[PGT] Canucks 5 @ Flames 1

[AltaGuy]

I think we miss Brodie a lot. Having his speed and outlet ability really helps Gio. Hamilton will be great, but he isn't as good a partner for Gio.

As someone who wishes we had gone with a faster, smaller roster again (Granlund, Byron), will be interesting to see the development of our heavier roster and how they progress. I know it's what Treliving wants, and where he believes we have to improve for the possession to improve, but it will take an adjustment to play with more time cycling and in the corners.

We did not have the crisp, short passes in our game that we had to start last season. Will be super interesting to see how we develop.

[socalwingfan]

The thing that bugs me about Hiller is how disinterested and mopey he looks on the bench. It's probably just his personality but he looks miserable when he is not playing and not a good teammate. Just an observation, not knowing the inner workings, he could be a great teammate for all I know

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

Actually Hiller cheats all the time on posts. He was burned a few times last year. Flames coaching staff might have fixed that with him, but I think Hiller probably only saves one of those goals - the first.

But that could have changed the game. Who knows?

It is a pointless exercise to imagine which of those goals Hiller is likely to stop. But for those who are going to play it, you need to be honest about Ramo's saves that Hiller would also not have stopped. I'm not at all confident that Hiller stops the Sedins' first chance where Ramo made a terrific blocker save. How would an earlier goal have changed the complexion of the game?

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Badgers Nose

...It would be better to have a kid as #1 and #2. Invest in the future. Flames fans are patient and will back kids, the last two years proves it.

I think that this is a terrible idea.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

Honestly, the difference between Ramo and Hiller is razor thin. I don't see how you can so emphatically project one as a clear choice ahead of the other. Both will have frequent strong outings, and both have their warts, which is why neither one is a bona fide starting NHL goaltender. I am not the least bit convinced that Hiller does a thing to help the team win that game last night.

Show me some sort of tangible evidence to back up that statement. Bring up the career stats, games played, wins/losses, of both goaltenders including last season and explain to me how you derived that conclusion that the difference between the two is "razor thin" and please don't bring up that "eye test" nonsense to support your view. It's really not as close as many seem to believe as Hiller is easily the better goaltender and he's proven that over his career as well as last season.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by AltaGuy

I think we miss Brodie a lot. Having his speed and outlet ability really helps Gio. Hamilton will be great, but he isn't as good a partner for Gio.

As someone who wishes we had gone with a faster, smaller roster again (Granlund, Byron), will be interesting to see the development of our heavier roster and how they progress. I know it's what Treliving wants, and where he believes we have to improve for the possession to improve, but it will take an adjustment to play with more time cycling and in the corners.

We did not have the crisp, short passes in our game that we had to start last season. Will be super interesting to see how we develop.

True enough, but to be fair, I thought the Flames looked like a lottery team in last season's home opener as well. I recall "crsip, short passes" were few and far between in that game.

It is going to take four or five games to get a read on the team. Last night was typical: the Canucks were typically amazing in Game 1 while the Flames were typically awful. I thought that Frolik had a pretty good game, but Hamilton looked lost. The defense is still in the process of making adjustments with the new additions and sans Brodie. Let's just hope the adjustment period does not derail the season.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by socalwingfan

The thing that bugs me about Hiller is how disinterested and mopey he looks on the bench. It's probably just his personality but he looks miserable when he is not playing and not a good teammate. Just an observation, not knowing the inner workings, he could be a great teammate for all I know

This is a really trivial complaint. Hiller is, by all accounts, a good teammate.

[sa226]

Ah the curse of expectations.

It's one game. Albeit one gawd awful game, but one game nonetheless. Still a very young team coming off a Cinderella season, playing in front of the home town fans. They're still learning how to react. It's no real surprise that Frolik, a guy who's been around the block a few times and known as a consumate pro was the best Flame last night.

They'll figure it out, they're too good not to, they had better hurry up though.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Show me some sort of tangible evidence to back up that statement. Bring up the career stats, games played, wins/losses, of both goaltenders including last season and explain to me how you derived that conclusion that the difference between the two is "razor thin" and please don't bring up that "eye test" nonsense to support your view. It's really not as close as many seem to believe as Hiller is easily the better goaltender and he's proven that over his career as well as last season.

God, I am not going to play this stupid game with you. I have already made my case in the tandem thread and you are more than welcome to respond. There was a 0.006 difference in Hiller's and Ramo's save percentages from last season. That means that for every 1000 shots faced, Hiller made six more saves than Ramo. That amounts to a fairly negligible difference. I have conceded in the other thread that Hiller is statistically slightly better, but not enough so that he is in any way, shape, or form a clear choice to be the starting goalie for this team.

I like the way Hartley handled it last season: win and you are in. This is precisely how it ought to work when neither goalie is good enough—when the difference between the two is razor thin—to play +60 games.

