2018/2019 Trade Speculation and Rumors

[neo45]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

I'd rather have two neals than one kovalchuk

Then you know very little about hockey.


Neal has one skill and Kovalchuk is better at that. Also Neal doesn’t have that skill anymore. He is a zero dimensional player on a huge contract.

The only player in the league I wouldn’t trade Neal 1 for 1 for is Lucic. He is that bad

[kukkudo]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The Sharks problem next year is how many of their present guys are up for renewals: Karlsson, Joe P., Joe T., Donskoi, Meier. And they are in a position where they can't move anyone now, because they are a contending team. One or both of the Joes are moving on, I bet. How much would you pay a 40 year old Thornton? He still can play. Or a 35 year old Pavelski?

Now, if you cut both of the Joes loose, there's $11M for more players and Erik.

I think Burns and Vlasic are going to be deals that aren't profitable pretty soon. Maybe even Couture's contract is going to be a bad one going forward. Really, the only great value they have is Hertl, if he keeps up his present pace.

If the Sharks get bounced out in the first round, they probably change up major things.

[Bleeding Red]

QuestionS - If the Flames pick up an elite RW (Panarin, Kovolchuk) does Peters automatically play him on the top line? Does he replace Lindholm?

I don't think Peters breaks up that line for anything. We may think "Hey he'll score a ton with Johnny Hockey." But I think they will get as much an opportunity to do that as Neal has had - very limited at best. I'm sure Neal would be doing great if he played on the top line with #13 & #23 every shift.

Also, do either of these guys replace Tkchuck on PP1? Or does Linholm come off PP1?

If the answer is NO to all of the above, then you have traded for a guy who will likely be unhappy, under productive, and gone.

[neo45]

Originally Posted by Bleeding Red

QuestionS - If the Flames pick up an elite RW (Panarin, Kovolchuk) does Peters automatically play him on the top line? Does he replace Lindholm?

I don't think Peters breaks up that line for anything. We may think "Hey he'll score a ton with Johnny Hockey." But I think they will get as much an opportunity to do that as Neal has had - very limited at best. I'm sure Neal would be doing great if he played on the top line with #13 & #23 every shift.

Also, do either of these guys replace Tkchuck on PP1? Or does Linholm come off PP1?

If the answer is NO to all of the above, then you have traded for a guy who will likely be unhappy, under productive, and gone.

Seems like good problems to have for a playoff run honestly. A guy too good to be playing second line and second power play? That means you have a bunch of really good players

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by neo45

Seems like good problems to have for a playoff run honestly. A guy too good to be playing second line and second power play? That means you have a bunch of really good players

It also means that you will probably have a very unhappy guy in the room. That is never good and, again, you have messed with the obvious chemistry within those walls.

It's not just about the player, it has to be the RIGHT player which is something BT has really focused on since last summer.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by neo45

Then you know very little about hockey.


Neal has one skill and Kovalchuk is better at that. Also Neal doesn’t have that skill anymore. He is a zero dimensional player on a huge contract.

The only player in the league I wouldn’t trade Neal 1 for 1 for is Lucic. He is that bad

I think everyone will just tune out the rest of your post after that first sentence. Poor form.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Bingo

I think everyone will just tune out the rest of your post after that first sentence. Poor form.

ignore list, actually

[neo45]

Originally Posted by Bingo

I think everyone will just tune out the rest of your post after that first sentence. Poor form.

It was an idiotic statement I was responding to. Kovalchuk is producing at LITERALLY double the rate of Neal on a less ugly contract.

He is on the second worst offensive team in the league and Neal is on the second best.

Kovalchuk has other aspects to his game where as even effective Neal is one dimensional.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by neo45

It was an idiotic statement I was responding to. Kovalchuk is producing at LITERALLY double the rate of Neal on a less ugly contract.

He is on the second worst offensive team in the league and Neal is on the second best.

Kovalchuk has other aspects to his game where as even effective Neal is one dimensional.

No ... it was an opinion different from your own that you showed zero class in responding to.

[Otto-matic]

Originally Posted by neo45

It was an idiotic statement I was responding to. Kovalchuk is producing at LITERALLY double the rate of Neal on a less ugly contract.

He is on the second worst offensive team in the league and Neal is on the second best.

Kovalchuk has other aspects to his game where as even effective Neal is one dimensional.

I don't think Kovalchuk would fare any better on Calgary's 3rd line. Probably producing the same as Neal who btw has been playing better for the past while.

[neo45]

Originally Posted by Otto-matic

I don't think Kovalchuk would fare any better on Calgary's 3rd line. Probably producing the same as Neal who btw has been playing better for the past while.

He is playing with worse players in LA and producing at twice the rate Neal is. Leading his team in P/60 actually. And again LA is arguably the worst scoring team in the league

I don’t see him getting worse here, and he would have to get considerably worse to be a downgrade on Neal

[Bleeding Red]

Originally Posted by neo45

Kovalchuk has other aspects to his game where as even effective Neal is one dimensional.

Other than the fact he has more points than Neal (playing a top 6 role), what exactly does he bring? What other aspects to Kovolchucks game are you seeing?

