Teachers work "really hard'.

[Rhettzky]

For my kids Friday is only 20 minutes shorter than a typical day.

[Harry Lime]

If I find myself with a little extra time, I think that I might wander over to troll the oil and gas job loss thread with claims that everyone was overcompensated for years based on a shallow workload and theoretical degrees nearly useless when confronted with a real world working environment.

I think that will go well.

[Shazam]

Gee. Man, $80K isn't a ton of money these days. Inflation takes its toll.

My oldest's current teacher is fantastic. Worth every penny. She wrote up an IPP for my daughter and even went to a teaching gifted children conference a few months back. That's farking dedication. I do know that some parents don't like my younger daughter's teacher. They say she is too strict. I think it's farking great. She is a bit of a hardass. But man, my youngest is the most manipulative kid I've ever met. She needs the focus.

Are there truly bad teachers? I think of my time in the CBE, and I think every single teacher I had knew their material. I think they taught as best they could given the knowledge known at the time about various teaching methods (that is, very little). Did I have "a-hole" teachers? #### if I my 15 year old pimple ass could've made a proper judgement call on that.

I think there is such a thing as a poor teacher-student fit. It is your responsibility as a parent to communicate with your stinky kid and find out if there is a conflict and act promptly. Yeah, there's poorly run schools, so your action might be as drastic as moving schools.

In an organization as large as the CBE, the bell curve happens. It must happen. Even Google, with all their ridiculous employee testing and screening, couldn't flatten the curve (I think the employees on the left side of the curve now all work on Google Mail).

[Regorium]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

If I find myself with a little extra time, I think that I might wander over to troll the oil and gas job loss thread with claims that everyone was overcompensated for years based on a shallow workload and theoretical degrees nearly useless when confronted with a real world working environment.

I think that will go well.

How much of a raise do teachers deserve? In your opinion, what is fair compensation for a teacher and how far away from that are we?

And to be fair, o&g is severely over compensated. But that's why there are salary reductions and layoffs.

[Harry Lime]

Early in the thread a couple of teachers wrote that they are not looking for higher compensation, but a decrease in class size.

It is the union raisin the issue of compensation, and in my opinion that is a losing tactic for everyone, unless it is a smokescreen to make the class size issue more palatable to the government.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

If I find myself with a little extra time, I think that I might wander over to troll the oil and gas job loss thread with claims that everyone was overcompensated for years based on a shallow workload and theoretical degrees nearly useless when confronted with a real world working environment.

I think that will go well.

Don't worry it happens regularly in that thread.

One issue is that the market doesn't set the rate for teachers as it does for other industries. I think most outside the teaching industry would be agreeable to the market setting a teachers Salary.

[Harry Lime]

That way we can make sure that the rich kids receive a higher quality education than those unclean troglodytes who won't be allowed to prosper in life anyway. So why give them false hope?

[chubeyr1]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

Early in the thread a couple of teachers wrote that they are not looking for higher compensation, but a decrease in class size.

It is the union raisin the issue of compensation, and in my opinion that is a losing tactic for everyone, unless it is a smokescreen to make the class size issue more palatable to the government.

Trust me, smaller class sizes is not a cave in by the union. A reduction in class size means an increase in teachers. Massive bill for the government. Tax payers.

Highest paid teachers in the country.

Teachers union is ignoring the economy. Well they are not by not asking for raises, asking for more teachers is ignoring the economic climate.

Hey I don't blame them. We should be talking about wage rollbacks, and cuts. They took a good road.

I mean seriously does the economy crashing make for smaller class sizes? People leaving the province tend to take their kids with them. As such smaller class sizes. Already happening.

When a teacher does something extra at their job they are a god. I do that at work and get ignored. Saved the company $30000, still get ignored. Don't get me wrong, bosses love me, no reward for the extra work.

A teacher puts in extra work and they should be praised. Its different you say?

I ran a business years ago making contact lenses. Custom lenses. Walmart does not do this. The most difficult patients. As in they are pretty much blind.

Lost my shirt in the industry because I gave a damn. Make a pair of lenses and charge $60. Then spend two weeks working one on one with the patients, blow through all profit in a day. On my dime.

I made blind people see for the first time. So many times I can not count.
I got killed in the industry.

Teachers bitch though. We need more, we need more.

Don't get me wrong I have known some amazing teachers. 1 in 10. Those one in ten I would love to fund. The rest of them. Dead weight and lucky to have jobs.