[AcGold]

So career Ramo is

43-46-17 .903 SV% 2.93 GAA

Hiller
188-129-39 .917 SV% 2.49 GAA

Indicating Hiller has better stats overall in win %, SV% and GAA. Whether that's because he was on a stacked Anaheim is debatable but I'm thinking Hiller is better actually. Hiller has lapses but is more consistently good whereas Ramo doesn't have lapses but is overall more average. Some of those shots Hiller may have stopped.

The issue with Hiller is those weak shots he lets in while he should be guarding the post are so memorable they make him seem worse than he is.

[hockey.modern]

Originally Posted by socalwingfan

The thing that bugs me about Hiller is how disinterested and mopey he looks on the bench. It's probably just his personality but he looks miserable when he is not playing and not a good teammate. Just an observation, not knowing the inner workings, he could be a great teammate for all I know

I've heard he's a really good guy and leader in the room.

[FiveSeven]

It was only one game, the first game.. I don't think anyone should be saying certain pairings or lineups aren't going to work or should be changed. Everyone on the team and Hartley said they didn't stick to the system and everyone was trying to do to much. On top of that the chemistry has to be established or re-established among some. If we have a similar result vs the same team with two days practice in between then maybe let's have these talks.

[jg13]

Sven Baertschi -1 and 0 points in a 5-1 win ahahahahahaha

[Armchair Quarterback]

Not freaking out about the loss, but it looks like some of last year's bad habits have not been taken care of yet. The worst habit is our crappy second period play. Something has to be done about it. That goal with 5 seconds left took the air out of the whole team and set the pace for the third period.

Vancouver is not a bad team. As Flames fans we hate them but IMO the Flames did not respect their ability to play good hockey, and as a result we got embarrassed.

[heep223]

I disagree. Vancouver is a bad team.

[Armchair Quarterback]

Originally Posted by heep223

I disagree. Vancouver is a bad team.

Good enough to make the playoffs last year, and to beat us 5-1 in the opener.

[neo45]

I don't think Ramo was terrible but I also think you have a hard time starting a guy who let in 5 goals when there are two other guys waiting to play.


We let up pressure on their weak defense and they stopped coughing up pucks

[GreenLantern]

Originally Posted by skudr248

Best thing I saw tonight was couple Canuck fan's getting their ass beat in section 206. Aside from that, terrible game.

And this is the most embarrassing thing I saw tonight. Like seriously, how could you think that is OK?

[robaur]

That game was more the Sedins being in mid-season form more than anything. They always get a jump on the league in the beginning of the season because they just have such good chemistry playing together.

Once the Sedins stop putting up 6 points a night, that Canucks team is awful and it will show over the course of the season. They're not making the playoffs.

On the Flames end:

- Giordano looked brutal last night. One of his worst games I have seen in a while but thats his first NHL game since February.

- Hamilton doesn't look comfortable, and I don't think that is going to come until December/January. He needs to play games.

- We need TJ Brodie back. With the previous 2 points, we need Brodie back more than anything to be a steady force.

- Ramo needs to go. He made some great saves last night, but he looks so shaky in net. His positioning is awful. His blocker save on Sedin that everyone keeps praising looks more like a fluke than anything else. He made Hansen's shot look like it came from Ovechkin. That brutal 3-1 goal by a lazy wrist shot from Hamhuis was a backbreaker. His rebound control is awful. He flops around the net all night like a fish out of water. Hiller is a MUCH MORE steady goalie in the NHL.

- Derek Engelland is an awful defenseman. Can't do anything well at all. Turns the puck over all night. Makes stupid passes. Can't break the cycle in his own zone. Can't clear the puck. He was outplayed by Kulak in his 1st NHL game.

- Mikael Backlund was utterly garbage tonight. It's gotten to the point where he needs to step his game up, otherwise there's no need for him on the team. He was that awful last night. He was an anchor to Frolik.

- As much as I love Lance Bouma, he doesn't have a spot on the 2nd Line. He doesn't have enough skill to work the cycle game with Frolik.

- Bennett struggled last night and was ineffective most of the game as a direct result of the ineffectiveness that is Josh Jooris. Same problem that Frolik as with Bouma. Josh Jooris is a great "skate in a line" player, but doesn't have enough skill to play with Bennett. Plus, I just don't think Bennett is ready to be a Centre in the NHL if the Flames want any kind of respectable scoring from him.

- Hudler was our best forward last night. Frolik was just great to watch. So much effort.

Gaudreau-Monahan-Hudler
Bennett-Backlund-Frolik
Bouma-Jooris-Ferland
Bollig-Stajan-Jones

That should be our lineup in Vancouver on Saturday night.

[CroFlames]

Jesus robaur. Negative Nancy much?

Gio wasn't brutal. Engelland isn't awful. Backlund wasn't garbage.

They all had a bad game last night, but Gio had some jump in his step at times. Backlund didn't really screw up much, but didn't do much either.

The whole team wasn't in the game, and the Canucks team was fired up. Engelland played with Kulak against a team that was very determined. None of our D was especially good, so to single out Engelland is not correct.