GT: Canadian Federal Election 2019

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I am surprised that so many people are down on Sheer. He lead the party to a very substantial increase in seats and made the Conservatives a strong opposition in Parliament.

He managed 34% against an incumbent mired in scandal and corruption, not good enough.

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

If the Conservatives want to win, they need to pretend Trudeau doesn't even exist and sell Canadians on their platform.

Their platform doesn't have a chance when all the media focuses on are social issues.

[Oling_Roachinen]

So recognizing that "Scheer must go" is one thing, but how does the CPC actually go about getting it done and picking a respectful leader?

The people who wouldn't even vote for the Conservatives aren't likely to get involved in a private leader vote for the party - and this is where I'm likely to fall.

So they're almost right back to the same voting base for the next leader. And the reason Scheer won last time was because Bernier walked in Pride parades and didn't have a 100% vote record against pro-life legislation. Groups like RightNow rallied the troops to get Scheer voted in as leader over such a heathen as Bernier. And it worked. So what stops that next time?

I guess the question is, how do you get citizens to come in and vote for a leader to drown out the large contingent of social regressives that have pretty much hijacked the leadership of the CPC? Just hope there's enough 'moderates' or 'progressives' that are tired of losing?

Instead of Wexit, I feel like this could be better use of energy of those who want to see change.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Exactly what I think and was trying to say.

I think it's time for the CPC to move to a full center/right stance. And let the social conservatives restart the Reform party (or whatever they want).

That would set up a situation where we would have two centrist parties (one leaning left and one leaning right), with 3, more extreme parties (two to the left and one to the right).

IMO, this would be a better situation.

And then, the far right party could reverse takeover the centrist Conservative party, and we'd have a socially regressive Conservative party. Again.

We've been to this dance.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Facebook is for old people and weirdos.

Facebook is for young people and weirdos.

(It is all a matter of perspective)

[AltaGuy]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

The next leader HAS to be from the east (including Ontario). Any western candidate, no matter how progressive, would be viewed, rightly or wrongly, as same old, same old.

Or the next leader is a Western progressive. Nenshi, for instance, would easily become PM as leader of the conservatives in my view, and would not be seen as more of the same (at all) to easterners.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

If it's being run by social conservatives, then sure.

But Canada has voted in multiple conservative majorities, so making an absolute statement like that is silly, IMO.

One since 1988 and that took the Liberals basically being wiped off the map.

Ever since the Bloc formed - they have been destroyed in Quebec. Most seats they've won in Quebec since then is 12. In 1988, the last election before the Bloc formed, they won 63 seats in Quebec.

Very hard to form a majority as a non-entity in Quebec.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

And then, the far right party could reverse takeover the centrist Conservative party, and we'd have a socially regressive Conservative party. Again.

We've been to this dance.

That's why you split the party and let them have their own (I posted on this earlier). The only way to keep them out of the way is to eliminate them from the ranks.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

The next leader HAS to be from the east (including Ontario). Any western candidate, no matter how progressive, would be viewed, rightly or wrongly, as same old, same old.

I hear Caroline Mulroney is tanned rested and ready.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by AltaGuy

Or the next leader is a Western progressive. Nenshi, for instance, would easily become PM as leader of the conservatives in my view, and would not be seen as more of the same (at all) to easterners.

I want to believe that's true. But I don't.

There might be a time in the future for that to happen. But I think the next leader HAS to be eastern.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

That's why you split the party and let them have their own (I posted on this earlier). The only way to keep them out of the way is to eliminate them from the ranks.

But you have to block the unending desire of Conservative parties to "unite the right" so they can win.

[FlamesAddiction]

It doesn't help that many people in the East view the current party as the Reform Party, just re-branded.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

It doesn't help that many people in the East view the current party as the Reform Party, just re-branded.

It's a well-fitting shoe.

[AltaGuy]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I want to believe that's true. But I don't.

There might be a time in the future for that to happen. But I think the next leader HAS to be eastern.

I think the main point that I'm making is that a strong progressive leader might actually piss the social conservatives off so much they schism on their own.

