[Signing] Flames sign Brouwer (4 yrs, $4.5mil AAV, NTC)

[gargamel]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

This article is the poster child for why you don't evaluate a player based on a hero chart. Absolutely brutal.

Brouwer is a warrior and stands up for his team-mates. I have never seen a chart quantify or demonstrate qualities like that before.

Sounds like someone isn't familiar with the GRIT Index.

[Enoch Root]

Also, stats don't get that he has size and plays with an edge - they don't get that the Flames NEED this.

Stats don't capture that he is a RHS that can score goals - they don't get that the Flames need this.

And of course, they don't capture leadership, experience, being good in the room, or any of those other !gasp! intangibles.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by gargamel

Sounds like someone isn't familiar with the GRIT Index.

Out of thanks, but well played!

[CliffFletcher]

Question for the people complaining about the cost of Brouwer:

Do you think there were better UFA signings available out there? Or would you rather the Flames rebuild internally and hope a guy like Poirier can step in and be a difference-maker?

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

He's not going to be very effective in year one. If he can't produce on a line with Ovechkin and Backstrom then he won't be the magical missing RW for the Flames either. And at 4.5 million to boot we just flushed a load of cap space to become "heavy" whatever the hell that means.

Outdated tunnel vision crap.

I would not worry, Lucic could not produce with Kopitar or Krejci and Edmonton signed him.

[timbit]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

This article is the poster child for why you don't evaluate a player based on a hero chart. Absolutely brutal.

Brouwer is a warrior and stands up for his team-mates. I have never seen a chart quantify or demonstrate qualities like that before.

Also, all of these HERO charts keep showing him as having 4th line scoring. What's with that? He has averaged 20 G per year for the last 7 years. Only 51 players have more goals than him over that period. And Lucic was NOT one of them.

But 7 years is a long time. Let's look at the last 5 to bring more players into the conversation.

In the last 5 years, 45 players have more goals than Brouwer. 45. Taylor Hall has 9 more goals over that period.

A few of the names behind him: Hudler, Cammalleri, Oshie, Okposo, Perron and Lucic.

And many, many others.

I couldn't give a rat's ass what the advanced stats say about him. Because watching him play, I see a guy I want on my team.

Calling him a 4th liner is moronic. And the stats simply don't capture what he is.

Well done.

Sadly, some people don't want to be confused with the facts and/ or needs of the flames.

[IgiTang]

I posted this in the Lucic thread but i think it is equally applicable to this thread.
"
I dont think its expecting Lucic's game to fall off as much as it is that Lucic has many holes in his game and his skill set is very Oiler'esque.

By that I mean, hes lazy on the backcheck, He is not very good in his own end, isnt very good at covering passing lanes.

These are all areas that the Oilers really need to address, not only from their D, but from their forwards as well.

The big difference between Brouwer and Lucic is, Brouwer is a 200ft player. Plays on both PK and PP.

Lucic is undoubtedly better on the cycle. But both players drive the net and know how to use their big frame.

Brouwer is quite a bit faster than Lucic and plays a bit more of a determined game. I think Lucic gives up on plays in the neutral zone where Brouwer is known to be very good in the neutral zone as well.

So for $1.5 mil more for 3 seasons more, for what an average of 7 pts more a season?

I think Brouwer is not necessarily the better player, but more the player that would most benefit the Flames and Oilers and be less of a burden financially."

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

These stat only arguments are getting real old. No replacement for watching Brouwer and making up your own mind on how he plays. It's called scouting, it's the primary tool NHL teams use to evaluate players. Stat arguments pale in comparison to the value of actually watching players.

HERO charts are a cheap and weak replacement for scouting. Watching players is still by far the best and most important way to evaluate them.

Not just that but it's selective stats. Picking these stupid "advanced" stats and completely ignoring more traditional stats. Compare Brouwer to other RW in the league and the numbers make him look like a low end 1st liner.

[Alberta_Beef]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

He's not going to be very effective in year one. If he can't produce on a line with Ovechkin and Backstrom then he won't be the magical missing RW for the Flames either. And at 4.5 million to boot we just flushed a load of cap space to become "heavy" whatever the hell that means.

