2020/2021 Trade Speculation and Rumours

[Ped]

Originally Posted by Da_Chief

Phaneuf was not on a decline. He had productive years in Toronto, rest of that leafs team sucked. That was and will remain a terrible trade by Sutter.

Disagree. Phaneuf was a legitimate Norris candidate in the beginning with Calgary, and in his first three seasons had totals of 49, 50, and 60 points. He would never hit those totals again, and would only top 40 points one season in Toronto. He was still a good player, but he was no longer a #1 defenceman.


Fans make judgement calls based on past information all the time. Look at any trade thread or free agency thread, especially where the player is no longer what he once was, or is a former highly-touted prospect. Fans who don't watch other teams regularly go by what they remember first.


Someone brought up the Granlund/Fiala trade in here. That was widely seen as a loss for Minnesota iiric, even though Granlund was declining, because of his overall body of work and that Fiala had not broken through yet.


Not all fans are guilty of it. But a great deal of it are. And why wouldn't they be? They're not paid to follow every single team.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Makes the team worse this season=not happening

It’s very unlikely that any Johnny trade will make the Flames better in the first year of the trade.


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[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

It’s very unlikely that any Johnny trade will make the Flames better in the first year of the trade.


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Which is why it won't happen. BT is clearly pushing his chips all in to compete now. If we were rebuilding that would be a different story. JG is a high candidate for a bounce back season, unless you get something back that helps us now you don't deal him.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

It’s very unlikely that any Johnny trade will make the Flames better in the first year of the trade.


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This is the issue with all the "Treliving didn't address top 6" talk. There were really very few opportunities I can think of. The only one where you don't ground short term was something around trading Johnny and signing Hall (and even that depends on how you view each player). And that obviously wasn't available as it turns out.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

It’s very unlikely that any Johnny trade will make the Flames better in the first year of the trade.


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Konecny + Frost would be close.

Give me Konecny + Frost.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Konecny + Frost would be close.

Give me Konecny + Frost.

Agreed but if you have had this conversation with Cobra in the past like myself he believes Konecny has potentially more value than Johnny.

Reading some rumor stuff earlier this offseason Philly wasn’t going to trade Konecny for Laine so I don’t see them moving him for Gaudreau.

Even 1 for 1 opening up the 1.25M in space for the Flames could be what is needed to sign a guy like Vatanen or other bargain bin free agents?

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by djsFlames

Konecny + Frost would be close.

Give me Konecny + Frost.

There seems no reason why the Flyers would part with their leading scorer who is cheaper and signed for an extra year.

Much less add in Frost.

I doubt there is a Johnny trade available where they get better, cheaper and younger. If there was, it would have been done already.

Flames need for Johnny to increase his trade value with a bounce back season.

The problem with that, if Johnny got 100 points, would Treliving trade him after next season? With a expiring contract, his value would likely be futures only. The best time to trade him was this off season, but with the Flames clearly going all in, that just wasn’t likely on the table.

Sometimes you simply need to go for it and perhaps risk losing the player to UFA. Otherwise you are always rebuilding.

If the Flames are contending the next two seasons, Johnny may be sticking around. Of course, after next season, the Flames could trade him for futures, then flip those or other futures for immediate help. Keep their window open and still manage their assets.

The more I think about it, that’s the likely scenario.


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[Hackey]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Makes the team worse this season=not happening

Which is frustrating to me as a fan. The goal is to win the cup. I don't need a straight line in improvement over 5 years. If the team dips a bit to get better later to me that is fine. Obviously ownership might feel differently. I dont see the Flames as a contender. I'm optimistic that if we get in anything can happen but realistically I don't see them as an elite team so a trade that hurts a little short term and improves long term makes sense to me. Winning a cup in the next 2 years with the current team seems unlikely either way. Plus its not like you're rebuilding. You're trying to maximize your assets. If we were elite than by all means sacrifice now for later but I still think they have work to do. Johnny going UFA is what scares me. Either losing him for next to nothing or a boat anchore new deal.

[Sandman]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Which is frustrating to me as a fan. The goal is to win the cup. I don't need a straight line in improvement over 5 years. If the team dips a bit to get better later to me that is fine. Obviously ownership might feel differently. I dont see the Flames as a contender. I'm optimistic that if we get in anything can happen but realistically I don't see them as an elite team so a trade that hurts a little short term and improves long term makes sense to me. Winning a cup in the next 2 years with the current team seems unlikely either way. Plus its not like you're rebuilding. You're trying to maximize your assets. If we were elite than by all means sacrifice now for later but I still think they have work to do. Johnny going UFA is what scares me. Either losing him for next to nothing or a boat anchore new deal.

I agree. Most teams that become contenders seem to have a retooling at some point in their rebuild, on the way up. I think Lindholm could hold the fort if management wanted to go the way of trading Monahan for a young C that needed a little seasoning. When it comes to Johnny, I worry about the same thing as you-losing him for nothing, or waiting too long and trading him when we hold no cards.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Sandman

I agree. Most teams that become contenders seem to have a retooling at some point in their rebuild, on the way up. I think Lindholm could hold the fort if management wanted to go the way of trading Monahan for a young C that needed a little seasoning. When it comes to Johnny, I worry about the same thing as you-losing him for nothing, or waiting too long and trading him when we hold no cards.

