10-07-2017, 09:20 AM
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#3181
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99
So nevermind the actual idea...it wasnt on glossy enough paper for you?
That's a good way to judge a project.
You don't think the CSEC was taking that seriously?
Well then, nothing left to say.
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Come on now.
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10-07-2017, 09:32 AM
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#3182
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Maryland State House, Annapolis
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It's funny because if the argument is "substance, not style", CalgaryNEXT is still a failure, albeit not an abject failure. But when you're trying to extract hundreds of millions in taxpayer dollars, you can't be easily upstaged by a fifth grader in terms of presentation.
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"Think I'm gonna be the scapegoat for the whole damn machine? Sheeee......."
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10-07-2017, 09:44 AM
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#3183
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Calgary, AB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by surferguy
If this is the true ask, does it make a move more tangible for the Flames if they can find a new location that will capitulate to them and give them their ask? They would make way more money with all of the real estate etc.
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Which city is going to give them that though?
Seattle has already made a deal for their arena redevelopment with a private investors group. Kansas City's arena has been open for years and the area around the arena is already built up. Quebec City's arena is built and from what I can tell, it doesn't appear to be in a location ripe for urban redevelopment.
San Diego? Baltimore? Both large cities with old arenas and no NBA or NHL teams, but they already used their baseball stadiums as their drivers for urban renewal.
Austin, Texas is the largest city in the US with no major league sports teams. They do have the University of Texas though, and a newish (but small) arena where the Texas Stars play. It also already has a pretty vibrant downtown from my understanding.
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Turn up the good, turn down the suck!
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10-07-2017, 09:44 AM
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#3184
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#1 Goaltender
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: North of the River, South of the Bluff
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99
So nevermind the actual idea...it wasnt on glossy enough paper for you?
That's a good way to judge a project.
You don't think the CSEC was taking that seriously?
Well then, nothing left to say.
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They half arsed the entire presentation. Almost like they didn’t want to invest enough time because they knew it was a flyer. Correct costs? Nope traffic considerations? Nope city buy in? Nope
Then held out their hands and wanted a billion dollars for.
I do project proposals all the time. I would not have gone to the stakeholders for buy in on even a six figure project with their level of preparedness. It was embarrassing.
It showed a lack of professionalism, one that rightfully threw up flags that these guys weren’t serious or were not qualified to actually execute.
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10-07-2017, 10:09 AM
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#3185
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#1 Goaltender
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: the middle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99
So nevermind the actual idea...it wasnt on glossy enough paper for you?
That's a good way to judge a project.
You don't think the CSEC was taking that seriously?
Well then, nothing left to say.
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The idea was ####, the fact they didn't even spend the money on 'glossy paper' just shows how little they truly believed in it as well (or it just shows they're incompetent, and I don't want to fork over city money to incompetent people either. I do enough of that on my own). No desire to truly try and sell it.
If you're going to try and sell me a #### sandwich at least throw a garnish on the plate. Make me believe you actually think I should eat it.
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10-07-2017, 10:22 AM
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#3186
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Fearmongerer
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Wondering when # became hashtag and not a number sign.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OldDutch
They half arsed the entire presentation. Almost like they didn’t want to invest enough time because they knew it was a flyer. Correct costs? Nope traffic considerations? Nope city buy in? Nope
Then held out their hands and wanted a billion dollars for.
I do project proposals all the time. I would not have gone to the stakeholders for buy in on even a six figure project with their level of preparedness. It was embarrassing.
It showed a lack of professionalism, one that rightfully threw up flags that these guys weren’t serious or were not qualified to actually execute.
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OK, say you are right in your assumption that it was all a giant smokescreen.
What was their plan then?
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10-07-2017, 11:18 AM
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#3187
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Franchise Player
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Youre right. It's just business. Then let's stop playing the heart strings card and ditch the Filipino lady at the hospice story. Because thats making it personal.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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10-07-2017, 11:23 AM
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#3188
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Backup Goalie
Join Date: Apr 2011
Exp:  
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Bill Smith, who has yet to articulate a single specific idea in this campaign, is now ahead in the polls. On top of everything else, he refuses to release his donor list. In the end, power and greed always win.
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10-07-2017, 11:29 AM
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#3189
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Powerplay Quarterback
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fotiou22
Bill Smith, who has yet to articulate a single specific idea in this campaign, is now ahead in the polls. On top of everything else, he refuses to release his donor list. In the end, power and greed always win.
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Pretty sure he'll never release that list because I'd bet anything you'd find the Calgary Flames on it.
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10-07-2017, 11:32 AM
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#3190
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Some kinda newsbreaker!
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Learning Phaneufs skating style
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Fan #751
Pretty sure he'll never release that list because I'd bet anything you'd find the Calgary Flames on it.