I have always seen him as a one dimensional goal scorer. No back checking / defensive prowess (hence his -19). Can he still skate? Is he physical in anyway?

Here is one thing I notice - Neal has been to the SCF twice in the last two years. In that time Kovolchuck has been trying to convert Rubles to dollars.

I'll take that veteran playoff experience every day.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Otto-matic

I don't think Kovalchuk would fare any better on Calgary's 3rd line. Probably producing the same as Neal who btw has been playing better for the past while.

Kovalchuk's a little bit older but he's always been an elite skater, and has been an elite NHLer his whole career while Neal has been a top six complementary forward. I think Kovalchuk would absolutely fare better on our third line. This is a guy only seven years removed from carrying his team singlehandedly to the SCF, he's not a passenger even on a bad L.A. team. Neal has been playing better but I think Neal's ceiling is Kovy's floor at this point.

[neo45]

Originally Posted by Bleeding Red

Other than the fact he has more points than Neal (playing a top 6 role), what exactly does he bring? What other aspects to Kovolchucks game are you seeing?

I have always seen him as a one dimensional goal scorer. No back checking / defensive prowess (hence his -19). Can he still skate? Is he physical in anyway?

Here is one thing I notice - Neal has been to the SCF twice in the last two years. In that time Kovolchuck has been trying to convert Rubles to dollars.

I'll take that veteran playoff experience every day.

Kovalchuk has playoff experience too, and in a bigger role than Neal. He was his team’s best player in a run to the finals. Can’t deny the man that

He is a better skater, passer, puck handler, defensive player etc than Neal. He even has a better shot. He is literally better at every aspect of the game than Neal. Even gritty aspects like fighting I give the edge to Kovalchuk

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Bleeding Red

Other than the fact he has more points than Neal (playing a top 6 role), what exactly does he bring? What other aspects to Kovolchucks game are you seeing?

I have always seen him as a one dimensional goal scorer. No back checking / defensive prowess (hence his -19). Can he still skate? Is he physical in anyway?

Here is one thing I notice - Neal has been to the SCF twice in the last two years. In that time Kovolchuck has been trying to convert Rubles to dollars.

I'll take that veteran playoff experience every day.

This is a brutal take. Kovalchuk has killed penalties on a top-in-league PK unit before. He's led the NHL in shorthanded goals. That's one dimensional? When's the last time you saw Gaudreau or Tkachuk or Neal killing penalties?

He was every bit a two-way player during his devils tenure. He even has a Selke vote on his resume for whatever little that is worth.

[Bleeding Red]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Kovalchuk's a little bit older but he's always been an elite skater, and has been an elite NHLer his whole career while Neal has been a top six complementary forward. I think Kovalchuk would absolutely fare better on our third line. This is a guy only seven years removed from carrying his team singlehandedly to the SCF, he's not a passenger even on a bad L.A. team. Neal has been playing better but I think Neal's ceiling is Kovy's floor at this point.

Fair enough. I haven't seen Kovelchuck play lately. Is he getting top PP time? Is he playing with Kopitar?

(That 2011-2012 team also had Brodeur in net standing on his head - 2.12 GAA & .917 SV%. Also, Kovolchuck was only 4 pts better and tied in goals with Parise & Zajac. Hardley a one man show. Highlighting Kovelchuk in that run is like highlighting Iginla (who was 7 goals better than the next guy) in 2004 and ignoring Kipper's role.)

[Bingo]

Any decision on Neal has to come down to one single evaluation.

Is this James Neal version here to stay, or has a guy shooting at 30% of his normal career shooting percentage having an inexplicably bad (unlucky) year?

If it's the former than Kovalchuk would be a minor upgrade if you ignore all intangibles, and has a shorter contract.

If it's the latter you're selling on a down season and probably getting the lesser player for the next two years.

[savardandjokinen]

Yeah I’d add to Neal to get Kovalchuk. Neal has negative value and Kovalchuk doesn’t. Neal isn’t a top 6 forward, Kovalchuk is.

Gaudreau-Monahan-Lindholm
Tkachuk-Backlund-Kovalchuk
Bennett-Jankowski-Frolik
Czarnik-Ryan-Hathaway

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Bleeding Red

Fair enough. I haven't seen Kovelchuck play. Is he getting top PP time? Is he playing with Kopitar?

(That 2011-2012 team also had Brodeur in net standing on his head - 2.12 GAA & .917 SV%. Also, Kovolchuck was only 4 pts better and tied in goals with Parise & Zajac. Hardley a one man show. Highlighting Kovelchuk in that run is like highlighting Iginla (who was 7 goals better than the next guy) in 2004 and ignoring Kipper's role.)

It's more like saying I'd rather have a better skating 2011 Iginla (i.e. seven years after the run) than a 2019 James Neal

[icecube]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Any decision on Neal has to come down to one single evaluation.

Is this James Neal version here to stay, or has a guy shooting at 30% of his normal career shooting percentage having an inexplicably bad (unlucky) year?

If it's the former than Kovalchuk would be a minor upgrade if you ignore all intangibles, and has a shorter contract.

If it's the latter you're selling on a down season and probably getting the lesser player for the next two years.

Kovalchuk has never and will never be a lesser player than James Neal.