Shooting at mosque in Quebec City; several dead

[Flash Walken]

Ezra Levant is a dangerous, disgusting element in our society.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

"Wait... it WASN'T a muslim? That's clearly impossible. Must be some sort of cover up." Sigh.

That said, did we ever figure out why they thought there were two shooters in ski masks? Was it just confusion on the part of a bunch of people running for their lives? I suppose I should say "have we yet" rather than "did we ever", it's only been a couple of days... part of the problem with the instantaneous news reporting is that it creates both immediate confusion and the expectation that you'll have immediate information to resolve that confusion.

The man accused and later called a witness has already gave his story. Surprised no one seems to have heard his story.

He was attempting CPR on one of the victims, someone walks in with a gun so he assumes it was the shooter and runs. Turns out to be the police. They catch him and assume he was part of it. A little investigation proves he was just a witness.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

The man accused and later called a witness has already gave his story. Surprised no one seems to have heard his story.

He was attempting CPR on one of the victims, someone walks in with a gun so he assumes it was the shooter and runs. Turns out to be the police. They catch him and assume he was part of it. A little investigation proves he was just a witness.

There was still "eye-witness" reports of two shooters in ski masks which I think is what CHL is getting at. And what the conspiracy idiots over in places like Rebel Media are having a hard time letting go.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

That, and the reports of the shooters shouting "allahu akbar", which could either be misreported, or simply misattributed cries of religious people running away from a guy trying to kill them.

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Ezra Levant is a dangerous, disgusting element in our society.

Why is he dangerous?

[burn_this_city]

Or he was a troll who thought it was funny to mock people as he murdered them.

[Flash Walken]

On Sunday night, only a few hours after the horrific mass murder of six Muslim men and the wounding of 19 others praying in a Quebec City mosque, controversial Conservative leadership candidate Kellie Leitch tweeted the following: “Heartbreaking news out of Quebec City tonight. My thoughts and prayers are with the victims.”

Normally this would be seen as a politician’s genuine expression of sympathy. But in Leitch’s case, there were swift angry replies on Twitter: “Don’t you dare,” said one. Another called her a “gross opportunist.” “Not another damn word saying whether or not they have Canadian values,” said a third, blaming Leitch for “fuelling hate.”

Even the satirical online magazine The Beaverton got in on the act, with a piece headlined “Kellie Leitch heartbroken that people would act on hate she’s incited.”

More details are emerging about Alexandre Bissonnette, the young white Quebecois man charged with the murders and attempted murders of the men praying in the mosque.

He was “quiet,” he played chess, he had studied at Laval University, and his social media presence included antagonism toward refugees and feminists, and admiration for the views of far right French politician Marine Le Pen and U.S. President Donald Trump.

There was no mention of Kellie Leitch.

But she was there all the same, in the shadows of this horrific crime, a mainstream Canadian politician who wants to be our next Prime Minister.

Leitch, a doctor and former cabinet minister in Stephen Harper’s government, has called publicly for the in-person screening of immigrants, presumably like the men shot in the mosque, specifically for “non-Canadian values.” She has not explained how this could be accomplished.

She has talked enthusiastically of Trump’s victory and his “exciting message.” She regularly slams her country’s “elites” who want “open borders.”

Leitch issued a second condemnatory statement about the Quebec City shooting, referring to the “people” who were “murdered as they prayed” in a “house of worship.” She never once used the word Muslim or mosque. By not naming their faith, she slighted them.

Words — or lack of them — matter. Her campaign manager Nick Kouvalis, who was also Mayor John Tory’s chief strategist in 2014, has his own problem with words. He publicly used the word “####,” short for ####old, but now part of the hateful new white supremacist and neo-Nazi vocabulary. The word is meant to emasculate people they see as too weak to accept hard right positions.

Kouvalis used it on Twitter to berate a constitutional scholar critical of Leitch. Kouvalis also accused him of “treason.”

Kouvalis has since “unreservedly” apologized, saying he used words he shouldn’t have.

But how is this word even in his head or vocabulary that in a moment of anger he can spew it out? This word connects him directly to a hate-filled group.

We need to talk about this. We need to connect all the dots. Leitch has said, emboldened by surveys, that “70 per cent of Canadians agree” with her proposal to screen for values, which while she never says it out loud, seem at every turn to be referencing Muslims.

https://www.thestar.com/life/2017/02...ch-timson.html

Federal leadership candidate's campaign manager publicly using alt-right language to attack a prominent member of academia.

Don't think for a second what is happening down south can't happen here.

There is a disgusting element in our society that demands any Canadian serious about continuing our legacy as a free and open society need to condemn and excise.

This is outright appalling and I would hope any conservative who has previously commented on the need for Muslims to publicly condemn radical Islam should be first in line to condemn Kellie Leitch and her negligent use of inflammatory language and policies.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

There was still "eye-witness" reports of two shooters in ski masks which I think is what CHL is getting at. And what the conspiracy idiots over in places like Rebel Media are having a hard time letting go.

Almost every single mass shooting like this is first reported as multiple shooters in the first few hours of reporting.

Religious people praying at a mosque being shot at and thinking they're going to die are without a doubt going to be yelling "Allah hu Akbar".

[northcrunk]

Ezra needs to walk away for a while. The Rebel has maybe 2 people that are not bat #### crazy who contribute.

[burn_this_city]

I've already seen plenty of evidence in the last couple of days that the collective guilt thing is a one way street.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Why is he dangerous?

Are you just looking to start a useless argument in this thread? Please don't.

[northcrunk]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

https://www.thestar.com/life/2017/02...ch-timson.html

Federal leadership candidate's campaign manager publicly using alt-right language to attack a prominent member of academia.

