Federal Election Called for Oct 19, 2015

[FlamesAddiction]

Debate tonight. I probably won't be able to watch it, but I look forward to a synopsis:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/cana...bate-1.3180842

Hopefully Trudeau shows up with pants on.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Certainly Clay, a vocal subset of voters who were going to criticize Harper anyway are criticizing Harper. But that isn't the group he is targeting.

Of course the irony in all of this is that the only ones who have actually brought up taxation of Netflix are the Conservatives. Its weird though because why shouldn't Netflix be paying the same levies as Canadian broadcasters? Why should they get a free ride here? There is actually a very real issue beneath all of this stupidty; taxation of e-commerce in general is something that has to be ironed out.

[burn_this_city]

Canada ran into the typical democrat protectionist nonsense in the US. The soft touch or bullying would have had the same results. This is a perception issue more than a legitimate evidence based crisis. By keeping KXL on the sidelines the Administration succeeded in keeping our oil landlocked and sold at a discount, a net benefit to the American consumer. They were also able to pander to the environmental side of their base, which has likely sold out to the Saudis or other exporters who want to keep Canadian oil from displacing their production.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

Certainly Clay, a vocal subset of voters who were going to criticize Harper anyway are criticizing Harper. But that isn't the group he is targeting.

Well if he was targeting CPC supporters who were going to vote for him anyways, success. If he was going after normal Canadians, the vast majority of the response from them has either been mockery or puzzlement that this is even an issue. This likely nets zero votes to the CPC and more than likely costs them a few votes from people puzzled that this is an issue being taken seriously given the array of other issues Canada currently faces. It's somewhere on the list around 765 in terms of issues Canadians care about.

[Tron_fdc]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Baseless. The "world" or other wealthy countries (including China) have done much more than Harper except for Australia. And the U.S. just regulated its carbon emissions from coal plants two days ago so... your point doesn't stand?

Coal power plants are being retired at the moment due to the drop in natural gas prices. Shale gas has driven opcosts low enough that coal is no longer a viable fuel for power generation. It also burns cleaner than coal, with the added benefit being a smaller environmental footprint.

Don't kid yourself. Regulating coal power plants in the US has more to do with the economics of power generation than it does environmental initiatives. They just regulated a sunset industry. Big whoop.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Canada ran into the typical democrat protectionist nonsense in the US. The soft touch or bullying would have had the same results. This is a perception issue more than a legitimate evidence based crisis. By keeping KXL on the sidelines the Administration succeeded in keeping our oil landlocked and sold at a discount, a net benefit to the American consumer. They were also able to pander to the environmental side of their base, which has likely sold out to the Saudis or other exporters who want to keep Canadian oil from displacing their production.

I've always found it baffling considering how much pipeline the American's have put in over the past 7 years. We are basically in a losing race to get our Oil to other nations.

We have to remember that the American's have become competitors instead of friends especially in the energy sector, and the American's can be really cut throat under a guise of being a buddy. The buy America provisions and the increase in expection fees at the border have pointed to that.

the lack of complaints by environmentalist groups in terms of the dirty oil production in California for example is just an example of the administration down there being very effective.

At the end of the day, the whole great friends interpretation thing between Canada and the U.S. is less rosy then it used to be, and Canada needs to develop international markets at a more rapid pace.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Well if he was targeting CPC supporters who were going to vote for him anyways, success. If he was going after normal Canadians, the vast majority of the response from them has either been mockery or puzzlement that this is even an issue. This likely nets zero votes to the CPC and more than likely costs them a few votes from people puzzled that this is an issue being taken seriously given the array of other issues Canada currently faces. It's somewhere on the list around 765 in terms of issues Canadians care about.

You're projecting.

"Taxation of Netflix" may be around 765 in terms of issues.

"Taxation" is going to be top three.

The question is how many people are going look at the former, and think "this is absurd", and how many are going to look at the latter, and be concerned. Between you and me, I don't put a lot of stock into the attention span of "normal Canadians".

Slava does make a good point about the validity of taxation of such services and underlying issues of e-commerce, but those issues will have to remain under the table since nobody else could bring them up without seeming in favour of more taxation.

IMO, this little sideshow is probably the opening salvo of a much larger battle plan. I think we can expect Harper to spend a lot of time over the next 70 days talking about all the things Mulcair (and Trudeau, if he stays relevant) plans to tax. His shots on Wynne and Notley's refusal to release a budget before this election follow the same pattern. "These people plan to take your money for their own aims" is the message.

Question is, how will it resonate against the messages Trudeau and Mulcair will be making?

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

If Harper's big message in this election is "taxes are bad and we don't like them but the other guys love them", I'm going to be tuning him out pretty damned quickly.

Hi, my name is Steven Harper. My hobbies include liking music, watching hockey and other stuff everyone likes. I also like television. My favorite television program is Breaking Bad. It's really neat! Can you come to my birthday party? It's on the same day as two other people's but if you come to mine, I will give you lots more cake and we can watch my favorite television shows together. My favorite show is Breaking Bad. See you then! Awesome!

"Steven Harper chooses a specific audience for this post. Only people in that audience will be able to see it". If you can't see it, you aren't invited (BRAD!)

That was on my facebook wall. Sums that ad up pretty well for me.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

If Harper's big message in this election is "taxes are bad and we don't like them but the other guys love them", I'm going to be tuning him out pretty damned quickly.

