What is T.J. Brodie's value?

[Kipper_3434]

Brodie is a good defenceman, who has had some really tough bounces that look horrible. Like last night, if you look at how the puck bounced on him on the 3-2 goal. Or that blowout against Detroit where he blindly knocked the puck in the net while blocking the pass on the 2 on 1. I feel like that play in particular had him over thinking a bit and making some mental errors afterwards. And also put him under the microscope from fans. Yeah he's not a perfect denceman or even an elite offensive d-man. Those guys cost 9m a season.

Brodie is valuable to this team and helps us win games for similar to what Kris Russell is paid. He's worth a top six forward under 25, or an enticing package of picks/prospects. Maybe someone like Drouin or Galchenyuk or Hoffman, but I don't see a move like that helping the team much. Better to keep him until Valimaki or Kulak can step up.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I don't see the Flames moving a Dman at all.

They can't move Brodie unless they truly believe one of Kulak, Kylington or Valimaki are ready to play a top 4 NHL role. The lefty/righty thing is real folks.

As for the righties,

Hamilton is the youngest of our Dcore, and unless he asks for a trade, I just can't see him being dealt.

They just acquired Hamonic, they won't be dealing him. At least it seems ridiculously unlikely.

They just re-signed Stone, although this to me is the most likely of all the Flames D to get moved if they do move one. But in that case it seems likely it will be done in order to recoup picks and clear a spot for Andersson.

Bottom line, with the cap going up they don't need to move one of their top 5 for cap space, so unless they are unable to add scoring some other way I find it really unlikely that they trade a Dman within a year of finally building it up to what it is now.

I think your last paragraph here is key. I believe Flames would like more scoring up front. So question is how do you see them adding it?

Improvement from current roster - sure but probably not enough
Current prospect emerges - not an obvious scorer in the mix
UFA - hasn’t worked out well
Trade - what are the valuable trade chips Flames could part with? This certainly leads some people to look at the D. That’s where I’m at.

[flamesfever]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I think your last paragraph here is key. I believe Flames would like more scoring up front. So question is how do you see them adding it?

Improvement from current roster - sure but probably not enough
Current prospect emerges - not an obvious scorer in the mix
UFA - hasn’t worked out well
Trade - what are the valuable trade chips Flames could part with? This certainly leads some people to look at the D. That’s where I’m at.

I agree that our main need is a top line RW with size, aggressiveness, and consistent scoring ability. In order to acquire one, I think that we would have to offer someone like Hamilton. This would allow us to pair Brodie back with Gio, and hopefully with their chemistry, Brodie would return to the near all star player we had in the past.

[jayswin]

I find it quite frustrating that Brad Treliving has built this team up as one that should be EASILY able to trade from a position of strength (defense) to shore up a weakness and yet our coaching staff's implementation of a rigid right left defense requirement has rendered that trade strength almost completely useless.

It's basically made right and left defense a completely different position in terms of trades, signings and most frustratingly in terms of prospect development and graduation.

What a handicap in so many ways. How many other team do this? Is it just Mike Babcock and us?

[Mike F]

Originally Posted by jayswin

What a handicap in so many ways. How many other team do this? Is it just Mike Babcock and us?

The "funny" thing is that, while Babcock seems to have popularized this when putting together his Olympic teams, he doesn't let it rule his decisions with the Leafs - they have 3 left shots in their top 4: Hainsey, Reilly, and Gardiner.

[Mike F]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Friggin amazing, like maybe Calgary's most likely NHL roster player.

Dillon Dube, drafted 56th overall. Named Captain of his World Junior team this year.

You really thinks so? I know the captaincy jumped out to a lot of people, but he only put up 4 points in 6 games at the WJHC. He strikes me as a Jason Botterill type: lots of leadership, but I have doubts that his offense will translate to pro.

Andersson is much more likely to be a roster player.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Mike F

You really thinks so? I know the captaincy jumped out to a lot of people, but he only put up 4 points in 6 games at the WJHC. He strikes me as a Jason Botterill type: lots of leadership, but I have doubts that his offense will translate to pro.

Andersson is much more likely to be a roster player.

Dube will be a roster player. The only undecided for me is which half of the roster.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Dube will be a roster player. The only undecided for me is which half of the roster.

Next year?

[Mike F]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Dube will be a roster player.

Well reasoned. I guess that settles it.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Mike F

Well reasoned. I guess that settles it.

I've given my reasons previously. I didn't think an analysis was necessary, however, he is tremendously intelligent as a hockey player, has a great motor, can play in any role in a team, nod generally plays an NHL type game.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Next year?

The odds are pretty good IMO.

[flameester]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

Giordano and Hamilton bring a hell of a lot more to the equation than purely offence. If Brodie isn’t bringing offence, he’s bringing not much at all. Gio is +8, Hamilton is +13, Brodie is -8.

