[Signing] Flames and Bouma settle on arbitration case (3 yrs, $2.2 mil AAV)

[browna]

Originally Posted by Finger Cookin

lol, $300K over, or less than $1M over the life of the contract. Oh noes!

When we're at the third decimal place for calculating remaining cap space, 300k can matter unfortunately down the road.

I'm with the year too long, a bit too much. Not concerning, but as much as he brings, it's being paid for one fantastic season.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Hackey

Ya but this 200k overpayment is questionable at best. It's basically assuming he regresses next year. A heart and soul player like Bouma will earn his pay check one way or another.

That's the thing exactly. If Bouma is worth somewhere in the ballpark of $2 million, I don't think anybody can pin it down so precisely that he isn't worth 2.2. Obviously, the more he makes, the more he has to do to earn it. For that money, I'm hoping he continues to be a top penalty killer and play 3rd-line minutes. If he keeps scoring goals, that will be a nice bonus, but I'm not expecting so much of that.

If some kid on an ELC pushes him down to the 4th line, that's a good problem to have. If he ends up on the 4th line because he just isn't any better than that, then yeah, he's overpaid. But I am not expecting that to happen. I think he's proved himself as a capable 3rd-line checking forward, even if he never matches last season's offence again.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by flameswin

Sorry guys, should have been a little more clear, I was just responding in generality to JayRandom questioning why fans get bent out of shape over little overpayments, I wasn't speaking to Bouma. We're on the same page there.

I do take your point. And there are players in every organization that you should try to pinch pennies on, because they're not so hard to replace. Bouma does a lot of little things right, which makes him worth holding onto in my opinion.

[calumniate]

I'd say he's a major reason the flames made the playoffs this year. And he roomed with monahan who is apparently beyond his years but bouma is a gritty, solid guy and wants to be here. I'm sure if you talked to monahan he'd say the same thing.

Best comparison may be bickell who got a kings ransom. I think we have a good deal here and while we didn't necessarily overpay, he's been paid to be motivated which is perfect for a guy like him.

Good luck boums!

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Just have to interject this thought:

Most cup winning teams have excellent depth throughout all their lines with key contributors in the bottom 6. The Penguins have been trying to do it with elite pieces locked up to big contracts while paying peanuts for their depth players. It's why they haven't made a cup final since they won it all...that and questionable defense and goaltending.

I'd rather have 4 lines that can make the opposition's life miserable than 2 elite stars that can be singled out and keyed on by the opposition defense.

[Freddy]

Very happy with this signing. Bouma is trending up and all the fans & experts pigeon holing him as only a 4th liner (same crowd that believed Brodie's ceiling was top 4) are going to eat crow when Lance is being passed the cup by Mony after a Gelinas type playoff effort. I bet Bouma see's as much 2nd line ice time as 4th line over the next 3 years.

[Coach]

Bouma puts himself in harms way more than anyone on the team. Happy to see him get paid.

[Inferno099]

Oh well for answering poll on my small screen iPhone
Voted bad for both meant to select good AAv & term for Bouma.
Maybe slightly too high but he's a type of player needed for a long playoff run along with the high skill guys like Johnny & Sam.

[Mony]

Originally Posted by Freddy

Very happy with this signing. Bouma is trending up and all the fans & experts pigeon holing him as only a 4th liner (same crowd that believed Brodie's ceiling was top 4) are going to eat crow when Lance is being passed the cup by Mony after a Gelinas type playoff effort. I bet Bouma see's as much 2nd line ice time as 4th line over the next 3 years.

I think the AAV is a little high but the term is good. Let's not prematurely declare Cups though.

[CroFlames]

Bouma is our Dustin Brown. Except better looking, and less of a cheap shot artist.

Oh, and Dustin gets paid $5.8 mil per for the next 150 years.

[Flash Walken]

Goals Get Paid.

All the other things in arbitration you muck around with but goals are nearly impossible to argue with.

You go into salary arbitration with Goals on your side, you're going to win.

Good contract all things considered.

[squiggs96]

I'm not sure the $200k-$300k perceived overpayment will impact the Flames in 2 years. If a free agent won't sign in Calgary because they were offered $200K more somewhere else, I'm not sure that's the type of player we want. Calgary also is tied for the lowest tax rate of any of the NHL cities with Edmonton. That $200k that a player signs for somewhere else, could end up costing him much more than that, depending on where he signs and the amount of the contract. For example, Parenteau's tax bill went up by $320,000 on his $4M salary when he was traded from Colorado to Montreal.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by saillias

Good article from Darren Haynes about why Bouma is worth the contract : http://flamesfrom80feet.blogspot.ca/...t-to-team.html

Some highlights:

Each of those stats, are stats you need someone to excel at on your team, you need to have. But as has been said before, they are things you need to find "for free" lets say. If you don't, unless you hit a perfect storm of having all your "skilled" talent up front and on the back end all on entry level contracts, you won't have enough money to round out your top end talent and win.