Don't think for a second what is happening down south can't happen here.

There is a disgusting element in our society that demands any Canadian serious about continuing our legacy as a free and open society need to condemn and excise.

This is outright appalling and I would hope any conservative who has previously commented on the need for Muslims to publicly condemn radical Islam should be first in line to condemn Kellie Leitch and her negligent use of inflammatory language and policies.

Nobody would even know who Leitch is if the media wasn't so triggered by her. She is nothing. There is no way in hell she is getting elected leader. It's a pipe dream.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

There is a disgusting element in our society that demands any Canadian serious about continuing our legacy as a free and open society need to condemn and excise.

See, and I think it's dangerous to suggest a portion of society should be "excised" for using words. Condemned for their wrongheaded views, yes. But, for example, this is absolutely horrifying:

But how is this word even in his head or vocabulary that in a moment of anger he can spew it out? This word connects him directly to a hate-filled group.

No. #### that writer. Kouvalis, Leitch, anyone, is either right or wrong to hold the views they hold - in this case, wrong. That's all that's necessary. Stop with the secular blasphemy codes and oppose the bad ideas these people are espousing. Trying to stop them from espousing them in the first place by making words verboten just drives these elements underground, behind closed doors, or behind the curtain at the voting booth. Sure, then you don't have to think about them, which might be comforting, but that's worse. They haven't gone away.

I can't remember who said it and it's likely a paraphrase, but the thing that always comes to mind is the quote, "As a jew, I want to know if there are neo nazis in the room, and I'd like them to be perfectly content to tell everyone who they are."

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by calgaryblood

yelling "Allah hu Akbar".

I could also see the shooter yelling it to mock them.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Why is he dangerous?

An alt-right white supremacist just attacked a mosque, and instead of reporting the facts as a journalist should do, he's said that CBC is lying and suggesting that the narrative doesn't add up. He's still listing the witness' name heavily implying something is fishy.

It's no surprise that the comment section is full of conspiracy idiots who are claiming this to be a false flag orchestrated by the government to take away our freedoms and give Muslim more power...or something. And he's absolutely intentionally perpetuating that belief, if only for viewer subscription and crowd funding income sources.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

An alt-right white supremacist just attacked a mosque, and instead of reporting the facts as a journalist should do, he's said that CBC is lying and suggesting that the narrative doesn't add up. He's still listing the witness' name heavily implying something is fishy.

It's no surprise that the comment section is full of conspiracy idiots who are claiming this to be a false flag orchestrated by the government to take away our freedoms and give Muslim more power...or something. And he's absolutely intentionally perpetuating that belief, if only for viewer subscription and crowd funding income sources.

Yeah, so basically, he's like a holocaust denier. In other words, a pitiable moron. I'm also against laws that prohibit denying the holocaust for precisely the same reason. What is there to hide here? Just keep telling the truth. Like I say, I want these people to keep telling us who they are. Trying to shut them up isn't going to change who they are or suddenly give them the impression that they're wrong.

[PsYcNeT]

It's because less than an hour after it happened, Levant registered a whole goddamn website dedicated to it and demonizing Muslims, and he's now upset that he wasted his time and money.

Gotta squeeze blood from that stone.

[Oling_Roachinen]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Yeah, so basically, he's like a holocaust denier. In other words, a pitiable moron. I'm also against laws that prohibit denying the holocaust for precisely the same reason. What is there to hide here? Just keep telling the truth.

Sorry, I was just responding to why he was dangerous. I never advocated for anything.

Like I say, I want these people to keep telling us who they are. Trying to shut them up isn't going to change who they are.

So it's early in the investigation, but based on the interviews with Bissonette's friends, Bissonette wasn't an alt-righter until hearing Marine Le Pen speak.

At one point, Levant isn't just giving these idiots a platform to speak on and reveal themselves...people like him are actively shaping them into "who they are." How you want to tackle that, I have no idea.

[burn_this_city]

Those comments on the Rebel sure make me doubt our collective intelligence.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Oling_Roachinen

Sorry, I was just responding to why he was dangerous. I never advocated for anything.

Ok, totally, fair enough. I was responding to the position you described, if you don't actually endorse it that's fine.

So it's early in the investigation, but based on the interviews with Bissonette's friends, Bissonette wasn't an alt-righter until hearing Marine Le Pen speak.

At one point, Levant isn't just giving these idiots a platform to speak on and reveal themselves...people like him are actively shaping them into "who they are." How you want to tackle that, I have no idea.

It's a difficult question and the only answer I can reasonably come to is that I don't want to. Or, if you like, I want to tackle them by exposing why they're wrong and convincing the vast majority of people that they are. When people act on bad ideas in violent ways, I want the force of law brought to bear on them. But that's about it. The problem with allowing for every possible political position to be expressed is that some people will come up with really bad ones. The alternative, where some class of people (the majority, those currently with political power or whoever you like) decide what positions are acceptable to express and which ones aren't is fairly self-evident, but the other half of it is that it doesn't actually prevent incidents of this sort anyway, ultimately, because if human history has shown anything it's that we either resolve our differences through conversation or we do it through violence.

The real problem is the person committing the violent act, not the view that led them to do so or the person speaking it - the caveat of course being the direct encouragement of violence by the person in question. As far as I know, Marine Le Pen, odious as she seems to be, isn't suggesting to people people that they should hurt immigrants or Muslims. Along the same lines, if someone assassinates Trump, or goes to an alt-right gathering and starts shooting people, I'm not about to suggest censorship of the people who convinced them that Trump and the alt-right are awful.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Those comments on the Rebel any internet site sure make me doubt our collective intelligence.

never read the comments