If the deals for Monahan or Gaudreau suck then it is what it is and you're better off rolling the dice with them. If you can get a top prospect from a recent draft or a young roster player though I dont think the logic should be were worse in the short term so don't make the deal. Id rather be worse in the short term with help on the way then worse in the long term with nothing on the way.

[dissentowner]

Statistics say Gaudreau should have a bounce back season. Why not wait until his value rises this year and then deal him at the deadline when GM's are more desperate and his value is higher. The team is built to compete now, we need a return that has a piece that helps us now if he is dealt. That being said I don't think the Flames have any intention of trading #13.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Statistics say Gaudreau should have a bounce back season. Why not wait until his value rises this year and then deal him at the deadline when GM's are more desperate and his value is higher. The team is built to compete now, we need a return that has a piece that helps us now if he is dealt. That being said I don't think the Flames have any intention of trading #13.

Why deal him at the deadline, assuming we’re in a playoff position?

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan

Why deal him at the deadline, assuming we’re in a playoff position?

Depends on what the return is and if BT feels he can re-sign him or wants to. If you can fill a need that helps now that has term and is upgrade for us why not?

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Depends on what the return is and if BT feels he can re-sign him or wants to. If you can fill a need that helps now that has term and is upgrade for us why not?

Help now, term, and an upgraded player over Gaudreau?

So basically a franchise player signed for more than 2 years. Who is going to do that?

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan

Help now, term, and an upgraded player over Gaudreau?

So basically a franchise player signed for more than 2 years. Who is going to do that?

Depends on what they are looking for, all the pieces in the deal, position, if they believe they can re-sign Johnny, lots of things.

[SeanCharles]

Ok so back legit rumours...

It’s been speculated on the idea of Flames and Bruins completing a swap of Hanifin for Carlo.

I personally think it would be great and shore up the right side for years to come. It would also allow Valimaki to play in the top 4 a lot sooner and help ease the eventual declines of Gio and Tanev.

It comes with risk but if one of the other left side guys can emerge as a top 4 before Gio retires it would be an absolute win in my books.

I consider Carlo a legit top 4 dmen so it would merely be shifting the balance of power from the left to the right. Given the dearth of RS dmen in the organization I think it makes a tonne of sense.

Gio-Andersson
Valimaki-Tanev
Kylington-Carlo

Other LS: Mackey, Nesterov, Poolman, Lerby, Kuznetsov, Poirier, Solovyov

Other RS: Yelesin, Kinnvall, Boltmann

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by Ped

Disagree. Phaneuf was a legitimate Norris candidate in the beginning with Calgary, and in his first three seasons had totals of 49, 50, and 60 points. He would never hit those totals again, and would only top 40 points one season in Toronto. He was still a good player, but he was no longer a #1 defenceman.


Fans make judgement calls based on past information all the time. Look at any trade thread or free agency thread, especially where the player is no longer what he once was, or is a former highly-touted prospect. Fans who don't watch other teams regularly go by what they remember first.


Someone brought up the Granlund/Fiala trade in here. That was widely seen as a loss for Minnesota iiric, even though Granlund was declining, because of his overall body of work and that Fiala had not broken through yet.


Not all fans are guilty of it. But a great deal of it are. And why wouldn't they be? They're not paid to follow every single team.

Dino had way more structure/leadership here than Toronto.
Aucoin, Regehr, Hamrlik, Sarich, Warrener. Leafs had none of that.

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by SeanCharles

It comes with risk but if one of the other left side guys can emerge as a top 4 before Gio retires it would be an absolute win in my books.

Gio-Andersson
Valimaki-Tanev
Kylington-Carlo

This is a risk worth taking.

[The Original FFIV]

Originally Posted by SeanCharles

Ok so back legit rumours...

It’s been speculated on the idea of Flames and Bruins completing a swap of Hanifin for Carlo.

I personally think it would be great and shore up the right side for years to come. It would also allow Valimaki to play in the top 4 a lot sooner and help ease the eventual declines of Gio and Tanev.

It comes with risk but if one of the other left side guys can emerge as a top 4 before Gio retires it would be an absolute win in my books.

I consider Carlo a legit top 4 dmen so it would merely be shifting the balance of power from the left to the right. Given the dearth of RS dmen in the organization I think it makes a tonne of sense.

Gio-Andersson
Valimaki-Tanev
Kylington-Carlo

Other LS: Mackey, Nesterov, Poolman, Lerby, Kuznetsov, Poirier, Solovyov

Other RS: Yelesin, Kinnvall, Boltmann

Is this the rumor that jimmy murphy and Joe Haggerty were flogging on Twitter? If so, thanks for posting as I was wondering what that was behind the paywall

[keenan87]

I have a feeling there will be a bunch of trades and action right before the season starts. That is when we will see either Gaudreau or Monahan traded.

A deal around Filip Forsberg and Johnny Gaudreau makes sense.

Along with signing Duclair to a 1-year cheap deal.