11-02-2021, 03:25 PM
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#741
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: CGY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GhostCookie
I don't see how that solves their cap issues. They have space right now due to LTIR, but Pacioretty is supposed to be back late November, Tuch in Feb, Stone is apparently close, and Whitecloud is week to week. With those players back in the lineup, they would need to send down or waive around 4.5 million to be cap compliant. They would definitely not be able to fit Eichel's salary if he was cleared prior to the playoffs.
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I think what they could do is make the trade then move Eichel to LTIR. I wouldn’t be surprised if we had a Kucherov situation if that went down but I could see Vegas making that deal and figuring out the cap piece later.
For instance I believe the Flames would have to take Eichel’s full $10M cap hit but once the deal was done they could move Eichel into LTIR then free up that cap space.
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11-02-2021, 03:33 PM
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#742
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Scoring Winger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blankall
The Vegas offer is actually a lot, depending on how you view Krebs. Tuch is a 25 year old 20+ goal and 50+ point scorer. He's probably somewhere between Dube and Mangiapane in value. Krebs has a ton of talent. He destroyed the AHL, but has been useless in the NHL. Maybe He's on par with Valimaki.
Maybe:
Dube + Valimaki + 1st + second?
Maybe Buffalo just prefers the Vegas players and/or sees Tuch as more on the level with Mangiapane and wants him out of Calgary.
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Yup, it is a lot to offer. But definitely one the flames could beat, if those were indeed the pieces.
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11-02-2021, 03:34 PM
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#743
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Acerbic Cyberbully
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: back in Chilliwack
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Doesn't Buffalo have to take a significant chunk of salary back? I thought the reason they had not yet moved Eichel to LTIR was in order to stay above the cap floor. With Tuch already on LTIR, this does not help in that regard.
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11-02-2021, 03:37 PM
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#744
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Textcritic
Doesn't Buffalo have to take a significant chunk of salary back? I thought the reason they had not yet moved Eichel to LTIR was in order to stay above the cap floor. With Tuch already on LTIR, this does not help in that regard.
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Buffalo wouldn't have to keep Tuch on LTIR. Instead, they could count his salary to keep them above the floor. Eichel isn't on LTIR now.
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11-02-2021, 03:38 PM
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#745
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#1 Goaltender
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Weekes: Flames, Golden Knights among finalists for Eichel
Quote:
Originally Posted by Textcritic
Doesn't Buffalo have to take a significant chunk of salary back? I thought the reason they had not yet moved Eichel to LTIR was in order to stay above the cap floor. With Tuch already on LTIR, this does not help in that regard.
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I think they need about $4.5-$5 million in salary back if they lose eichel.
So the flames could send back Zadorov + Valimaki and I think it would be enough salary to keep Buffalo above the cap floor.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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11-02-2021, 03:40 PM
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#746
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Crash and Bang Winger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinny01
I think what they could do is make the trade then move Eichel to LTIR. I wouldn’t be surprised if we had a Kucherov situation if that went down but I could see Vegas making that deal and figuring out the cap piece later.
For instance I believe the Flames would have to take Eichel’s full $10M cap hit but once the deal was done they could move Eichel into LTIR then free up that cap space.
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I think you are right, I think Vegas would also have to clear some (not all due to their current LTIR relief) salary as well to make the deal, and then put Eichel on LTIR. The reason I am doubtful of the Kucherov situation is that there are 31 other GM's who will be out to cause problems for Vegas if they try the same thing. Kucherov was all about timing, as his projected clearance was right around the playoffs and that matched the procedure he had done. Kind of hard to say Eichel isn't cleared until the playoffs if he is looking to be ready around the Olympic break. Although if we lost out on Jack, it would be something to savor watching Vegas try and hide him only to end up getting raked over the coals after his agent makes a very public pitch for him to be included on team USA.
I am also equally adamant, no one waives any trade protections they have to end up on Buffalo, so that limits salaries going back to either valuable long term parts like Theodore, or contracts expiring this year, like Smith. It would also make for a very interesting off season for Vegas cap-wise.
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11-02-2021, 03:42 PM
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#747
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Franchise Player
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Flames need to move out 8.95 million of AAV in salary in an Eichel trade to be cap compliant. So any combination that adds up to that (or more)
Salary of Monahan + Valimaki + Zary pretty much does it from a cap perspective for both teams. Calgary stays below the cap and Buffalo is above the floor.