So many teachers teach because they can not succeed in industry. Yet we are paying these people who cant make a living doing what they were trained for to teach our kids. Then we compensate them more than industry standards.

I apologize to the one in ten teacher. I applaud your efforts. The other 9 out of 10 need a wake up call. No worries though, union job. You still have a job and its not based off performance.

I am seriously thinking of taking a teaching gig. It is so awful, the financial rewards and security is amazing.

[Shazam]

^ Weird that your business failed and teachers somehow were involved.

Man you don't want to know how much profit I make at my business. I think teacher salaries are cute.

[Swarly]

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

Not sure if she made it up, or things have changed in the last 13 years, but that isn't the case. Seminars on teaching instruction, collaboration on teaching plans, etc. They put in a full day and it certainly isn't a day off for them.

I think Slava's comment is telling on this discussion. Are people pissed because we think teachers are overpaid/over vacationed, or is it aggravation because they aren't available 5 days a week for pseudo- daycare? These are two very separate issues.

then things have certainly changed. my friend is a teacher, her last PD day or whatever had a seminar from like 9-11 then was meeting the other teachers at a bar, I met them there at noon for lunch and stayed all afternoon.

[Major Major]

Originally Posted by chubeyr1

I am seriously thinking of taking a teaching gig. It is so awful, the financial rewards and security is amazing.

Please god don't

[driveway]

Actually I'd really like to see chubeyr1 go into teaching and watch their reaction to being treated 'like a god' for doing 'something extra'.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

If I find myself with a little extra time, I think that I might wander over to troll the oil and gas job loss thread with claims that everyone was overcompensated for years based on a shallow workload and theoretical degrees nearly useless when confronted with a real world working environment.

I think that will go well.

It is funny that the arguments on this forum about the minimum wage increases didn't generate the same kind of resentment and hurt feelings. I suppose there aren't a lot of members of CP who work (or whose spouse works) at Dairy Queen or Winners.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by GGG

Don't worry it happens regularly in that thread.

One issue is that the market doesn't set the rate for teachers as it does for other industries. I think most outside the teaching industry would be agreeable to the market setting a teachers Salary.

That's the crux of the issue. Since the market doesn't set the salary of teachers, and since they're paid by the public, you're going to get people speculating about whether compensation is in alignment with value. It's pretty much the union people have issue with, not teachers by and large.

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Originally Posted by Slava

Hold on though, it's not "pseudo-daycare". I find it weird that we expect such short learning times for our kids. If the kids were in school more hours they could take a more varied approach to the curriculum. More hands-on activity, more doing and less just sitting there listening in general. For some reason though it's become a rarity that kids attend the full 4.5 days a week (and by full I mean from 8:30-3:15 with a break for lunch and recess). Is there evidence that we are teaching students so effective that they need less class time? That seems to be at odds with intuition.

I don't know what the optimal time frame for the students, but my point is that it could be less than the usual workforce, 5 day a week norm. If that is true, I think the issue for many is not whether teachers are underpaid/overworked, but that now a parent my incur costs for daycare. To me, that is a very separate issue where the teachers are taking the blame.

[sun]

Has DataDoxy weighed in on this debate yet?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

If I find myself with a little extra time, I think that I might wander over to troll the oil and gas job loss thread with claims that everyone was overcompensated for years based on a shallow workload and theoretical degrees nearly useless when confronted with a real world working environment.

I think that will go well.

Do I need to point out the irony of gloating and lording your Government Guaranteed, Union Protected job that is completely insulated from the realities of the real world over people who are currently undergoing the consequences of a market collapse?

Remember, much like our current Government is completely blameless in our current predicament theres nothing Oil Companies could have done about the collapse in Oil prices either.

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by Locke

Do I need to point out the irony of gloating and lording your Government Guaranteed, Union Protected job that is completely insulated from the realities of the real world over people who are currently undergoing the consequences of a market collapse?

Remember, much like our current Government is completely blameless in our current predicament theres nothing Oil Companies could have done about the collapse in Oil prices either.

Are you saying that the Private sector never, ever, ever lords their jobs over Public sector workers?

[peter12]

So when people say "let the market decide," what they really mean is province-wide voucher system?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

Are you saying that the Private sector never, ever, ever lords their jobs over Public sector workers?

Even if it were to devolve into this level childishness at least at that point those public sector workers have jobs.