The 2016 Toronto Blue Jays Thread

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

If AlpineOracle hadn't become the boy who cried wolf, this is actually one argument that wouldn't be unreasonable. A guy who can't field and can't hit would be a bench player. Unfortunately for the boy who cried wolf, Saunders is hitting a ton, so much so that he is marginally all-star calibre.

Except Saunders is not hitting anymore. People look at that .290 batting average and think he's doing great but that's not what reality is. Saunders was batting around .315-.320 at the start of June and his average has dropped over 20 points in the past month and I don't think he's hit a homerun In his past 15 games ( I could be wrong on that, but I know it's ten for sure).

The Saunders we see now is what he's been for his entire, the Saunders of April and May is the anamoly. I'm a closet Mariners fan and have followed his career. He's an average hitter and a poor fielder ( I think the knee injury made him even worse in the field). He's fooled me before, not this time though. He can't sustain what he is doing in my opinion.

I remember getting chastised in the offseason thread when I said Goins would never replicate that one hot month he had last year over a full season. Peope don't generally just change into high average hitters over night. It happens from time to time, but not very often.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

A guy who could go to the all star game needs to be a bench player? Ok.

He may make it to the all-star because every Jays fan in Canada will vote for him, but he's no all-star performance wise. He started the year off great but his offensive numbers are dwindling. If Bautista is not moved and he keeps it up, Carerra will be out starting LF. We'll see come September. Hopefully I'm wrong and he keeps it up, but if he doesn't, you can't have a guy like that making errors in the outfield while not producing greatly at the plate.

[JiriHrdina]

Who chastised you about Goins? I don't think many people thoughtje could sustain that pace

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

Except Saunders is not hitting anymore. People look at that .290 batting average and think he's doing great but that's not what reality is.

You're incorrect.

Mar/Apr: .311
May: .276
June: .286
July (so far): .300

That's fine hittin' on the season so far.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

Who chastised you about Goins? I don't think many people thoughtje could sustain that pace

I can't remember specifically who put the context of the argument was that Goins had a great month and looked to be turning the corner offensively to which I said Goins is 28 years old and generally players don't go from below average hitters to above average hitters that late their career and Goins showed in the playoffs when he got a regular dose of good pitching that was the case with him.

In my opinion, it's the same thing with Saunders. He had a hot couple of months to start the season but is reverting back to his historical numbers which have been pretty similar over his entire career when he wasnt injured. If that's going to be the case, we can't roll him out there to make bad errors and miss catchable balls because the offence no longer justifies it.

Hopefully he picks the offence back up, but I'd wager once Bautista is back and he's not rebounded that he'll be a bench player and Carrera will have his spot by Spetember.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Parallex

You're incorrect.

Mar/Apr: .311
May: .276
June: .286
July (so far): .300

That's fine hittin' on the season so far.

He's dropped .25 points since his hot start and hasn't hit a homerun in at least ten games. That's exactly what I'm saying. He's played 5 games in July. We'll see where he ends up there

I'm not saying he is a bad player either. I'm saying he needs to have good offence to justify his terrible defence. If he doesn't, Carrera is the better option as he's got more speed, could lead off, and is a decent fielder. Good Problem to have for the Blue Jays either way.

[TheAlpineOracle]

And on another note, Colabelo will be back soon I would imagine. What the hell do we do with this guy? I'm no Smoak fan, so I'd like to see him some major league ABs before a decision is made, but at this point do we just walk away from him? Would suck if another rival picked him up and he picked right up where he left off last year.

[Keselke]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

He's dropped .25 points since his hot start and hasn't hit a homerun in at least ten games. That's exactly what I'm saying. He's played 5 games in July. We'll see where he ends up there

I'm not saying he is a bad player either. I'm saying he needs to have good offence to justify his terrible defence. If he doesn't, Carrera is the better option as he's got more speed, could lead off, and is a decent fielder. Good Problem to have for the Blue Jays either way.

Are you the mayor of Backpedal?

"Except Saunders is not hitting anymore. People look at that .290 batting average and think he's doing great but that's not what reality is."

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Keselke

Are you the mayor of Backpedal?

"Except Saunders is not hitting anymore. People look at that .290 batting average and think he's doing great but that's not what reality is."

Where the hell do you see I'm back peddling? His numbers are creeping down, he's not hitting for power anymore, and by the end of the year his average will be pretty pedestrian and no where near all-star level. Average offence numbers will not be enough to turn a blind eye to his horrendous defence.

I'd be happier than a pig in #### if he kept hitting the ball at the clip he was and be more than happy to admit I was wrong, but that is not going to happen.

Here's Michael Saunders stats over the past 15 games.

Batting average - .213
Homeruns - 0
RBIs - 6.