And that schism is what will finally convince easterners that they really are PCs once more.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by Jacks

He managed 34% against an incumbent mired in scandal and corruption, not good enough.



Their platform doesn't have a chance when all the media focuses on are social issues.

I think that this stems from the fact that 'the economy will be bad' argument appears to be fear mongering. I mean that in the literal sense. Plenty of posters have shown evidence that the economy is in decline or predictors that it will be. That said, the anecdotal evidence for a bad economy doesn't really exist. For example, I look around Alberta and on the highways its nothing but new cars and trucks. You go to towns, and cities and see heaps of new construction both businesses and homes. You go to the Keg, or to a Flames game and its packed.

Now, I am not suggesting that these are true economic indicators. That said, The optics are that we live in one of the best economies in the world. Whether that is true or not is irrelevant. It just doesn't look like an important issue.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Well i think you technically have your social right party with a role that the PPC should be playing.

But I think having a french canadian with his home riding in Quebec also causes that party to not really perform well with the true Socially Right conservatives in AB/Sask.

As pointed out, there were a few reasons why the PPC couldn't take that role. They include the Quebec ties and the fact that Bernier really didn't seem that genuine (he went from being left of Scheer in the leadership race to right of Scheer in the federal race).

But, and this is the most important part: the CPC wasn't willing to lose those voters, so it courted them too. And the far-right aren't going to abandon the CPC, the CPC has to abandon them.

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

So they're almost right back to the same voting base for the next leader. And the reason Scheer won last time was because Bernier walked in Pride parades and didn't have a 100% vote record against pro-life legislation. Groups like RightNow rallied the troops to get Scheer voted in as leader over such a heathen as Bernier. And it worked. So what stops that next time?

Do you have some sort of proof of that?
My understanding was that the way the leadership contest is set up a small riding in Quebec with 100 members has the same voting power as a riding in Alberta with 1000's of members. Scheer backing the dairy cartel secured a bunch of votes from a bunch of those small ridings. No doubt the religious folks influenced the vote but I don't think it was like you are saying.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Jacks

Do you have some sort of proof of that?

Only the circlejerking () that a bunch of these organization did when Scheer was elected as leader.

“Andrew has always been a strong pro-life candidate that has defended the rights of members of parliament to freely vote on these issues as well as bring them up in parliament,” said Alissa Golob, co-founder of RightNow, a non-profit organization committed to nominating and electing pro-life candidates.


RightNow sold thousands of memberships throughout the leadership campaign, encouraging pro-life voters to fully rank their ballot with all 10 candidates. Rankings were based off three criteria; pro-life voting record, winnability and policies and positions moving forward that were based on an interview with the candidate conducted by the organization.


“We are happy that we now have a leader that supports common-sense policies such as Cassie and Molly’s law and promoting maternal and child health overseas instead of abortion,” said Golob.

Originally Posted by Jacks

My understanding was that the way the leadership contest is set up a small riding in Quebec with 100 members has the same voting power as a riding in Alberta with 1000's of members. Scheer backing the dairy cartel secured a bunch of votes from a bunch of those small ridings. No doubt the religious folks influenced the vote but I don't think it was like you are saying.

It was a close enough vote that certainly other larger groups backing or not a candidate could have made the difference, but I don't think anyone came as close to the pro-life groups that were ranking candidates based on their past votes etc. to make sure no member was voting for Bernier as their second choice etc.

[Scrambler]

Originally Posted by AltaGuy

Or the next leader is a Western progressive. Nenshi, for instance, would easily become PM as leader of the conservatives in my view, and would not be seen as more of the same (at all) to easterners.

Wow, not a huge Nenshi supporter but the logic in this suggestion for whatever reason makes perfect sense and I would be keen to see it happen.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Scrambler

Wow, not a huge Nenshi supporter but the logic in this suggestion for whatever reason makes perfect sense and I would be keen to see it happen.

How's his French?

[AltaGuy]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

How's his French?

I was wondering the same thing about Notley making a run for the Liberals. Both have interesting potential nationally.