Another Teacher Sex Scandal

[Oling_Roachinen]

Cecil probably thinks that Tad Cummins and Elizabeth Thomas was the love story of our generation.

[Sainters7]

Yeah it's not just the age difference, but the fact he's in a position of power, or "mentor". It's just not acceptable. Just like it wouldn't be if a psychologist was sleeping with their clients. But then much more magnified when in this case, it involves minors.

But agreed that the need for due process is important, no-one knows the true facts yet and it's just moral gut reactions at this point. As bad as it is if it's true, what this guy will go through if the accusations are lies is just brutal too. No matter how it ends up, in the public eye he'll always be "guilty".

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Sainters7

Yeah it's not just the age difference, but the fact he's in a position of power, or "mentor". It's just not acceptable.

For me it is both.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

No, there's no such thing as a legitimate relationship between a 35 year old teacher and his 16 year old student. You're a piece of #### for even suggesting that as a case.

Quote from the biography of Emmanuel Macron:

Macron is married to Brigitte Trogneux, 24 years his senior,who was his teacher in La Providence High School in Amiens. They first met and established a relationship when he was a 15-year-old student who joined the drama club she advised—she was 39 at the time—but they have stated that they did not have sexual relations while he was still a minor. His parents initially attempted to separate the couple by sending him away to Paris to finish the final year of his schooling, as they felt his youth made this relationship inappropriate, but she obtained a divorce from her first husband during this period and reunited with Macron after he graduated, marrying him in 2007.

Pretty hard to say there's a victim in that.

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

Cecil probably thinks that Tad Cummins and Elizabeth Thomas was the love story of our generation.

How about attacking the argument instead of trying to smear him. Believe it or not, deriding someone tends not to get them to come around to your way of thinking.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Itse

Quote from the biography of Emmanuel Macron:



Pretty hard to say there's a victim in that.

The 15-year old who was groomed and preyed upon by his 39 year old teacher was the victim. Not hard at all to see a victim, even if, I guess, you can argue it "worked out."

If a person got really drunk, like ####ed up drunk, went home with a random person at the bar and had sexual relationships with them, would they not be a victim as well? Cause I know at least one marriage that started out like that....

Originally Posted by Reaper

How about attacking the argument instead of trying to smear him. Believe it or not, deriding someone tends not to get them to come around to your way of thinking.

His argument is that a middle aged teacher can have a legitimate relationship with his or her underage student.

My argument is that anyone who believes a middle aged teacher can have a legitimate relationship with his or her underage student is a sick ####. So I guess we're at an impasse.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

If a person got really drunk, like ####ed up drunk, went home with a random person at the bar and had sexual relationships with them, would they not be a victim as well? Cause I know at least one marriage that started out like that....
.

hey we are trying our best to make it work.....

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

The 15-year old who was groomed and preyed upon by his 39 year old teacher was the victim. Not hard at all to see a victim, even if, I guess, you can argue it "worked out."

I was going to just laugh at this. (For one thing because it's a pretty well reported story and you could easily read about it online instead of making up horror stories in your head. Short version: he pursued her.)

However, what you're suggesting is actually really messed up. You seriously think that a sex predator and their victim could just "work it out" and end up happily married?

I find THAT really disturbing.

In fact, this whole line of thinking where you think you know what happened between two people you clearly know nothing about is kind of disturbing.

[Oling_Roachinen]

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-39857474

She was set to be part of the group of captives who were released on Saturday.
Garba Shehu told local Channels TV that 83 girls were supposed to be freed "but one said: 'No, I'm happy where I am. I have found a husband.'"

School-aged girl kidnapped, held for years with her captives. But I suppose she wasn't a victim either because she's happy with how it turned out?

[Itse]

(Besides, not all sexual predators "groom" their victims.)

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

His argument is that a middle aged teacher can have a legitimate relationship with his or her underage student.

My argument is that anyone who believes a middle aged teacher can have a legitimate relationship with his or her underage student is a sick ####. So I guess we're at an impasse.

So? Attack the argument; break down the flaws in the logic, and illustrate why you think he's wrong. But your delicious outrage makes you throw that away because you want to try out your new pitchfork and you're right back to name calling.

