Before they trade Bennett, can they just put him on the first two lines RW for 10 games first and see if he can produce?
Put him on either Lindholm or Monahan's RW for 10 games. If he puts up at least 5 points, keep him there for another 10 games.
Just give him some consistency to succeed. He's this organizations highest draft pick ever, just give him the longer leash. Plant his ass in the top 6 for a decent sample and see what happens. You aren't getting production from your other options anyways.
It's not like Leivo, Simon and Mangiapane are putting up the points in those spots.
Just give him 10 games and go from there. If he fails to put up 5 points, you gave him the opportunity, he failed, and trade him or at least you can show him that he just isn't top 6 material and he can be happy being a glorified bottom 6 forward.
You're asking them to potentially anchor down their top offensive producers for ~20% of the season just because you might like a guy who has never shown up in any circumstance during the regular season.
As others have pointed out, the Bennett doesnt get a fair chance on the team arguments can all be easily dismissed by showing that Mangiapane and Dube overcame similar hurdles by actually boosting the play of the bad players they were forced to play with, thereby playing their way up the lineup. Bennett has only ever played his way into the penalty box when given more minutes.
If Bennett asked to go back to the wing, it was because he realized he wasn’t going to play any higher than the 4th line as a Center. Unfortunately for him it would take some drastic developments for him to move ahead of Monahan, Lindholm or Backlund on the depth chart
You're asking them to potentially anchor down their top offensive producers for ~20% of the season just because you might like a guy who has never shown up in any circumstance during the regular season.
As others have pointed out, the Bennett doesnt get a fair chance on the team arguments can all be easily dismissed by showing that Mangiapane and Dube overcame similar hurdles by actually boosting the play of the bad players they were forced to play with, thereby playing their way up the lineup. Bennett has only ever played his way into the penalty box when given more minutes.
What have Mangiapane, Simon, Leivo done for the top two lines?
Dube has done what you noted above, no matter what line he's been on.
Mangiapane had last year, but hasn't done anything this year. I'd argue Bennett has been just as effective as Mangiapane this year.
We want to give Mangiapane credit for a good last season playing on the 3M line and give him a long leash this year, yet we won't give Bennett the same long leash even though he was our best playoff performer last year?
You've got an asset in Bennett, an asset that has a name value in the market, before you go and dump it, at least make sure you have given it the longest rope. Bennett has NEVER had an extended run with the top players on this team, NEVER. Putting a guy on a top line for one game and then putting him back with plugs the next game after he fails to produce is no way to build a players confidence.
There's another reason for putting Bennett on Johnny's line, because he gives that line some size and physical presence, something that Dube, Mangiapane and Simon don't do. Bennett is also faster and quicker than Leivo. Before Lindholm cemented his spot on Johnny's RW, the previous most successful RW was Ferland, an inconsistent power forward with some skills, which is also a fitting description of Bennett.
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Friedman reported on 960 a few years back that he heard Bennett had asked to be moved. This was like 2017 or so. I don't think the story went anywhere, not much traction, likely then it was just an unhappy player looking for more opportunity. I'm curious if Friedman talks about that during any of his segments on the Fan this week.
Hate to quote myself but happy to hear Friedman bring this up just now on the Fan
Worried I was going nuts
To clarify he says it was born out of frustration during the last contract negotiation and Bennett & his agent asked if they should go elsewhere
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If Sam Bennett really is a 24 year old 'power forward' with skill that just hasn't had a chance to show it consistently in a top 6 role he should fetch a pretty sweet return the Flames. Hopefully BT can get a top 6 player back in return.
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Location: F*** me. We're so f***ing good, you check the f***ing standings? Lets f***ing go! F***ing practice!
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It sure is amazing how many people seem to believe Sam Bennett is this amazing talent that has been screwed over by the Flames. I've literally watched every NHL game hes played in except maybe 5 in his entire career.
I'm assuming he looked like Mario Lemieux in those 5 games I missed because something isn't adding up here.
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It sucks, because he looked so good in Penticton. I was so pumped having Bennett and Monahan as a 1-2 punch down the middle. Boy, did that not work out how I imagined.
It's like he just stagnated, and everyone around him grew past him. I don't know how Flames could have handled it differently. At some some point, Bennett has to take some responsibility for his own development as well.
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No, this line would most likely be maximizing the performance of Lucic and Bennett at the expense of Dube, who I would much prefer to be playing with better players.
Really? That trio all had third line ice time but Bennett led the team in goals and tied for first in points. Lucic tied for fourth in scoring and Dube tied for seventh. I thought they were great and I wouldn't mind seeing them together again to see if they can re-capture any of their great play. That line became better than the sum of its parts and out-performed what was expected. If a good player like Dube has the power to upgrade his otherwise mediocre linemates into a really good line I'd rather have that than add him to an already good duo and not move the needle as much.
