Edmonton is No Good Episode 4: New Rink, Same Stink

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Robbob

Was there ever confirmation from Treliving that it was Puljujarvi that the Flames were trying to trade up for?

I could be wrong but I recall from interviews with Flames brass (Treliving, Burke, Conroy) they would acknowledge there was the big 3 and then a drop off so I would think yes that is who they were targeting. Also organizationally Puljujarvi was filling a big need. Having said that I feel Tkachuk fills an even bigger need on our team with his style of play even though he is a left shot left wing

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I could be wrong but I recall from interviews with Flames brass (Treliving, Burke, Conroy) they would acknowledge there was the big 3 and then a drop off so I would think yes that is who they were targeting. Also organizationally Puljujarvi was filling a big need. Having said that I feel Tkachuk fills an even bigger need on our team with his style of play even though he is a left shot left wing

That was my general assumption as well with all the big three talk leading up to the draft. I also sometimes wonder if that is the case or just parroting to the media to hide things.

[dash_pinched]

Eberle has been demoted to the third line and rumours are the Oilers are looking to trade him.

Eberle hasn’t scored in 11 games. He has just one in the last 18 and has scored in only three of Edmonton’s last 35 games.

That’s a wicked slump for somebody who’s usually good for 25, but it’s not just the lack of finish that prompted the demotion (Patrick Maroon and Leon Draisaitl will flank McDavid in Boston).

http://edmontonjournal.com/sports/ho...hird-line-duty

[iloveicedhockey]

Buy unreasonably high, sell low.

[McG]

1260 radio in greaserville yesterday spent some time talking about trading eberle and pouliot by the deadline.

did klowe mean that half the nhl would trade their roster for the oilers bit by bit? If so, that man knows a thing or two about prognosticating, in case there is any concern.

I'm predicting the selke for pouliot and a 40/40/80 points season for eberle upon trade. It's the oilers way!

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by dash_pinched

Eberle has been demoted to the third line and rumours are the Oilers are looking to trade him.

Eberle hasn’t scored in 11 games. He has just one in the last 18 and has scored in only three of Edmonton’s last 35 games.

That’s a wicked slump for somebody who’s usually good for 25, but it’s not just the lack of finish that prompted the demotion (Patrick Maroon and Leon Draisaitl will flank McDavid in Boston).

http://edmontonjournal.com/sports/ho...hird-line-duty

Curious to see what his value would be. His only value as an NHL player is as a scorer as without the puck he's useless. In the right situation he could be a 60 point player but in most situations he's going to be the same frustrating player he is for the Oilers.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by McG

1260 radio in greaserville yesterday spent some time talking about trading eberle and pouliot by the deadline.

did klowe mean that half the nhl would trade their roster for the oilers bit by bit? If so, that man knows a thing or two about prognosticating, in case there is any concern.

Pouliot has been terrible this season and has another year left at a $4 million cap hit. Chia Pet would win GM of the year if he could unload that contract to anyone.

[CaptainCrunch]

The Oilers are going to have to disassemble thier roster to fit in McDavids 12 million, Draisaitl's 7 million and Nurse's probably 4 million over the next two years.

They've also got Maroon going to UFA after next year.

So basically they're looking at in the next two years

_______ McDavid __________
Lucic RNH Draisaitl
_______ Caggiula Pulwhatever
Hendricks Letestu Kassian

If they trade Poulliot, Eberle and have lose Maroon, they will need to replace Hendricks which is no big deal and probably give raises to Lestestu (UFA next year) Kassian (RFA This yeaar)

Sekera Larrson
Klefbom Nurse
Davidson _________

Nurse is a RFA next year and due a raise, Davidson is an RFA next year as well.

So lets say that they trade

Eberle $6 million
Poulliot $4 million
Maroon 2 million
Don't resign Hendricks 1.8 and Letestu 1.8

So from the forwards that's a total of about 16.5 million.
But they need to resign McDavid at 12 and Draisaitl at 7.

On the blueline they will have to resign Nurse at probably 3.5 lets say and Davidson at lets say $2.5 so that's $6 million. At the same time Russell comes off at 3.1 and Ferrence comes off at 3.1. so $6.2 back.

At the same time they've got about 4.3 in cap space now which is eaten up by the raises.

So they're at the cap with about 13 signed.

So they're now forced to trade RNH and his 6 million dollar deal because nobody is going to take any of their other high dollar dudes like Lucic or Sekeras for free.