[Oling_Roachinen]

I believe if you're in a position of authority and you engage in sexual relationship with your underage student, you're a rapist. There's nothing that offsets it. I mean, it's not a controversial position by any means I would imagine, and fortunately Canadian law matches up with that belief.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-39857474



School-aged girl kidnapped, held for years with her captives. But I suppose she wasn't a victim either because she's happy with how it turned out?

LOL, seriously?

Yeah, obviously totally equivalent situations...

EDIT: I don't know if you're trolling or not, but you're making a fool of yourself either way, so I'm done here

[hah]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

We had a teacher at Wise Wood who cultivated 'relationships' with female students. He was clever enough to wait until the summer after graduation to consummate them. Found out about this years later from a couple of the girls, who said it was a mark of status among their peers to bag Mr. ****, who was a young and good-looking phys-ed teacher.

I remember when I was 18 thinking it was kinda cool that Mr. *** moonlighted as a bouncer at the club we hung out at.

I thought Mr. *** was an English teacher. My locker was beside his class room.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Reaper

So? Attack the argument; break down the flaws in the logic, and illustrate why you think he's wrong. But your delicious outrage makes you throw that away because you want to try out your new pitchfork and you're right back to name calling.

I get that Reaper. But my argument is that anyone who believes a legitimate relationship can occur between a middle aged teacher and his underage student is a sick perverted person. So now do you disagree with my argument?

How many rape victims out there haven't come forward because they "didn't say no" or "they didn't know it was wrong" at the time. Or afraid they will be stigmatized because "they were asking for it." When someone dismisses sexual assault by suggesting it was a "legitimate relationship between people who genuinely love each other" while one of those persons was an underage child, it's a disgusting attitude to have. Especially when the victim has shown the courage to come forward to the police.

Hell, Cecil actually suggested this:

For all we know this girl's family found out and pressured her to come forward against her will.

Sorry, I won't apologize for attacking a rapist apologist.

[Reaper]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

I get that Reaper. But my argument is that anyone who believes a legitimate relationship can occur between a middle aged teacher and his underage student is a sick perverted person. So now do you disagree with my argument?

I was never disputing your argument. That's not what this was about at all.

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

How many rape victims out there haven't come forward because they "didn't say no" or "they didn't know it was wrong" at the time? Or afraid they will be stigmatized because "they were asking for it"? When you dismiss sexual assault and start calling it a "legitimate relationship between people who genuinely love each other" it's a disgusting attitude to have. Especially when the victim has shown the courage to come forward to the police.

This is what you should have posted instead of just trying to tear down the poster. Your initial approach is akin to attempting to pound in finishing nails with a sledgehammer. Sure, the nails are in but you've done little to convince anyone of your ability to use discretion and judgement.

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

Sorry, I won't apologize for attacking a rapist apologist.

No one is demanding an apology. I just think that running around acting like a playground crusader does very little to sway minds and effect change.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by temple5

I do think this will happen alot more as the "sexual liberation" of young women continues. Dont get me wrong, if young boys could, they would also welcome the liberation, its just easier for women. You never used to be thought of as "cool" for dropping trou especially at such a young age.

Actually, it's happening a lot less as society becomes increasingly uncomfortable with large age and power disparities between sexual partners. Like I said earlier, we wouldn't have to go far in most of our family trees to find 30 year old grooms and 17 year old brides.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by Reaper

I was never disputing your argument. That's not what this was about at all.

And again, I get that. But I'm asking you the question. Do you believe someone who says a legitimate relationship can occur between a middle aged teacher and his underage student is a sick perverted person?

Sometimes calling a spade a spade is okay. If Cecil thinks a "legitimate relationship" can occur between a middle-aged man and his 15 year old student, I'm not really looking at changing his attitude, I'm looking at calling him out.

And let's not overlook that this is a case where the victim went to the cops. It's not like she's totally cool with what happened here, it's obvious she's not. Unless you want to follow Cecil's mental gymnastics to try and find a reason she went to the cop for being raped because being raped wasn't good enough reason...

[getbak]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

We wouldn't have to go very far back in any of our family trees to find people married as teenagers.

It was a very disturbing day when I first did the math on my grandparents' ages when they had their first child. An 11 year age difference doesn't seem bad when you're talking about people in their 60s and 70s. It's a lot worse when you wind back the clock.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

We wouldn't have to go very far back in any of our family trees to find people married as teenagers.

We also don't need to go very far back to find people pooping in outhouses, or dying during childbirth.

We have progresses as a society, which I think we can agree with a good thing.