[Trade] Habs trade Pacioretty to VGK for Tatar, Suzuki, 2nd UPD: signs $7mil x 4 yr with VGK

[sureLoss]

contract is heavily front loaded

https://twitter.com/user/status/1039227017663639552

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

That's not too bad thanks to the term. You have to think that it's going to be fine until the last couple of years, anyway.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by habernac

Four years, $7M AAV. Keys here are VGK avoid lengthy term and Pacioretty gets a premium AAV in a tax-favorable state for his (financially) career-defining contract.

I don't think it's necessarily a premium AAV. As I argued earlier, Pacioretty, if he bounces back, is one of the most consistent goal-scorers in the league. This contract will end before his 35th birthday. Players like that make bank, and 7M is no longer bank.

Florida, Nashville, Dallas, Tampa all have same tax rates at around 32%. And at least half the league has under 40%. So even if he could have got 7.5Mx4 years or 7Mx5 years, he would likely end up making more with a number of other teams. I think those are term and cap-hit a ton of teams would jump on if available. And really, as much as Vegas has done and the moves they made, I think I would have waited to see if it was a fluke or not.

But again, can't blame a guy for signing a 28M guaranteed contract. Especially after a relatively crappy season.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by VilleN

I think ‘preposterous ‘ is a bit of an exaggeration. It depends on what you think last season was for VGK. A fluke? Indicative of what they truly are? Somewhere in between? I tend to think it is more in between, but if I were management I would be extremely cautious about thinking the window is now.

Perhaps a bit of an exaggeration, but no more so than suggesting that the Knights are bankrupting their future by making a deal like this. I also tend to believe they are "somewhere in between," and think that even at the expense of Suzuki + a 2nd there is plenty to work with in terms of their existing pool of prospects and large collection of draft picks.

If memory serves, Vegas has traded away a 1st, two 2nds, a 3rd, and a highly regarded 1st round prospect(Suzuki), for Max Pacioretty. Trading away those kind of assets will significantly impact the future of your franchise. I think it is reasonable, given that VGK have only been around for a season, to say it puts their long term success into question.

Yes and no, depending on how much currency the team has to work with in the first place. I would say that costs in a deal like this are relative to the number of assets a team has at their disposal. VGK has A LOT of them, and thus can in some sense afford the present expense without feeling it as sharply long term as most other teams. Again, while the cost of Suzuki and a high draft pick is high VGK still has a tonne of picks and prospects to work with now and into the future. I just don't see how this deal has hampered their ability to continue to improve with young, high skilled players through the draft.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

How does Vegas keep signing guys to reasonable term like this? I would've thought patches would get 6 years easy. Same with stastny and marchessault, just great contracts.

Someone had mentioned earlier this year that Vegas was attempting to switch up strategy from the bulk of the league and move to shorter, higher AAV contracts.

The theory being that GM's strive so hard for low AAV's that you almost guarantee an inability to compete for 4-5 years after your vision reaches maturation. Ever since the salary cap came in it's been an arms race for low AAV, now some are starting to see the possible value in it.


You may lose one extra spot for a high value asset on your roster due to higher AAV's, but everyone on your roster becomes a tradable asset, allowing way more room for retooling, and stocking draft picks.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

For whatever it's worth, Pronman's recent ranking of farm systems had Suzuki listed as Vegas's 4th best prospect, behind Glass, Elvenes and Gusev, and in the third "tier" of prospects (which goes, "Elite", "High End" and then "Very Good"). So yeah, hardly a fatal blow to the prospect pool there, even though I agree with those who are talking up Suzuki's potential for sure. Gotta give to get, I suppose.

[jayswin]

Interesting strategy and I bet more teams start going this way. Don't get attached to players being on your team for their whole prime, just use them for as little number of "risk" years as possible with a higher AAV and then flip them for picks or someone younger near the end of the contract.

[Oil Stain]

Good move looks better once that contract is factored in.

