Alberta Election Thread - Election Day April 16 2019

[Weitz]

I won't be surprised if the court of appeal strikes down another approval for reasons.

[nik-]

Wait, do people still believe that they bought the pipeline so they could actually push forward and build it?

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Weitz

I won't be surprised if the court of appeal strikes down another approval for reasons.

As mentioned groups like the Western Environmental Lawfirm have already announced that they've prepared their legal challenges based around this round of consultations not being adequete.


This thing will probably be tied up in the courts until your kids get their learners licenses.


I don't know if you have kids or how old they are but you get what I mean.


This is all feeling like its angling towards TransX being reassessed under Bill C-69 when its passed.

[Flamenspiel]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

I think if we want to stick it to the rest of Canada, blockading our own oil and secceding probably aren't the right move.

But opting out of the CPP in favor of a Quebec style version would be a good card to play. Alberta is younger and richer than the rest of Canada, so we overpay into that (like pretty much every federal program). If we left the CPP, our contributions could go down and everyone else's would go up. Giving folks a little taste of what Alberta does for the rest of the country has potential merit I'd say.

This is bang on, we need to take control of our destiny, the NDP kowtow-ed to federal power and really when push came to shove, caved on everything.

I am certainly willing to give Kenney a shot on this. Of course Notley is certainly very intelligent, but she was playing Hearts when the feds were playing Poker. It is time to send in the bad cop with tools like you mention.

Also, let's stop throwing around the "unconstitutional" comments, the notwithstanding clause is obviously available and should be used as many times as needed.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by lambeburger

Pretty ridiculous that the polling stations don't open until 9AM. Those of us still with a job might want to vote before heading to work.

your employer has to provide time for you to vote on election day. what more do you want?
I don't think they should have to consider accommodating people for the advance voting.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by DiracSpike

Yeah except no one knows what constitutes "meaningful consultations". The consultations for this project took years and they talked to over 70 FN groups. Do you think they were just winging it?

Getting to a point of yes to your question. As evident when Ottawa was claiming they couldn't change or alter the NEBs conditions, which was wrong. There was a very fundamental misunderstanding of the whole process.

Originally Posted by DiracSpike

This court stepped in with an incoherent ruling that was politically influenced to stop the pipeline, this entire 1 year diversion has been a complete waste of time coupled with a tremendous loss of economic value for the country.

This is where people misinterpret Canada's law the most. You think Dawson and De Montigny, both nominated by Harper, are stooges for the Liberal Government? Maybe they saw that the NEB did what everyone said they did, took notes and then did...nothing. Even addressing the concerns more adequately, if not doing anything, would have been a step in the right direction. "Yes, we realize they have this concern, we don't think it's an issue because..." instead of ignoring it.

Originally Posted by DiracSpike

The FN group that filed the suit that stopped construction didn't even give a F about being consulted, they cared about stopping the project and the proof of that is their celebrations and comments afterwards all centered on stopping the pipeline and not one word about consultations.

They can be against the pipeline, it's their right, and the Court of Appeal can still believe they weren't properly consulted and didn't properly have their issues heard and/or addressed sufficiently. I get it's not easy to define "meaningful consultation" but if you think the unanimous decision by judges appointed by Harper are part of a Liberal conspiracy, that's on you...

People actually think a military coup would be easier and more beneficial than spending some months actually going out and talking to First Nations and making sure they are heard. What a world we live in.

[Resolute 14]

No kidding. Advanced polls are open for five days, 11 hours a day, on top of election day itself. And you don't have to go to a specific location for the advanced polls.

If you can't find the time given that much time and availability, it's not the government that's the problem. It's you.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

I think if we want to stick it to the rest of Canada, blockading our own oil and secceding probably aren't the right move.

But opting out of the CPP in favor of a Quebec style version would be a good card to play. Alberta is younger and richer than the rest of Canada, so we overpay into that (like pretty much every federal program). If we left the CPP, our contributions could go down and everyone else's would go up. Giving folks a little taste of what Alberta does for the rest of the country has potential merit I'd say.

Hardly goes far enough. Alberta should have its own tax collection department. Quebec wants to do the same.

Then, the feds can come and get their equalization money.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

your employer has to provide time for you to vote on election day. what more do you want?
I don't think they should have to consider accommodating people for the advance voting.

Only if you don't have 3 hours of consecutive time off during voting hours.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Only if you don't have 3 hours of consecutive time off during voting hours.

so the op should have no problem. he either has 3 hours, or his work has to give the time to him.

still don't see why the original poster is complaining that the advance polls are not open earlier in the day for his convenience.

there is plenty of time for him to find 5 minutes to go vote over the next week.

[Nsd1]

Went to the advance polling station close to my house this morning. I was in and out in about two minutes. The elections officers looked pretty bored.