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11-02-2021, 03:48 PM
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#748
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Franchise Player
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they could also run with a 21 or 22 man roster, to shave that number a little
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11-02-2021, 03:50 PM
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#749
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enoch Root
they could also run with a 21 or 22 man roster, to shave that number a little
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They could but we know that's not how tree rolls. He's going to want depth at the fingertips at all times.
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11-02-2021, 03:59 PM
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#750
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Alberta
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I did not hear this myself, but apparently Pagnotta said on a podcast today that he has heard that Buffalo still wants 4 firsts or equivalent but now is willing to retain some amount on the contract.
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11-02-2021, 04:05 PM
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#751
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That Crazy Guy at the Bus Stop
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Springfield Penitentiary
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If there’s one thing this whole saga has confirmed for me is just how incompetent the buffalo sabres are. Awful GM, awful team, awful owners. They suck top to bottom.
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11-02-2021, 04:07 PM
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#752
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monahammer
I did not hear this myself, but apparently Pagnotta said on a podcast today that he has heard that Buffalo still wants 4 firsts or equivalent but now is willing to retain some amount on the contract.
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And the reason they couldn’t have told everyone this in August, or September or October is…
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11-02-2021, 04:09 PM
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#753
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Ate 100 Treadmills
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monahammer
I did not hear this myself, but apparently Pagnotta said on a podcast today that he has heard that Buffalo still wants 4 firsts or equivalent but now is willing to retain some amount on the contract.
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1st
Valimaki
Monahan
Zary
Zadarov
....Do the Flames need to add Dube?
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11-02-2021, 04:15 PM
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#754
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Alberta
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Yeah I am super hot for the idea of retention on Eichel's contract. Has me drooling TBH.
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11-02-2021, 04:25 PM
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#755
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blankall
1st
Valimaki
Monahan
Zary
Zadarov
....Do the Flames need to add Dube?
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If they’re willing to retain, I’d gladly toss another 1st or a 2nd into that deal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814
And the reason they couldn’t have told everyone this in August, or September or October is…
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Expecting an incompetent person/team to do non-incompetent things is a waste of a thought.
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11-02-2021, 04:31 PM
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#756
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Springbank
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814
And the reason they couldn’t have told everyone this in August, or September or October is…
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11-02-2021, 04:35 PM
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#757
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Alberta
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playing around with next year cap... if we can get them to retain slightly on Eichel (1-2 mil) and Lucic retires instead of playing for 1 mil, we could very likely keep all of Tkachuk-Johnny-Mangi... Big ifs though lol.
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11-02-2021, 04:36 PM
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#758
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Crash and Bang Winger
Join Date: Oct 2021
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blankall
1st
Valimaki
Monahan
Zary
Zadarov
....Do the Flames need to add Dube?
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Is the general consensus that we are all higher on Pelletier than we are Zary? I think personally I'd rather hang on to Zary and put Pelletier in that deal. Would love for this to be the final deal especially with any retention.
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11-02-2021, 04:37 PM
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#759
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Indiana
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blankall
1st
Valimaki
Monahan
Zary
Zadarov
....Do the Flames need to add Dube?
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I don't think Valimaki and Zadorov are worth 1sts. Zadorov likely has a small amount of negative value. Valimaki is probably worth a high 2nd (similar to what Bean got).
Monahan might not be either at this point because he has only been about a 50 point player since 2019 and he gets paid more than most 50 point players.
Zary is also debatable. He's probably worth a late 1st, around where he was drafted.
You have to be quite generous with the value of Valimaki, Zary and Monahan to argue that they are collectively worth three 1sts. It's possible, but I think it's a stretch.
But I'll go out on a limb and say the 1st itself is probably worth a 1st.
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11-02-2021, 04:39 PM
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#760
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlindMilwaukee
Is the general consensus that we are all higher on Pelletier than we are Zary? I think personally I'd rather hang on to Zary and put Pelletier in that deal. Would love for this to be the final deal especially with any retention.
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How I’d rank our top prospects as of today:
1. Matthew Coronato
2. Connor Zary
3. Jakob Pelletier
…which also aligns with their hockeyprospecting.com NHLe in their D0 year (38, 37, and 29 respectively).
Worth pointing out that Krebs’ NHLe in years D-1 through D+2 are 20, 26, 39, 44. In comparison:
Pelletier: 22, 29, 31, 33
Zary: 26, 37, 39, no data yet
Coronato: 20, 38, no data yet, no data yet
Last edited by ComixZone; 11-02-2021 at 04:44 PM.
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