[PGT] Flames lay an absolute egg, lose to Sens 5-2

[Rick M.]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

That game was so Gulutzan-esque

Lots of side to side passing in our zone. Yuck.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Jimdon

The coach they have now has the best record in their division despite lackluster play from the top players. What more can you ask from a coach?

I don't believe their record is indicative of their play.

Smoke and mirrors IMO.

[zamler]

Aren't we something like 5-0 in the shootout?

[Manhattanboy]

This team is in need a a substantial shake up. Surely we can all agree that a playoff spot is not a certainty and that this core is not going anywhere beyond round one.

[Jimdon]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I don't believe their record is indicative of their play.

Smoke and mirrors IMO.

And indent believe that the level of play from our top players in indicative of the coaching that they are getting.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

This team is in need a a substantial shake up. Surely we can all agree that a playoff spot is not a certainty and that this core is not going anywhere beyond round one.

I think we should be sellers on Brodie or Hamonic (whoever gets the better return), get a mid round pick for Jankowski, and then just hope that we make the playoffs. If we don't make the playoffs, this is the perfect time to have a top 10/mid 1st pick with the great options there are in the 2020 draft.

A good trade would be trading Hamonic or Brodie for Toffoli with a third party team acquiring the player and sending off a good pick and/or prospect to LA. Pipe dream though.

[1qqaaz]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I don't believe their record is indicative of their play.

Smoke and mirrors IMO.

I'd say it's more goaltending than coaching.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Manhattanboy

This team is in need a a substantial shake up. Surely we can all agree that a playoff spot is not a certainty and that this core is not going anywhere beyond round one.

Really wish i could disagree with this post , but I can't. The worst part for me is, that they have enough talent on this team, that they should be getting past the first round and maybe the 2nd. Right now all we can hope for is that hit lightning in a bottle when the playoffs start. If they start, i guess is more accurate.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Jimdon

And indent believe that the level of play from our top players in indicative of the coaching that they are getting.

Well some people look at it one way, some look at it another.

I can give you some examples of what I think are problems with the play that are coachable.
- the length of time players are individually holding on to the puck before moving it
- individual rushes through neutral zone into opposition traffic leading to turnovers
- D to D in the own zone until wingers are stationary at far blue line (covered in the event of a pass, and unable to beat the D to a dump in because they are standing still) and the subsequent turnovers

There are more, but each of these things related to decision making and are coachable

It is a team that appears to be playing with no plan

Backlund is not a winger. I know they want Lindholm to play C but with this roster, they need him more on wing

Mangiapane is not a top line player. Love the heart he has, and he skates hard, but at this point in his development he is a bottom 6 player. Even Ferland got returned to the bottom 6 when he was spending some time with 13/23 and cooled down

I don’t know why you wouldn’t look at the coach and be comfortable asking questions

[Dion]

Originally Posted by nik-

The team has been bad for a year, people who still act like this is nothing to worry about are the delusional ones. Another bad loss and you can expect what a PGT will be, stay out if it overwhelms you.

Trust me, it doesn't overwhelm me. Maybe it's my age, but I don't get overly negative after a loss. There's still half a season left to play and judging by what St.Louis did last year, anything can happen. I enjoy watching this team for what it is, both good and bad

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by 1qqaaz

I'd say it's more goaltending than coaching.

This is an interesting take, however we do seem to have a few guys mailing it in.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I don't know if a coaching change is in order or not, but just because you changed coaches doesn't mean you can rule that out as the problem either. Anyone here think that Gulutzan or Peters were really great coaches? Ward is a relative unknown - maybe he will figure things out, maybe he won't. Hartley was the most proven coach this team has had in a very long time, and there are very few people who think it was a mistake firing him.


I don't know if Ward is a good coach or not. I just find the logic behind trying to shut-down any discussion about a coaching change rather absurd as you have to go way back to Darryl Sutter to see a coach who has left the Flames and continued elsewhere as a head coach in the NHL.


Jim Playfair
Mike Keenan
Brent Sutter
Bob Hartley
Glen Gulutzan
Bill Peters
Geoff Ward


I will give you that Ward is new and it may not be fair to him to insinuate he isn't a good head coach. However, he is far from being a proven coach.


Hartley was the most proven coach since Darryl Sutter, and he has been the only coach since Darryl to get this team playing consistently from the start of a season to the end of one. Darryl was a damn fine coach that got his team to drastically exceed expectations.


All the other coaches failed. None have really exceeded expectations, outside of a nice regular season finish last year from Peters.



Tell me again that coaching is definitely not the issue and actually do more to explain why you think so other than the fact that there has been a change already. Again, just because you make a change doesn't rule out the possibility that the change was in any way an improvement, especially when your hand was forced and the pool of legitimate candidates was practically non-existent. Since then, there has been some very good options that opened up. I am not campaigning for Ward to be replaced - I am seeing some things that I really don't like at the moment, but not quite sure if he should be replaced or not. I do, however, think that there is absolutely no reason to be so sure that coaching is not THE problem, or that it isn't at least A problem.

[calgaryred]

Originally Posted by Dion

Trust me, it doesn't overwhelm me. Maybe it's my age, but I don't get overly negative after a loss. There's still half a season left to play and judging by what St.Louis did last year, anything can happen. I enjoy watching this team for what it is, both good and bad

I agree that 2004 team wasnt world beaters they just inched in the playoffs. Expectations were low and ended up one game from being World champs. No one thought Blues were winning it last year just like Kings in 2012.

Sent from my SM-G930W8 using Tapatalk

[mrdonkey]

St.Louis winning was probably the worst thing to happen to teams like the Flames, who built their fortress of solitude right in the middle of the league. “Still lots of hockey to play, anything can happen, 8th seed can totally win the cup, the answers are in the room!”