Bouma's contract is currently an overpayment for a bottom 6 player who's biggest contributions we KNOW he will provide are hits, blocks and heart. Might not be fair, but that's not what earns you cash in the NHL. If Bouma puts up the numbers he did last year in the point department moving forward, his contract all of a sudden becomes a steal (as many have pointed out). If he goes in between and his point production drops off a little from last year, but is still much better than his previous years, then the deal is likely right where it needs to be.

Time will tell which it is.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by squiggs96

I'm not sure the $200k-$300k perceived overpayment will impact the Flames in 2 years. If a free agent won't sign in Calgary because they were offered $200K more somewhere else, I'm not sure that's the type of player we want. Calgary also is tied for the lowest tax rate of any of the NHL cities with Edmonton. That $200k that a player signs for somewhere else, could end up costing him much more than that, depending on where he signs and the amount of the contract. For example, Parenteau's tax bill went up by $320,000 on his $4M salary when he was traded from Colorado to Montreal.

Could be wrong, but with the NDP now I do not think this is true anymore.

[squiggs96]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Could be wrong, but with the NDP now I do not think this is true anymore.

You are correct. I had not realized it had changed. In 2016 personal income over $300,000 is taxed at 15%. In 2015 it is 11.25%. Before the change the marginal rate in Alberta was 39%, which slightly beat out Florida at 39.6%. The new rates in 2016 likely put Calgary around 10th. I'll look into it further and see where it is.

[codynw]

Originally Posted by Cali Flames Fan

Just have to interject this thought:

Most cup winning teams have excellent depth throughout all their lines with key contributors in the bottom 6. The Penguins have been trying to do it with elite pieces locked up to big contracts while paying peanuts for their depth players. It's why they haven't made a cup final since they won it all...that and questionable defense and goaltending.

I'd rather have 4 lines that can make the opposition's life miserable than 2 elite stars that can be singled out and keyed on by the opposition defense.

The Penguins have no depth because they suck at drafting.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by codynw

The Penguins have no depth because they suck at drafting.

There drafting is good. No first rounders combined with zero top 15 picks makes drafting hard

[Gaskal]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

There drafting is good. No first rounders combined with zero top 15 picks makes drafting hard

The first round is important, but it's like the first round of the playoffs for the scouting department. The later rounds is where all the hard work of travelling, talking to coaches and staff and player viewings pay off. Just look at the gems Flames have gotten in the 2nd round onwards in the last few years.

If you're going to dump that much salary on Crosby, Malkin, Letang and MAF (and now Kessel) long term, then the only real solution is to have decent players on ELCs as a supporting cast. They can't really afford to otherwise; they can't make any splashes in free agency. So they have to trust in their scouts to bring in some young players that can step in and contribute - without being paid over the league minimum. But since all those older players are locked up long term, you have to move the performing youngsters out when their play deserves to be paid and get some decent assets back, and in the meantime hope that your other draftees are ready to step in too.

If your scouting sucks then this model won't work for them. The Penguins will be a perpetual playoff team with a core like that but they no longer have what it takes to win it all - their salary allocation has them painted into a corner so if their draftees don't pan out, it's 1st/2nd round exit year after year.

[ComixZone]

To the people saying too much - too much compared to what?

16 goals, 18 assists, good PKer, great team guy, embodies team spirit. I just don't get what you're comparing it to. It seems silly to sit back and arbitrarily state that it's 200-500K too much for "one good season". Where are some actual comparisons that show the Flames overpaid?

He has played two full NHL seasons.

The growth from season 1 to season 2 was significant.

Season 1: 5G, 10A, 15 points
Season 2: 16G, 18A, 34 points

Next year, if we have a good season we're going to see this on a different scale with a certain player.

Season 1: 24G, 40A, 64 points
Season 2: 32G, 50A, 82 points

Will we all be going crazy when he signs an extension worth 7M per for 8 years?

[Parallex]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

To the people saying too much - too much compared to what?

To what someone could reasonably expect him to perform in the future.

Originally Posted by ComixZone

16 goals, 18 assists, good PKer

And if he can do that every year for the next three years it'll be more then worth it... if he reverts back to the 5 goal, 10 assist he did the year prior... what other 5 goal guys get 2.2M per?

Don't pay people for what they did... pay them for what they're gonna do.