Outdated tunnel vision crap.

What a ridiculous post. You do know that some players fit together better than other right? What he did with Ovechkin and Backstrom means absolutely squat in how he will produce with Gaudreau and Monahan.

You cry about tunnel vision and then post the most narrow minded crap on here.

[FlameZilla]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Question for the people complaining about the cost of Brouwer:

Do you think there were better UFA signings available out there? Or would you rather the Flames rebuild internally and hope a guy like Poirier can step in and be a difference-maker?

I think he was the best option available who would fit into our cap structure. Okposo is arguably the best UFA fit for us but the money would be too tight.

That being said, I don't think anyone advocates being too reliant on UFA signings to improve the team. This isn't Treliving's strong suit, but I don't feel nearly as disappointed by his signings this year as I was by Raymond/Engelland-gate a couple of years ago.

To me, Brouwer is a stop-gap on the 1st line until a RW worthy of Johnny/Mony presents himself. The beauty of the contract is that the money works for him as a 2nd line RWer too. He scores a great deal on the PP, kills penalties and works his socks off. He's not a flashy guy, but he is the definition of 'complete player'. Worth every penny of $4.5m, though that ain't cheap, I'll admit.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Alberta_Beef

What a ridiculous post. You do know that some players fit together better than other right? What he did with Ovechkin and Backstrom means absolutely squat in how he will produce with Gaudreau and Monahan.

You cry about tunnel vision and then post the most narrow minded crap on here.

More to the point, he was a 20 goal scorer for the Hawks and the Caps. 18 last year with the Blues. If he gets 20 for us this year, I'm happy.

[IgiTang]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

More to the point, he was a 20 goal scorer for the Hawks and the Caps. 18 last year with the Blues. If he gets 20 for us this year, I'm happy.

If he plays with JG and Monny, I dont see why he wont have a career year and not break 20 goals easily.

[OzSome]

I like this signing, I just wish the salary is a bit lower but that usually happen on Free Agent Frenzy day. Anyways, Brouwer's character as an NHL player is one of the top. He was well liked while playing for Chicago, Washington and St. Louis. I definitely think he can guide the young guys like Monahan, Gaudreau, Tkachuk and Bennett. I think he'll end up as a 1st or 2nd line RW.

[Dr. Doom]

Horrendous contract for the term it should have been much lower dollars

[JJolg]

Originally Posted by Dr. Doom

Horrendous contract for the term it should have been much lower dollars

You seem to struggle with concept of free agency... You are not the only team trying to sign players. How many players are signing 4 year terms and taking LESS money in free agency? If you want lower dollars you have to sign a longer deal and Treliving made it clear that is not something he wanted.

[Lil Pedro]

Originally Posted by Dr. Doom

Horrendous contract for the term it should have been much lower dollars

You would make a great GM

Jesus

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

More to the point, he was a 20 goal scorer for the Hawks and the Caps. 18 last year with the Blues. If he gets 20 for us this year, I'm happy.

Brouwer had 19 goals in 47 games during the lockout season for Washington. In three of his four years with the Capitals he finished 2nd only to Ovechkin in goals.

Not producing with Ovechkin and Backstrom might be a signature worthy quote.

[JJolg]

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Brouwer had 19 goals in 47 games during the lockout season for Washington. In three of his four years with the Capitals he finished 2nd only to Ovechkin in goals.

Not producing with Ovechkin and Backstrom might be a signature worthy quote.

He hardly played with those guys even strength, if he did it was on the powerplay. He was with Kuzy and Johansson but if that is going to be their argument i do believe Ovie had more goals and points playing with him so i guess he makes players around him better lol...

[Hemi-Cuda]

I see this as a more reliable, harder to play against Colborne deal. I like it

[Lil Pedro]

We needed a right handed shooting forward who goes to the net, is a leader and has some playoff experience. He's good in the dirty areas who will make space for Sean and Johnny. Great signing all around. He will do well on the first line