I've been getting a lot of campaign calls on my home number, even from candidates not in my riding.

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

They can be against the pipeline, it's their right, and the Court of Appeal can still believe they weren't properly consulted and didn't properly have their issues heard and/or addressed sufficiently. I get it's not easy to define "meaningful consultation" but if you think the unanimous decision by judges appointed by Harper are part of a Liberal conspiracy, that's on you...

People actually think a military coup would be easier and more beneficial than spending some months actually going out and talking to First Nations and making sure they are heard. What a world we live in.

I don't think it's a "Liberal conspiracy", and I don't care who appointed them this isn't the US. I think those judges made a decision based on either not liking pipelines, O&G, or naively thinking that bowing to one tribe's concerns while ignoring the vast majority who want the project was some kind of reconciliation attempt. You had widespread shock and confusion at that ruling.

Look the nation can be against the pipeline that's obviously their right. What I take issue with is clearly disingenuously using the grey area around consultations to stop the project. It cheapens any legitimate concerns with this issue, how can you take these claims seriously when it's clear even the proponents don't actually care? I don't think you understand what you're saying here. I, and I assume everyone else in Canada is pro-consultation. Pro-good faith consultation. Those consultations happened in 2016 and 2017. This franken-process clearly designed to stop the project is not beneficial and will not assuage any further crying about improper consultations because it's not legitimate. This is crystal clear.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by DiracSpike

I don't think it's a "Liberal conspiracy", and I don't care who appointed them this isn't the US. I think those judges made a decision based on either not liking pipelines, O&G, or naively thinking that bowing to one tribe's concerns while ignoring the vast majority who want the project was some kind of reconciliation attempt. You had widespread shock and confusion at that ruling.

Look the nation can be against the pipeline that's obviously their right. What I take issue with is clearly disingenuously using the grey area around consultations to stop the project. It cheapens any legitimate concerns with this issue, how can you take these claims seriously when it's clear even the proponents don't actually care? I don't think you understand what you're saying here. I, and I assume everyone else in Canada is pro-consultation. Pro-good faith consultation. Those consultations happened in 2016 and 2017. This franken-process clearly designed to stop the project is not beneficial and will not assuage any further crying about improper consultations because it's not legitimate. This is crystal clear.

Proper consultations will only have occurred when the pipeline is denied. That's essentially what those who have the lawsuits at the ready have said.

[Makarov]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Proper consultations will only have occurred when the pipeline is denied. That's essentially what those who have the lawsuits at the ready have said.

They can say whatever they want. They aren't the ones with the authority to make that determination.

[Flamenspiel]

Here is the latest from the CBC and Grenier:

https://newsinteractives.cbc.ca/elec...acker/alberta/

99% probability of UCP winning the most seats. Damage control time for the NDP.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Flamenspiel

Here is the latest from the CBC and Grenier:

https://newsinteractives.cbc.ca/elec...acker/alberta/

99% probability of UCP winning the most seats. Damage control time for the NDP.

I doubt the NDP believes privately in their hearts that the UCP won't win a big majority of seats. They are building for future elections.

[Flamenspiel]

^^I think for the NDP to win next time they need to become more nationalistic, perhaps a kind of a Parti Albertoi. There is no reason to cede the Pro-Alberta separatist crowd to the right. Whats happening in Ottawa right now with Bill C-48 is unprecedented and will change politics in Alberta forever.

They also need to build appeal in Calgary, even the medical "superlab" proposal was to be installed in Edmonton, the new schools were all to be installed in NDP ridings and so on(my son's school in Calgary actually had a write up on it a year ago). Calgarians are not going to vote for a party that moves money from here to Edmonton, its just so pork barrel.

[bizaro86]

I advance voted UCP today. Was thinking about Alberta Party, and like their candidate in my riding.

But ultimately the NDP election ad is correct - we can either have Rachel or Jason, and all things considered I prefer the UCP to 4 more years of the NDP. Not thrilled with the UCP either..

[dino7c]

Considering the federal NDP are against resource development/pipelines I think a name/affiliation change would be absolutely necessary.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

I advance voted UCP today. Was thinking about Alberta Party, and like their candidate in my riding.

But ultimately the NDP election ad is correct - we can either have Rachel or Jason, and all things considered I prefer the UCP to 4 more years of the NDP. Not thrilled with the UCP either..

You didn't want to vote for the candidate you liked? Was the UCP candidate better in your opinion?

This province is was long overdue for a competitive two-party election scenario, which I believe we now have. However, a "middle ground" option creates even more opportunity for voters and presses the other parties to be sharper and more in tune with Albertans.

There is also nothing wrong with the UCP forming a minority government; this would probably make them more responsive to all Albertans. Voting for the AP, NDP, or any other party helps accomplish that.