Rinse and repeat.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Dion

Trust me, it doesn't overwhelm me. Maybe it's my age, but I don't get overly negative after a loss. There's still half a season left to play and judging by what St.Louis did last year, anything can happen. I enjoy watching this team for what it is, both good and bad

Yeah, but people have a memory longer than a single loss. It's the build up of a long stretch of poor hockey that get people "overly negative".

There is an odd obsession amongst a subset of posters here about showing no emotion towards their sports team. Like, watch 82 games a season and get no emotional ups and downs from it? Or try hard to present a front that you don't? You're all so stoic. It's ####ing weird.

Originally Posted by mrdonkey

St.Louis winning was probably the worst thing to happen to teams like the Flames, who built their fortress of solitude right in the middle of the league. “Still lots of hockey to play, anything can happen, 8th seed can totally win the cup, the answers are in the room!”

Rinse and repeat.

Just like the Kings winning in 2012. "See! Just get in an anything can happen!" Conveniently ignoring that no Flames team has had that level of heart since 2004.

[Jimdon]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

I don't know if a coaching change is in order or not, but just because you changed coaches doesn't mean you can rule that out as the problem either. Anyone here think that Gulutzan or Peters were really great coaches? Ward is a relative unknown - maybe he will figure things out, maybe he won't. Hartley was the most proven coach this team has had in a very long time, and there are very few people who think it was a mistake firing him.


I don't know if Ward is a good coach or not. I just find the logic behind trying to shut-down any discussion about a coaching change rather absurd as you have to go way back to Darryl Sutter to see a coach who has left the Flames and continued elsewhere as a head coach in the NHL.


Jim Playfair
Mike Keenan
Brent Sutter
Bob Hartley
Glen Gulutzan
Bill Peters
Geoff Ward


I will give you that Ward is new and it may not be fair to him to insinuate he isn't a good head coach. However, he is far from being a proven coach.


Hartley was the most proven coach since Darryl Sutter, and he has been the only coach since Darryl to get this team playing consistently from the start of a season to the end of one. Darryl was a damn fine coach that got his team to drastically exceed expectations.


All the other coaches failed. None have really exceeded expectations, outside of a nice regular season finish last year from Peters.



Tell me again that coaching is definitely not the issue and actually do more to explain why you think so other than the fact that there has been a change already. Again, just because you make a change doesn't rule out the possibility that the change was in any way an improvement, especially when your hand was forced and the pool of legitimate candidates was practically non-existent. Since then, there has been some very good options that opened up. I am not campaigning for Ward to be replaced - I am seeing some things that I really don't like at the moment, but not quite sure if he should be replaced or not. I do, however, think that there is absolutely no reason to be so sure that coaching is not THE problem, or that it isn't at least A problem.

You have seven coaches listed above as failures. Seven. 7.

Meanwhile we have a core group of players that come up short, consistently, every year, over and over again...

And you want more explanation on how the coaches aren't the problem? Like the team is one pep talk or white board play or one system change away from not showing up to compete against the bottom feeder teams of the league, or never being able to win a playoff round.

Ridiculous.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by nik-

Yeah, but people have a memory longer than a single loss. It's the build up of a long stretch of poor hockey that get people "overly negative".

There is an odd obsession amongst a subset of posters here about showing no emotion towards their sports team. Like, watch 82 games a season and get no emotional ups and downs from it? Or try hard to present a front that you don't? You're all so stoic. It's ####ing weird.

It's not weird to not go off the deep end when the team is playing poorly or be as inconsistent as it has this season. I don't dwell on a loss or a series of losses as I have better things to do my time.

That doesn't mean I don't have my ups and downs with this team. I just recognise that we have a talented team that on many nights provides us with good entertainment.

Does that make me less of a fan? I don't know and frankly I don't care.

[taxbuster]

My observation of today's game...after a little bit of time has passed:

- Flames were tentative in their own zone, even in the first few minutes. Lots of back and forth passes between the D at least several of which were deflected, missed or were just plain bad

- Gio - great player, but maybe needs less ice time for a bit; too slow with the puck and thinks WAY too much. And his loss on the EN goal...well that's just a symptom

- a bunch of the players are just not getting open; as someone mentioned, with one player behind the opposing net and one on the half-wall, what is anyone expecting? Maybe a bit of cycling, but they're generally not good enough (except Dube, Ryan, Lucic mostly) to keep it down low. Too many blind passes. Too many turnovers. Not nearly enough focus. Too little sleep? (Maybe they forgot it was an early game LOL?)

And generally...brutal lack of attention to detail.

Oh - pretty much a carbon copy of the game against Montreal. Big game..go to sleep...another big game...go to sleep. So is St Loo a big game and the Oilers a "go to sleep" one then? or the other way around?

So frustrating to be a fan of this schizophrenic team.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Dion

It's not weird to not go off the deep end when the team is playing poorly or be as inconsistent as it has this season. I don't dwell on a loss or a series of losses as I have better things to do my time.

That doesn't mean I don't have my ups and downs with this team. I just recognise that we have a talented team that on many nights provides us with good entertainment.

Does that make me less of a fan? I don't know and frankly I don't care.

Well said
The post game thread is not just for people looking to go off the deep end and telling someone to “stay out” if they can’t handle the negativity is pretty lame

[oldschoolcalgary]

losing to ####ty team below you in the standings is pretty much a guarantee to miss the playoffs...

Losing to MTL and Ottawa?! but winning versus TO?

this team is maddening... at this point, I am hoping for a major trade to shake these players out of their complacency...Outside of Tkachuk, anderson, vilamaki, i'd listen to offers on anyone at this point