Right cause the inclusion of the 15th overall had nothing to do with that trade. Look at my stats above. Sure 2nd have value, but to say a 2nd rounder would be the swing decider in trading Gio
Deciding a pick will be 60th and concluding with certainty how it would effect one hypothetical trade seems extremely futile to me.
Regardless of that, a 2nd round pick holds a lot of value, as seen by what we did last year in trades as well as who we picked in the 50-60 range.
Deciding a pick will be 60th and concluding with certainty how it would effect one hypothetical trade seems extremely futile to me.
Regardless of that, a 2nd round pick holds a lot of value, as seen by what we did last year in trades as well as who we picked in the 50-60 range.
We also need to remember that it's just as likely 4 years from now that many could condemn the two guys the Flames picked with those picks and lament not trading them when their value was high.
This is where the depth of the draft class means everything to me. Last year a pick in the second round was really worth something...similar to 2003. In other years like 2014, I don't think the value was even close given that draft class.
There's that extra variable attempting to appraise what a 2nd round pick is or isn't worth.
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Doubt the Flames move their 1st round pick this year. They moved last year's for Hamilton. You don't want to get into a streak of no 1st rounders unless you're directly in your window of contention.
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Regardless of that, a 2nd round pick holds a lot of value, as seen by what we did last year in trades as well as who we picked in the 50-60 range.
We received a 2nd AND 3rd for a player who couldn't make the playoff roster of the team he was traded for.
We traded our 2nds, and have ZERO idea how those players will turn out. Evidence over the past 10 years shows there is a 30-40 % chance either plays 50 games in the NHL.
The 60th overall we received we also have ZERO idea how they will turn out. Guess what, most of these 'amazing' prospects we have won't ever sniff the NHL.
You get lucky with guys as Brodie and Johnny. It happens 1/100 times. But stats show there is very little difference after the 1st round between 2nd and 3rd and 4th round picks. It's basically a giant guessing game.
All I am saying is it is hilarious that the swing piece of a trade that would involved Gio is a 2nd round pick from Tampa. Last year 20 2nd rounders were swapped!
They are traded fodder! It's 1 extra lottery ticket in the prospect lottery that realistically occurs after the 1st round
Doubt the Flames move their 1st round pick this year. They moved last year's for Hamilton. You don't want to get into a streak of no 1st rounders unless you're directly in your window of contention.
Why not? Drouin is still potential and it's not likely that Calgary will get a top 5 pick this year. Plus, I'm sure we will flip either Hudler, Russell, or both at trade deadline for more picks. We are always able to gain draft picks.
This year looks like a decently deep draft. In deep drafts, good players slide to the second round. Webber is a perfect example of that. And if you have 1/100 chance of the pick being good, it's better than 0/100... Our scouting team seems to be good and has recently doing a good job so I wouldn't take chances away from them, I'd try to give them more.
And if other teams trade away picks for bad players, doesn't mean it's good. Don't base what we should do on mistakes of other teams.
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Our scouting team seems to be good and has recently doing a good job so I wouldn't take chances away from them, I'd try to give them more.
Based on what? Which recently drafted player has made the team?
We have 2 players drafted 2012-2014 on this team : Bennett and Monahan - Both top picks/no brainers
Since 2010 we have 5 : Monahan, Bennet, Ferland, Grandlund, and Gaudreau
So we made our two high 1sts, got two 3rd/4th liners, and got lucky/smart on a player people thought was too small.
Are we basing good drafting on kids we hope will make the team one day? Every fan base thinks their newest picks are great.
We received a 2nd AND 3rd for a player who couldn't make the playoff roster of the team he was traded for.
We traded our 2nds, and have ZERO idea how those players will turn out. Evidence over the past 10 years shows there is a 30-40 % chance either plays 50 games in the NHL.
The 60th overall we received we also have ZERO idea how they will turn out. Guess what, most of these 'amazing' prospects we have won't ever sniff the NHL.
You get lucky with guys as Brodie and Johnny. It happens 1/100 times. But stats show there is very little difference after the 1st round between 2nd and 3rd and 4th round picks. It's basically a giant guessing game.
All I am saying is it is hilarious that the swing piece of a trade that would involved Gio is a 2nd round pick from Tampa. Last year 20 2nd rounders were swapped!
They are traded fodder! It's 1 extra lottery ticket in the prospect lottery that realistically occurs after the 1st round
Quote:
Originally Posted by genetic_phreek
Why not? Drouin is still potential and it's not likely that Calgary will get a top 5 pick this year. Plus, I'm sure we will flip either Hudler, Russell, or both at trade deadline for more picks. We are always able to gain draft picks.
All I am saying is it is hilarious that the swing piece of a trade that would involved Gio is a 2nd round pick from Tampa. Last year 20 2nd rounders were swapped!
Which is getting more and more bizarre the more you go on seemingly outraged by it. It was one person's opinion, and something completely hypothetical. Seems strange to have such an issue with it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason14h
They are traded fodder! It's 1 extra lottery ticket in the prospect lottery that realistically occurs after the 1st round
The fact they are trade chips and allowed us in part to land a Dougie Hamilton is precisely why they hold value.
Doubt the Flames move their 1st round pick this year. They moved last year's for Hamilton. You don't want to get into a streak of no 1st rounders unless you're directly in your window of contention.
When you move your first for a 22 year old and then a 20 year old it is not that dire. These are players that are known commodities that are still very young with 15 years left in their careers.
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I'm just responding to the strange position that was circulating earlier in this thread that trading Kylington for Drouin was somehow a bad idea.
Actually, Kyllington was being discussed in the context of - if we included one of the defense prospects in a package, it shouldn't be Kyllington.
Maybe one or two posters said they wouldn't trade him straight up, but let's not paint the whole thread on that because it wasn't what the conversation was about.
I agree that the risk of trading the 1st is too great this year.
If Drouin were a 6'2" RW, I'd say send the first and any prospect(s) they want.
But for another smallish LW, I think it has to be on Calgary's terms.
It's not like Drouin is super small. He's still 5'11 and plays with an edge. Plus if we get rid of Hudler that pretty much puts us at a similar state so I don't see the big deal.
Doubt the Flames move their 1st round pick this year. They moved last year's for Hamilton. You don't want to get into a streak of no 1st rounders unless you're directly in your window of contention.
Yeah, you don't want to get in the habit of trading first round picks for young and established franchise type players..