So now they're team looks like this

_______ McDavid Draisaitl
Lucic _________ Kassian
______ Caggiula _______
______ Letestu Pulwatever

Sekeras Larsson
Nurse Davidson
Klefbom and Benning (Who will need a raise as well)

Talbot
__________

and because of raises to guys like Benning and having to bring in players to fill the gap, the money saved by trading RNH for nothing is gone and the Oilers are back in the basement because they couldn't draft and develop players.



For draft picks and prospects( They won't get good ones)


So chances are the Las Vegas Knights will make the playoffs before the Oilers.

[Robbob]

Originally Posted by sureLoss

Maybe it doesn't matter the way the Oilers are seeming ruining him, but if Puljujarvi is still on the NHL roster for the next Oilers game, this season will count as one of the 7 accrued seasons towards UFA.

They could of course avoid it by sending him to the AHL, but it seems they don't want to do that.

I don't see anything on the transactions report so it looks like he will indeed be on the roster. Would be fitting if he was a healthy scratch. If the oilers weren't in a current playoff spot I wonder if they would be taking more flack on needlessly stunting the development of another player.

[dash_pinched]

lol - Close enough

Mark Spector ✔ @SportsnetSpec
The Edmonton Oil Kings, who are owned by the Oilers, just traded for a player named Conner McDonald.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

The Oilers are going to have to disassemble thier roster to fit in McDavids 12 million, Draisaitl's 7 million and Nurse's probably 4 million over the next two years.

They've also got Maroon going to UFA after next year.

So basically they're looking at in the next two years

_______ McDavid __________
Lucic RNH Draisaitl
_______ Caggiula Pulwhatever
Hendricks Letestu Kassian

If they trade Poulliot, Eberle and have lose Maroon, they will need to replace Hendricks which is no big deal and probably give raises to Lestestu (UFA next year) Kassian (RFA This yeaar)

Sekera Larrson
Klefbom Nurse
Davidson _________

Nurse is a RFA next year and due a raise, Davidson is an RFA next year as well.

So lets say that they trade

Eberle $6 million
Poulliot $4 million
Maroon 2 million
Don't resign Hendricks 1.8 and Letestu 1.8

So from the forwards that's a total of about 16.5 million.
But they need to resign McDavid at 12 and Draisaitl at 7.

On the blueline they will have to resign Nurse at probably 3.5 lets say and Davidson at lets say $2.5 so that's $6 million. At the same time Russell comes off at 3.1 and Ferrence comes off at 3.1. so $6.2 back.

At the same time they've got about 4.3 in cap space now which is eaten up by the raises.

So they're at the cap with about 13 signed.

So they're now forced to trade RNH and his 6 million dollar deal because nobody is going to take any of their other high dollar dudes like Lucic or Sekeras for free.

So now they're team looks like this

_______ McDavid Draisaitl
Lucic _________ Kassian
______ Caggiula _______
______ Letestu Pulwatever

Sekeras Larsson
Nurse Davidson
Klefbom and Benning (Who will need a raise as well)

Talbot
__________

and because of raises to guys like Benning and having to bring in players to fill the gap, the money saved by trading RNH for nothing is gone and the Oilers are back in the basement because they couldn't draft and develop players.



For draft picks and prospects( They won't get good ones)


So chances are the Las Vegas Knights will make the playoffs before the Oilers.

IDK - I think you're trying too hard and I couldn't follow most of it.

After all of your hypothetical moves and trades, which exactly are their bad contracts besides possibly Lucic? There's not a team in the league that doesn't want McDavid and his big contract in their lineup. It's certainly a risk but elite players generally find ways of winning.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

IDK - I think you're trying too hard and I couldn't follow most of it.

After all of your hypothetical moves and trades, which exactly are their bad contracts besides possibly Lucic? There's not a team in the league that doesn't want McDavid and his big contract in their lineup. It's certainly a risk but elite players generally find ways of winning.

"Possibly" Lucic? He's $6M until 2023. When he will be 34. He's already declining and not playing with McDavid as was the big plan.

Their present bad contracts - I'd call Eberle's $6M until 2019 pretty bad. I don't like Nuge's $6M until 2021. Sekera is 30 now and they are paying him $5.5 until 2021.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by dash_pinched

lol - Close enough

Mark Spector ✔ @SportsnetSpec
The Edmonton Oil Kings, who are owned by the Oilers, just traded for a player named Conner McDonald.

god I can't wait until Jim Benning drafts this guy

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by dino7c

god I can't wait until Jim Benning drafts this guy

Mark Spector does seem like a Benning type guy.

[dash_pinched]

I see it unfolding as follows - Jim Benning marches up to the NHL entry drafy podium.