Those are the facts. You can look them up for yourself on MLB.com

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

Where the hell do you see I'm back peddling? His numbers are creeping down, he's not hitting for power anymore, and by the end of the year his average will be pretty pedestrian and no where near all-star level. Average offence numbers will not be enough to turn a blind eye to his horrendous defence.

I'd be happier than a pig in #### if he kept hitting the ball at the clip he was and be more than happy to admit I was wrong, but that is not going to happen.

Here's Michael Saunders stats over the past 15 games.

Batting average - .213
Homeruns - 0
RBIs - 6.

Those are the facts. You can look them up for yourself on MLB.com

You should know better than to take a small sample size in baseball. He's having a good year so far. That's all there really is to say about that.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

You should know better than to take a small sample size in baseball. He's having a good year so far. That's all there really is to say about that.

He's having a great year, but the small sample size is the start to the season. Over his career he's a pretty borderline offensive player. All I said was it looks like he may be creeping back to his old production and if that's going to be the case going forward, once Bautista returns, the Jays are likely going to need to give Carrera his starting spot because he needs great offensive numbers to overlook his terrible defence because Carrrera brings way more to the table than him when he isn't racking up the hits.

[Jiggy_12]

So the guys having a great season and you keep quiet, and the second he hits a slump you're all over him? sheesh.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

So the guys having a great season and you keep quiet, and the second he hits a slump you're all over him? sheesh.

I've said multiple times the guy has been a pleasant surprise. I had the guy competely wrote off at the start of the year.

I'm not all over him at all. I simply said after he made another horrendous play in the outfield that cost the Jays two runs (and could have been more) that his fielding was terrible and if he's not going to be contributing offensively that the Jays are going to have to sit him down once they get Bauitista back because they can't overlook his defence when he's not bring it offensively.

Carrera is also having a great year and his a better fielder, has speed, and can lead off. All things the Jays lack in their lineup.

[Trojan97]

Is The Alpine Oracle the poster formerly know as moon? So many negative similarities when it comes to the team. Can't help but wonder if it's him.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by Trojan97

Is The Alpine Oracle the poster formerly know as moon? So many negative similarities when it comes to the team. Can't help but wonder if it's him.

I just assumed so. I've never really doubted it but I don't have any concrete evidence.

[Senator Clay Davis]

moon was a Cardinals fan. TAO knows waaay too much about the Jays so I'm gonna say no to that. moon was just good at always trashing other teams and never giving teams that beat his team any credit, but he rarely trashed his own teams except the Lions but that's too easy.

[Machiavelli]

moon's posting style was so distinctive, I could scroll a thread and easily pick out his posts without glancing at usernames.

Almost miss the crazy bastard.

Oh, and Saunders is awesome

[JiriHrdina]

I think the point is your constant negativity. Even when the Jays win you focus on who's not playing well. you've been all over Dickey this season. Last night he had a good start and no surprise silence from you. Same with Tulo.

[TheAlpineOracle]

Originally Posted by JiriHrdina

I think the point is your constant negativity. Even when the Jays win you focus on who's not playing well. you've been all over Dickey this season. Last night he had a good start and no surprise silence from you. Same with Tulo.

Dickey had a great start last night, but that's what's rage inducing about him. He has zero consistency and whether he performs well or not is competely out of control as he is ah the mercy of a pitch that is q crapshoot. When you add that to the fact that he requires his own personal catcher who may be the worst roster player in the Anerican League, I think it becomes pretty clear why I can't stand Dickey.

[howard_the_duck]

Originally Posted by TheAlpineOracle

Where the hell do you see I'm back peddling? His numbers are creeping down, he's not hitting for power anymore, and by the end of the year his average will be pretty pedestrian and no where near all-star level. Average offence numbers will not be enough to turn a blind eye to his horrendous defence.

I'd be happier than a pig in #### if he kept hitting the ball at the clip he was and be more than happy to admit I was wrong, but that is not going to happen.

Here's Michael Saunders stats over the past 15 games.

Batting average - .213
Homeruns - 0
RBIs - 6.

Those are the facts. You can look them up for yourself on MLB.com

Guys go through cold streaks. It happens. He's been arguably the Jays most consistent hitter this year, even though he doesn't have the eye popping RBI total of Donaldson/EE. He doesn't need to hit .320 to warrant an everyday spot in the lineup. Combined with his eye and power that'd make him a top 5 LF in baseball over a full season, which we can all agree he is not.

His power surge is a direct result of hitting in the Rogers Centre and hitter friendly parks of the AL East. Saunders has always been a player that had all the tools, he just needed to maintain his health and be given regular at bats. Now that we're seeing that come together so far, it's nice to see the tools translate to success.