If things play out how they should, Vegas gets an elite winger for the remainder of his prime at a decent cap hit.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Marchessault / Karlsson / Smith
Pacioretty / Stastny / Tuch
Haula / Eakin / Lindberg
Carrier / Bellemare / Reaves
Nosek

[ricardodw]

The Flames get Backlund for 32.1M for 6 years and the Knights get Pacioretty for 32.05 for 5 years.

Pretty good contract for the Knights.

[habernac]

Pete Blackburn
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Congrats to Max Pacioretty for getting $28 million on his first afternoon in Vegas. I usually get way too drunk and lose my wallet

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

The Flames get Backlund for 32.1M for 6 years and the Knights get Pacioretty for 32.05 for 5 years.

Pretty good contract for the Knights.

"hmmm, an NHL topic, allow me to just throw shade at your....I MEAN OUR team, the Calgary Flames!" - Every Ricardodw post ever.

My favourite part of his schtik is the commitment level it takes to stare down a board where literally every single poster knows you're a Jets fan and never acknowledge that you are, instead just taking as many opportunities with careful wording as possible to suggest you're a Flames fan. Incredible commitment.

[Flash Walken]

I get the tatar trade from the wings was bad, but i dont really understand posters suggesting this is another bad trade for vegas?

IMO, this is a good trade for Vegas.

Roughly the same kind of cost out as Calgary gave up for Hamonic and they get a top 6 winger on a good term who can score goals, effectively replacing Neal on a more favourable term than what Neal had been seeking from Vegas.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by jayswin

"hmmm, an NHL topic, allow me to just throw shade at your....I MEAN OUR team, the Calgary Flames!" - Every Ricardodw post ever.

My favourite part of his schtik is the commitment level it takes to stare down a board where literally every single poster knows you're a Jets fan and never acknowledge that you are, instead just taking as many opportunities with careful wording as possible to suggest you're a Flames fan. Incredible commitment.

If you're responding like this to ricardo in 2018 you might be a bigger problem than he is.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

The Flames get Backlund for 32.1M for 6 years and the Knights get Pacioretty for 32.05 for 5 years.

Pretty good contract for the Knights.

Backlund is a centre. Also more rounded. And cheaper as you note. And he didn’t cost any players, prospects or picks.

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

If you're responding like this to ricardo in 2018 you might be a bigger problem than he is.

So taking a personal shot at a respected CP member while at the same time, excusing ricardo's nonsense posting?

Lol

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Gaskal

So taking a personal shot at a respected CP member while at the same time, excusing ricardo's nonsense posting?

Lol

if you can't ignore a troll that's been trolling the board for what, a decade?, how respected can you be?

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

Neal is not the player Pacioretty is/was. I like both guys a lot, but Pacioretty is a much superior player if he bounces back to his career averages.

They both became full-timers in the 11/12 season. Since then, here are their stats (games/G/A/P):

Pach: 503 / 206 / 193 / 399
Neal: 469 / 190 / 168 / 358

Percentages:

Pach: .409 / .383 / .793
Neal: .405 / .358 / .763

'much superior player' is a pretty big overstatement IMO.

Then factor in their AAVs, and I'll take Neal at $5.75M over Pacioretty at $7M anyday. And then you have to add that Pacioretty had an acquisition cost.

[sketchyt]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Backlund is a centre. Also more rounded. And cheaper as you note. And he didn’t cost any players, prospects or picks.

That, and he compared the Pacioretty contract (including current contract + extension) to Backlund (just extension). Disingenuous at best.

So really, comparing apples to apples... we got:
Backlund for $35.675 / 7 years = $5.096 per year.
Pacioretty for $32.05 / 5 years = $6.41 per year.

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

if you can't ignore a troll that's been trolling the board for what, a decade?, how respected can you be?

Because it's amusing, of course.

It's like watching a new Sacha Baron Cohen character playing an extremely misinformed Jets fan.