Would you consider Rhett Warrener a good opinion of NHL denfencemen? He seems to be of the same opinion as me with TJ Brodie. Eliott Friedman, though more diplomatic than Warrener, also routinely speaks about Brodie’s fall from grace when he’s calling in to the morning show.

That is not what I asked you. You said
Brodie’s offence was non existent- so I said Gios and Hamilton have similar numbers so their offence must be non existent as well.

Don’t skirt what you said..

[Mike F]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I've given my reasons previously. I didn't think an analysis was necessary, however, he is tremendously intelligent as a hockey player, has a great motor, can play in any role in a team, nod generally plays an NHL type game.

You just described Curtis Lazar to a T as a prospect, who had a much bigger impact at the WJHC in his draft year +2 (5 goals, 9 pts in 7 games).

Lazar’s not the most flashy player in junior, but he plays the kind of game that impresses scouts. He’s a strong skater and has good positioning. He often players against the other team’s best players, but frequently generates turnovers due to his ability to read offensive plays. His passing isn’t quite elite, but it’s definitely not bad by any stretch. Best of all, he has a hard, accurate shot and is able to get it off quickly. His shot may already be pro-level.

Lazar’s the type of player that can be used on a team’s second line, power-play and penalty kill, regardless of who else is on the team. He’s not bad at anything and he’s good at just about everything. He’s a lunch-bucket, meat-and-potatoes kind of hockey player, but a very complete version of that style of player, with the ability to play in almost any situation and excel. He’s not a highlight-reel player like the MacKinnons or Drouins of this year’s draft class, but he may be the player whose style would need to change the least to translate effectively to the NHL. If he can pack on a bit of muscle without losing his speed, Lazar may be one of the best bets in this year’s draft class.

Deeming any but the bluest chip prospects as certain roster players is either ignorance or arrogance.

[GoJetsGo]

Dube was extremely impressive in camp this year and got a long hard look despite the fact he was going back to junior.

I don't think it's at all overzealous to suggest he might crack the roster next season. He made a strong push to make it this year.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Mike F

You just described Curtis Lazar to a T as a prospect, who had a much bigger impact at the WJHC in his draft year +2 (5 goals, 9 pts in 7 games).



Deeming any but the bluest chip prospects as certain roster players is either ignorance or arrogance.

I didn't deem anything. In my opinion he's going to make the NHL. I think he would have had a shot this year if not for his age.

And guess what. Lazar is an NHL player too. He made the opening night roster as soon as he got out of junior IIRC.

[Mike F]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I didn't deem anything. In my opinion he's going to make the NHL. I think he would have had a shot this year if not for his age.

And guess what. Lazar is an NHL player too. He made the opening night roster as soon as he got out of junior IIRC.

You said "Dube will be a roster player" period. That's a lot stronger than "I think he's got a good shot at making it to the NHL".

And Curtis Lazar, who, again, outperformed Dube against elite competition at the same age, is in his second organization and just clinging to a 4th line spot. If that's your idea of "Dube will be a roster player", then sure. I'll admit he stands an OK chance at being a Lazar, and a good chance of at being at least a Dustin Boyd, but that's not saying much.

He could turn out to be a good NHLer, and I hope he does, as Calgary is devoid of many forward prospects, but penciling him in as a permanent roster player for any meaningful period of time ignores pro hockey history for guys picked after round 1.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The odds are pretty good IMO.

THat would be awesome but I suppose the safe money is that he starts in Stockton. He has the advantage of very few winger prospects ahead of him.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

THat would be awesome but I suppose the safe money is that he starts in Stockton. He has the advantage of very few winger prospects ahead of him.

Yeah, all of whom he outperformed in camp last time. Including Mangiapane and Hathaway IMO. I thought Hrivik was the only guy about even with him, and Hrivik had better linemates.

Let me be clear, he may we'll end up in Stockton to start. But IMO he will be an NHLer. And he has a good chance of it next year.

And yes, Mike F, I said Dube will be a roster player. As I am not the GM, it's pretty obvious that it's just my opinion.

[Rick M.]

I’d be reluctant to trade Brodie unless I was sure Kylington was going to make it. Nobody else in our system has wheels like T.J.

[The Boy Wonder]

the left right defense thing is super annoying and I wish we could go away from it but currently it's probably too difficult to move Brodie as no one seems confident in Andersson or bartkowski stepping in as 6th man. And if we then got hit with an injury to the top 4 we would be suddenly very short staffed on the back end. We have a very good top 6 but not much depth that can step in and play at a playoff level right away.


I feel like the only trade that could be made would be moving an Adam fox for a winger but that's probably not meeting the current asking prices.