Not saying that is the answer, obviously it was a small sample size but I wouldn't mind seeing it again to find out.
What have Mangiapane, Simon, Leivo done for the top two lines?
More than Bennett on the third line? They haven't been great, but they haven't been a liability. They can say they aren't the clubhouse leader for the green jacket.
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Dube has done what you noted above, no matter what line he's been on.
As has Mangiapane. To borrow some baseball parlance, Mangiapane is a great utility player. You can put him anywhere in the lineup and he will get the job done and support the big players be better in all zones. Bennett? He's a zero tool player.
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Mangiapane had last year, but hasn't done anything this year. I'd argue Bennett has been just as effective as Mangiapane this year.
And you'd be dead wrong. Mangiapane has been a good supporting role player. We would like to see more, but he's at least being the defensively responsible guy on his line.
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We want to give Mangiapane credit for a good last season playing on the 3M line and give him a long leash this year, yet we won't give Bennett the same long leash even though he was our best playoff performer last year?
Bennett was NOT the best player in the post season last year. That was Dube, by a big margin IMO. That was his coming out party, and Lucic and Bennett happened to be there for the ride.
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You've got an asset in Bennett, an asset that has a name value in the market, before you go and dump it, at least make sure you have given it the longest rope. Bennett has NEVER had an extended run with the top players on this team, NEVER. Putting a guy on a top line for one game and then putting him back with plugs the next game after he fails to produce is no way to build a players confidence.
Five years. Five freaking years. 371 games to prove himself. What has he done? Watch his career trend in the wrong direction. Mean while we've seen other players come in during that time and earn their way into the line up, surpass Sam Bennett, and become important parts of the team. Hell, we've seen players that performed better get exiled to the bench and then cut loose. But Sam continues to get opportunities he doesn't earn or deserve.
As for the name value, his only value is the fact that he was drafted 4th overall. Beyond that, he's done nothing to earn a name. If anything, his name value is negative because of how little he has done.
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There's another reason for putting Bennett on Johnny's line, because he gives that line some size and physical presence, something that Dube, Mangiapane and Simon don't do. Bennett is also faster and quicker than Leivo. Before Lindholm cemented his spot on Johnny's RW, the previous most successful RW was Ferland, an inconsistent power forward with some skills, which is also a fitting description of Bennett.
Problem is Bennett can't play up there with the big boys. It's been tried in the past, and Sam has failed. Jesus, he can barely keep his #### together on the third line, why would they promote him to the 2nd or third line? Bennett has shown NOTHING to deserve ice time up the lineup. The guy can't give or take a pass, has a muffin of a shot, is dumb as a sack of hammers, and believes he can beat the whole opposition team with toe drags. To make matters worse he can't spell defense let alone play it. He needs to be kept as far away from Monahan and Gaudreau as possible. Those three together would spend the whole night in their own end and be a goals against machine.
It sure is amazing how many people seem to believe Sam Bennett is this amazing talent that has been screwed over by the Flames. I've literally watched every NHL game hes played in except maybe 5 in his entire career.
I'm assuming he looked like Mario Lemieux in those 5 games I missed because something isn't adding up here.
What’s even more amazing, is how you’ve found that many people who think he’s an amazing talent. And not just a potentially impactful middle 6 forward, like I’ve seen. “He can be effective”. “Why does everyone think he’s Mario!?”
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Which is pretty much the opposite of what CSharp was implying and I was responding to.
How is that different that what I pointed out? Possibly every trade or proposed trade with rumors of the Ducks making lowball offers has Bennett's name written into it. Just that no team wants to get a Bennett for 82 games a season just to have him show up in the playoffs.
At this point it’s best to just trade him and give him a fresh start, he’s unlikely to break out here.
He does need to take responsibility for his own development and the issues in his game (doesn’t have the best hockey sense, takes bad penalties, puck skills seem to have deteriorated) but I do get why he’d be frustrated.
Probably feels like he always has a short leash while over the years guys like Leivo, Chiasson, Simon, etc seem to have received longer looks in top 6 roles.
Hopefully the Flames can still get a least a little value for the player. It’s unfortunate because he was the consensus pick at the time, and with the data available on draft day he’s the player you pick 100% of the time in that spot, but you can’t help but wonder what this team looks like with Nylander, Pasternak, or Ehlers instead.
Unfortunately I don’t think Bennett had ever returned to how he looked in 15/16 and really feels like his excitement and creativity was almost just coached of him.
When’s the last time he’s made a play like you see at the 2:50 mark against Ottawa?
Last edited by SuperMatt18; 02-01-2021 at 04:57 PM.
