… private companies will self-regulate, won’t they? Isn’t the threat of civil lawsuits a good enough reason for why red tape and regulations need to be cut at all moments?

[wireframe]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

Right, who are heavily influenced by?

Again, I didn’t mean to imply that this was 100% blame on Russian influence. Not at all. Just fanning the flames as you say of a problem that exists already.

Money. They're influenced by money. It's much more profitable to do what they're doing than report the real news.

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

I see at as Russians providing the connective tissue for these radical movements to grow. There have always been conspiracy theorists scattered all over the place, but rarely could they gain any traction with others.

Social media platforms are providing connective tissue. That better explains how conspiracy theorists meet each other than Russians connecting them

Originally Posted by badradio

I don’t doubt Russia had it’s hand in creating chaos, but at what point do these social media companies take responsibility? Facebook enabling, profiting, and encouraging social divide should be held accountable. I’m hoping a socially responsible company comes along and wipes out the cesspool like Facebook and the internet can go back to cat videos, and not sharing other peoples cat videos but actual content creation, this whole “sharing” thing is just lazy and people don’t take full ownership in the things they “share.” But do we wait until the market dictates that? Or do we start regulating these companies that are hurting society?

I think this is exactly the point. Yes, Russia would like to create chaos. But we are doing it to ourselves and social media is making it possible, even encouraging it.

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by wireframe

I think this is exactly the point. Yes, Russia would like to create chaos. But we are doing it to ourselves and social media is making it possible, even encouraging it.

Are we doing it to ourselves, or are the many bots making it look like there is large support for a fringe idea?

Or are you saying that western companies are doing it to themselves with their bot support and this bot support should be disabled? If so, I completely agree with this

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

When you've been duped, its impossible to admit it. You would have to go through some kind of mental dislocation and these guys aren't up for it.

Just like with any unhealthy habit or addiction

You're not going to make a change until you get to a place where you actually recognize you have a problem.

Unfortunately, with things like misinformation spreading and rallying for conspiracy theories, unless you do something to get in trouble with the law or lose your job like what happened to the people that went to Ottawa, there usually isn't a consequence harsh enough to make you stop and reflect upon your choices.

Most are able to just keep contributing a little bit every day to making the world a worse, less-informed and more divided place and still feel content and dignified (although I'm sure most aren't actually happy if they are actively partaking in this ####), because they won't see direct negative effects of their choices.

Only something major like a war at home would dwarf all this BS to the point where these people would gain enough perspective to see that the #### they've been hammering on about for months or years was a waste of time and that even pandemic life under a PM they didn't agree with was still a pretty damn good life that shouldn't have been taken for granted.

Until that point, there will still be people that you can show these photos of deceased Ukrainian children to and they'll tell you either that it's fake or that Putin is justified, because they're just that far gone.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by badradio

I don’t doubt Russia had it’s hand in creating chaos, but at what point do these social media companies take responsibility? Facebook enabling, profiting, and encouraging social divide should be held accountable. I’m hoping a socially responsible company comes along and wipes out the cesspool like Facebook and the internet can go back to cat videos, and not sharing other peoples cat videos but actual content creation, this whole “sharing” thing is just lazy and people don’t take full ownership in the things they “share.” But do we wait until the market dictates that? Or do we start regulating these companies that are hurting society?

People that are gullible and drawn to conspiracy theories are always going to be easily led in the wrong direction. I don't think regulating Facebook and other websites will matter as the people trying to encourage chaos will find other avenues online to get their messages across. I think we need to do a better job of teaching people what's right and IMO politicians and leaders need to he held to a higher standard as their transgressions are largely responsible for cynical attitudes that are easily manipulated.

[Fuzz]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1499150255866134540

https://twitter.com/user/status/1499150723749187585


Oh man, Ezra is going to be cranky. Political prisoner! Better treatment in Russia! Justin's Stooges!

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

https://twitter.com/user/status/1499150255866134540

https://twitter.com/user/status/1499150723749187585

No rush, sir.

Take all the time you need.

All the time.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Oh man, Ezra is going to be cranky. Political prisoner! Better treatment in Russia! Justin's Stooges!

Ezra is one of the most despicable people in Canada.

[badradio]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

People that are gullible and drawn to conspiracy theories are always going to be easily led in the wrong direction. I don't think regulating Facebook and other websites will matter as the people trying to encourage chaos will find other avenues online to get their messages across. I think we need to do a better job of teaching people what's right and IMO politicians and leaders need to he held to a higher standard as their transgressions are largely responsible for cynical attitudes that are easily manipulated.

True, there will always be part of the fringe population that will look to create chaos, but the problem is these people have platform and a megaphone… When you are bombarded by lies every single day and it seems like the majority of people around you are convinced by these lies, you don’t have to be gullible to start questioning your own beliefs in what is truth. I live in rural Alberta and I’ve saw people turn first hand because of this and it seems to snowball, if you see it enough maybe it is true? And that’s the whole problem, something that could fixed by these platforms I’d they had a conscience. Keep the fringe in the fringe and don’t give them daylight.

[FormerPresJamesTaylor]

Hold the line, Tamara

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Ezra is one of the most despicable people in Canada.

Every so often I scroll through the Rebel twitter feed, just to see how bad it is. It's far worse than you can imagine, and I understand you have been through war, so can imagine an aweful lot. They have one article I didn't read about how the sanctions are hard on every day Russians. Nothing on Ukrainians being murdered in their homes, though.