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Provincial law says donor lists must be disclosed by March 1, problem is that is well after the election.
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10-07-2017, 11:32 AM
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#3191
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Calgary
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The Flames are going to need more than just a new mayor to vote in a new arena. any indication if they're backing specific people in key wards? I'd imagine they'd target Druh's ward and ward 6 since Pootmans is not running. which other wards do you guys think?
__________________
The Delhi police have announced the formation of a crack team dedicated to nabbing the elusive 'Monkey Man' and offered a reward for his -- or its -- capture.
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10-07-2017, 11:36 AM
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#3192
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Powerplay Quarterback
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sureLoss
Provincial law says donor lists must be disclosed by March 1, problem is that is well after the election.
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Then I guess on March 1 we'll all see that the Flames were on that list!
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10-07-2017, 11:38 AM
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#3193
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Powerplay Quarterback
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Quote:
Originally Posted by monkeyman
The Flames are going to need more than just a new mayor to vote in a new arena. any indication if they're backing specific people in key wards? I'd imagine they'd target Druh's ward and ward 6 since Pootmans is not running. which other wards do you guys think?
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This is true. I do think Nenshi losing will make some councillors who may have been leaning towards no arena change their mind for fear of being ousted themselves next time around.
Make no mistake, I think the Flames taking Nenshi on with their announcement they're pulling away from the table will be a big reason why he lost this election (if he does lose; 17 points down is pretty tough to come back from, though).
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10-07-2017, 11:46 AM
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#3194
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Lifetime Suspension
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: The Void between Darkness and Light
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sureLoss
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God, that Nenshi is so arrogant!
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10-07-2017, 12:03 PM
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#3195
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Backup Goalie
Join Date: Apr 2011
Exp:  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Fan #751
Pretty sure he'll never release that list because I'd bet anything you'd find the Calgary Flames on it.
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Bill Smith was president of the PC party that took a $430,000 cheque from Darryl Katz in 2012, when Redford was especially desperate. This isn't his first rodeo.
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10-07-2017, 12:15 PM
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#3196
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99
OK, say you are right in your assumption that it was all a giant smokescreen.
What was their plan then?
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Their plan was that the presentation was not necessary and/or a formality. That we would swoon and sign the blank cheque because they're the Flames and without the Flames we might as well be Yellowknife.
That was their entire plan.
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10-07-2017, 12:17 PM
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#3197
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Scoring Winger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hockey Fan #751
This is true. I do think Nenshi losing will make some councillors who may have been leaning towards no arena change their mind for fear of being ousted themselves next time around.
Make no mistake, I think the Flames taking Nenshi on with their announcement they're pulling away from the table will be a big reason why he lost this election (if he does lose; 17 points down is pretty tough to come back from, though).
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Almost as important as making the arena an election issue, the Flames can rally a lot of money towards the candidate of their choosing.
I don't think we'll see Ken King or Murray Edwards on the Bill Smith donor list, but I can guarantee we'll see a lot of Flames partners on the list 6 months from now.
$5000 from Molson. $5000 from Jewels by Maximes. $5000 from GEC Architecture. $5000 from PCL Construction. Etc...
Going forward, I think the Calgary economy is going to be a lot flatter than it has been in the past. We might come to regret not fighting harder for a city friendly deal.
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10-07-2017, 12:38 PM
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#3198
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Calgary, Canada
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1991 Canadian
Almost as important as making the arena an election issue, the Flames can rally a lot of money towards the candidate of their choosing.
I don't think we'll see Ken King or Murray Edwards on the Bill Smith donor list, but I can guarantee we'll see a lot of Flames partners on the list 6 months from now.
$5000 from Molson. $5000 from Jewels by Maximes. $5000 from GEC Architecture. $5000 from PCL Construction. Etc...
Going forward, I think the Calgary economy is going to be a lot flatter than it has been in the past. We might come to regret not fighting harder for a city friendly deal.
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I do think that certain firms, partnerships, and business will have a vested financial interest in seeing a candidate who will try and push for the Flames vision of the deal, especially construction etc.
I don't think a family owned jewelry store or a massive global brewery such as Molson-Coors falls into that category outside of them wanting to sell their products and services to existing clients.
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10-07-2017, 02:10 PM
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#3199
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Fearmongerer
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Wondering when # became hashtag and not a number sign.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Regorium
Their plan was that the presentation was not necessary and/or a formality. That we would swoon and sign the blank cheque because they're the Flames and without the Flames we might as well be Yellowknife.
That was their entire plan.
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If you actually believe that....well OK then.
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10-07-2017, 02:17 PM
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#3200
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99
If you actually believe that....well OK then.
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Ah the 26 dimensional checkers argument. OK then.
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