No doubt. But the pragmatist in me says it will resonate strongly with a majority of voters. IMO, one of the reasons Jim Prentice failed so badly is the fact that his own tax increases angered the public and left many people wondering what the difference actually was between the PCs and the NDP at that point. Notley took advantage by promising to repeal one tax against the middle class in favour of more taxes against those that "deserved it more". So in the end, Notely was smarter than Prentice on whom she targeted and how.

Social policy reputation and overall superior preparation was the difference between the NDP and Wildrose provincially. Mulcair is likely going to be angling for the same arguments when he steps up to the podiums and tries to turn the campaign to his messages, but he is going to be dealing with a great many questions about taxation and spending.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by Resolute 14

You're projecting.

"Taxation of Netflix" may be around 765 in terms of issues.

"Taxation" is going to be top three.

The question is how many people are going look at the former, and think "this is absurd", and how many are going to look at the latter, and be concerned. Between you and me, I don't put a lot of stock into the attention span of "normal Canadians".

Slava does make a good point about the validity of taxation of such services and underlying issues of e-commerce, but those issues will have to remain under the table since nobody else could bring them up without seeming in favour of more taxation.

IMO, this little sideshow is probably the opening salvo of a much larger battle plan. I think we can expect Harper to spend a lot of time over the next 70 days talking about all the things Mulcair (and Trudeau, if he stays relevant) plans to tax. His shots on Wynne and Notley's refusal to release a budget before this election follow the same pattern. "These people plan to take your money for their own aims" is the message.

Question is, how will it resonate against the messages Trudeau and Mulcair will be making?

Projecting what I'm seeing online and hearing from others? Namely, nothing positive? Outside CPC supporters, I can't find a single post that is saying "Great ad, gonna get us talking about taxes!". Its just another playing to the base ad that makes no sense since the base is never voting Trudeau or NDP.

And using Netflix as the springboard to talking about taxes is so horribly short sighted, as people are already pointing out the very serious issues they haven't talked about at all. At the absolute best, this approach is a neutral move. At worst it makes them look indifferent to bigger, more real issues. I agree voters are stupid, but treating them like idiots is not a good approach. And this ad treats them like morons.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

If Harper's big message in this election is "taxes are bad and we don't like them but the other guys love them", I'm going to be tuning him out pretty damned quickly.

But it worked so well for that Brain guy in Alberta... "NO NEW TAXES!"

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by CaptainCrunch

I've always found it baffling considering how much pipeline the American's have put in over the past 7 years. We are basically in a losing race to get our Oil to other nations.

We have to remember that the American's have become competitors instead of friends especially in the energy sector, and the American's can be really cut throat under a guise of being a buddy. The buy America provisions and the increase in expection fees at the border have pointed to that.

the lack of complaints by environmentalist groups in terms of the dirty oil production in California for example is just an example of the administration down there being very effective.

At the end of the day, the whole great friends interpretation thing between Canada and the U.S. is less rosy then it used to be, and Canada needs to develop international markets at a more rapid pace.

Softwood lumber was a perfect example of US policy towards Canada. Even after repeatedly being told to drop their tariffs they dragged it out as long as possible. They aren't honest brokers when it comes to trade and business.

[username]

Give a man a fish, you feed him for a day.
Teach a man to fish, you feed him for a lifetime.

Promise a man someone else's fish and you have a life long NDP voter.

[PsYcNeT]

Originally Posted by username

Give a man a fish, you feed him for a day.
Teach a man to fish, you feed him for a lifetime.

Promise a man someone else's fish and you have a life long NDP voter.

That's some grade A rhetoric. +1 would roll eyes at again.

[Looch City]

Originally Posted by username

Give a man a fish, you feed him for a day.
Teach a man to fish, you feed him for a lifetime.

Promise a man someone else's fish and you have a life long NDP voter.

Better yet, teach a man to sell the fish and then tax it.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Softwood lumber was a perfect example of US policy towards Canada. Even after repeatedly being told to drop their tariffs they dragged it out as long as possible. They aren't honest brokers when it comes to trade and business.

A more recent example is the US's meat labeling law, which the WTO ruled was illegal under international trade laws. The Americans dragged it out well past that ruling - right up until Canada filed for permission to hit American producers with billions in tariffs.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by Tron_fdc

Coal power plants are being retired at the moment due to the drop in natural gas prices. Shale gas has driven opcosts low enough that coal is no longer a viable fuel for power generation. It also burns cleaner than coal, with the added benefit being a smaller environmental footprint.

Don't kid yourself. Regulating coal power plants in the US has more to do with the economics of power generation than it does environmental initiatives. They just regulated a sunset industry. Big whoop.

Nice try. Coal power is a huge lobby in the U.S. Sure coal is on the down and outs, largely because not besides policy.

Anyway, the EPA stated in their final regulations that coal will decline, but that the regulations will speed it up and decline it by more than it otherwise would.

There's not diminishing the political capital that has gone into those regs. Something that the Harper Government can no where compete.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by username

Give a man a fish, you feed him for a day.
Teach a man to fish, you feed him for a lifetime.

Promise a man someone else's fish and you have a life long NDP voter.

Tell a guy you like fishing and are worried that the other guys might tax fishing line and you have a CPC campaign strategy. Some times you can even reel in votes this way, hook line and sinker.

[The Fonz]

Maybe Albertans can find it in themselves to experience NDP at the provincial level first, before voting them in at the federal level and taking down the rest of country with them?

[PsYcNeT]

Holy #### conservatives are worried.