Jim Benning; The Vancouver Canucks are pleased and proud to select from Edmonton, Connor McDavid.
Gary Bettman: Uh Jim, that's not right.
Jim Benning: What do you know Gary, you can't even skate - I want McDavid.
Gary Bettman: You're getting McDonald
Jim Benning: Do you mean Lanny?
Gary Bettman: Uh no, can I talk to Linden?
Jim Benning: He's not even here, he's out hiking or biking or building a new workout place.
Gary Bettman: Okee-dokee then.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

"Possibly" Lucic? He's $6M until 2023. When he will be 34. He's already declining and not playing with McDavid as was the big plan.

Their present bad contracts - I'd call Eberle's $6M until 2019 pretty bad. I don't like Nuge's $6M until 2021. Sekera is 30 now and they are paying him $5.5 until 2021.

Eberle'c contract is bad value for the Oilers, but in hCC's analysis he had him gone.
RNH - he might be overpaid but I believe he could be traded for relatively fair value. CC also had him gone.
Lucis - I don't think that contract is crippling but definitely not great value towards the end.

I realize I'm in the wrong thread but if the view is that the Oilers are screwed because they have to pay their good players big money, well I just don't agree with that. No matter how many hypotheticals you run through. They're screwed until they show they can build a good team.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

IDK - I think you're trying too hard and I couldn't follow most of it.

After all of your hypothetical moves and trades, which exactly are their bad contracts besides possibly Lucic? There's not a team in the league that doesn't want McDavid and his big contract in their lineup. It's certainly a risk but elite players generally find ways of winning.

I'd argue that Lucic is going to turn into an absolutely brutal contract for the Oilers as is Sekeras.

Of their current contracts, Eberle is not even close to a 6 million dollar player and no team is just going to take that contract on. RNH is horrific this year for the Oilers and wasn't very good over the last year or so, so his contract is bad as well.

the point is that to afford McDavid and Draisaitl's new deals they're going to have to outright gut their lineup of those contracts while getting very little back in terms of contract, but in the day and age of all the teams being tight to the cap its not going to happen.

The second point is that the Oilers have a terrible pool of prospects there's not much to get excited about which is actually hilarious because of all of the not only number 1 picks but the high picks in the other rounds that they literally pissed away.

As to your point about what was it? Elite players finding a way to win. That's certainly true when your elite players have a somewhat well built team around them. Depth will win you more championships then a one dimensional shallow team that's one banana peel slip away from oblivion.

the league is littered with teams that can't win despite having a Star. At the height of Iginla's career when he was considered one of the best players in the league they couldn't win because they couldn't surround him with talent. Sid really didn't start winning until he had a very strong supporting cast. Ovi really hasn't won anything at all. The Oilers are well on their way to another rebuild if they continue down this path.

If they have to trade RNH and Eberle and others to get their superstar under the contract its just going to create a team where its Conner McDavid and a whole bunch of crap which it is now, except its going to be a whole bunch of cheap crap.

But its ok, its not going to be long before Conner can spread his wings and fly to another city like a great big diving maxipad with wings.

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

IDK - I think you're trying too hard and I couldn't follow most of it.

After all of your hypothetical moves and trades, which exactly are their bad contracts besides possibly Lucic? There's not a team in the league that doesn't want McDavid and his big contract in their lineup. It's certainly a risk but elite players generally find ways of winning.

I'm curious about this part, as I don't see it. Not sure how to even describe this quality, but let's call it "an indomitable will to win". It's one of those intangible things, and maybe having a high level of it makes one elite? But, I don't see it as a guaranteed quality of those with elite talent levels in other parts of the game. McDavid is good, and you're better off with him than a less talented center, but does that somehow mean he's going to will the team to win? I don' think so. You still need to round out a roster with other talent and role players. Your argument stinks of the "just a matter of time", or "not when, but how many" comments the media made.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Eberle'c contract is bad value for the Oilers, but in hCC's analysis he had him gone.
RNH - he might be overpaid but I believe he could be traded for relatively fair value. CC also had him gone.
Lucis - I don't think that contract is crippling but definitely not great value towards the end.

I realize I'm in the wrong thread but if the view is that the Oilers are screwed because they have to pay their good players big money, well I just don't agree with that. No matter how many hypotheticals you run through. They're screwed until they show they can build a good team.

Yeah, I understood you meant after the hypothetical trades - I switched gears without being clear about it. FWIW I agree that teams can possibly succeed despite big money contracts, but they have to make Blackhawk type moves and find kids like Panarin, or steals like Anisimov.

[Robbob]

I think it is even harder in today's game for one player to carry a team single handily. It might be a little easier for a goalie. I think you are seeing it in Edmonton, but the problem is that it is a marathon and eventually it catches up.