07-01-2015, 01:42 PM
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#401
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#1 Goaltender
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler
I disagree - it's a stupid opener. And before you ask, yes, I know how negotiations work - it's what I do for a living. Of course, you come in with a high opening number, but you don't want it to be so ridiculous that it gets the hackles up on the other side.
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It is not a stupid opener. PK Subban gets that much, Towes and Kane get more than that.
Obviously the flames will argue that at his age and injury history that they won't pay that and they will agree on a smaller number.
It's not a stupid opener when you're one of the best defenseman in the world.
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07-01-2015, 01:43 PM
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#402
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Crash and Bang Winger
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Its a ridiculous starting point from an agent who is notorious for his dealings but he is totally within his rights to do so if he wishes. Im sure our mangement has shown enough to us that clearly that wont happen, like others have said play out the last year and let him walk or trade him if thats the term and number. Thanks for the time and service and good luck to you.
There are almost no dmen in the league worth that kinda money, none at his age, zero, its just not smart cap management. Do teams eventually start shying away from players with certain agents or does it already happen?
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07-01-2015, 01:44 PM
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#403
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Fearmongerer
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Wondering when # became hashtag and not a number sign.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler
I disagree - it's a stupid opener. And before you ask, yes, I know how negotiations work - it's what I do for a living. Of course, you come in with a high opening number, but you don't want it to be so ridiculous that it gets the hackles up on the other side.
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Why?
If his end game is 7.5/8 a year, how in the world is 9 a "stupid opener"?
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07-01-2015, 01:44 PM
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#404
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: San Fernando Valley
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I would be tempted to let him play out the last year of the deal and see where things are at the deadline. If he has another season where he misses a good portion he's either going to have to adjust his asking price or maybe the Flames should just move on. I can't fault the guy for exploring all his options and trying to cash in but I don't see him coming close to this season's numbers ever again and I don't believe the Flames should be paying for past performance as he's a player that is likely on the slow decline.
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07-01-2015, 01:44 PM
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#405
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Winchestertonfieldville Jail
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler
I disagree - it's a stupid opener. And before you ask, yes, I know how negotiations work - it's what I do for a living. Of course, you come in with a high opening number, but you don't want it to be so ridiculous that it gets the hackles up on the other side.
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Agreed.
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07-01-2015, 01:45 PM
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#406
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#1 Goaltender
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skudr248
Agreed.
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If 7.5 is what they hope to end on settling please explain to me how 9 is a stupid opener?
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07-01-2015, 01:47 PM
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#407
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Franchise Player
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It's a combination of the 9M and the 8years that is stupid. It's totally unrealistic.
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07-01-2015, 01:47 PM
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#408
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First Line Centre
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Winchestertonfieldville Jail
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bax
It is not a stupid opener. PK Subban gets that much, Towes and Kane get more than that.
Obviously the flames will argue that at his age and injury history that they won't pay that and they will agree on a smaller number.
It's not a stupid opener when you're one of the best defenseman in the world.
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But are Subban, Towes, or Kane 31 years old and coming off an serious injury? All these guys you mentioned are young guys, consistently good and put up awesome numbers. Give your head a shake. He has 2 good seasons over his career, for all we know he could trend downward starting next season
Last edited by skudr248; 07-01-2015 at 01:49 PM.
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07-01-2015, 01:48 PM
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#409
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#1 Goaltender
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Giordano Extension. Kypreos: Starting point is $72 million over 8 years
Quote:
Originally Posted by skudr248
But are Subban, Towes, or Kane 33 years old and coming off an serious injury? All these guys you mentioned are young guys, consistently good and put up awesome numbers. Give your head a shake. He has 2 good seasons over his career, for all we know he could trend downward starting next season
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Did you read the rest of my post? I said the flames would argue his age and injury history to lower that number. I never said the flames will offer him a 9 million dollar per year deal.
It's like you think it's 9 million per year or bust for Gio, when in reality it's a long, complicated, negotiation process.
Giving my head a firm shake. Thanks for the tip.
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07-01-2015, 01:55 PM
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#410
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99
Why?
If his end game is 7.5/8 a year, how in the world is 9 a "stupid opener"?
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You can't ask for ridiculous $ and ridiculous term. Winter should be smart enough to know he can't have both. If his end game is 7.5/8, ask for 5 @ 9. If his end-game is a "retirement" contract ask for 7 @ 7. When I get an offer in my field that is the equivalent of 8 @ 9, I become vexed.  You have to convey to the other side "Yes, this is a high ask, but you know I am a reasonable guy and we will get something done that works for everyone".
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07-01-2015, 02:04 PM
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#411
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Right behind you.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler
You can't ask for ridiculous $ and ridiculous term. Winter should be smart enough to know he can't have both. If his end game is 7.5/8, ask for 5 @ 9. If his end-game is a "retirement" contract ask for 7 @ 7. When I get an offer in my field that is the equivalent of 8 @ 9, I become vexed.  You have to convey to the other side "Yes, this is a high ask, but you know I am a reasonable guy and we will get something done that works for everyone".
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I would bet Treliving doesn't really care how reasonable or unreasonable the opening gambit is from the player's agent. The Flames know what Gio is worth to the team, who else they have to sign in coming years and what exactly they can afford and will respond accordingly. The opening ask likely has little sway over their response.
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07-01-2015, 02:04 PM
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#412
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Fearmongerer
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Wondering when # became hashtag and not a number sign.
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OK....but when you take the emotion out of it (which Treliving has been emphasizing since day 1) and realize an ask is....an ask, it means nothing.
You then counter with 5 years at 6.5....do you think Winter gets upset by that as well? Not a chance.
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07-01-2015, 02:09 PM
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#413
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Appealing my suspension
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Just outside Enemy Lines
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I think Treliving will stay focused on his young core, what they'll cost forthe next 5-6 years and make an accurate decision about whether or not Giordano can fit. No way you give him 8 years. 5 is the most I would do. Anything more and you move on. Can't be in the business of handing lucrative last NHL contracts to guys who aren't future hall of famers.
__________________
"Some guys like old balls"
Patriots QB Tom Brady
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07-01-2015, 02:12 PM
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#414
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Lifetime Suspension
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The amount of people reading into rumours (that we have no idea are even accurate) and jumping to conclusions and hardened (borderline panicked) stances - is staggering, but unsurprising.
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07-01-2015, 02:14 PM
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#415
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Franchise Player
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Marseilles Of The Prairies
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I like how this entire argument centres around the premise that Kypreos isn't full of crap.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm
Settle down there, Temple Grandin.
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07-01-2015, 02:18 PM
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#416
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Calgary
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Just a reminder, Rich Winter ran a smear campaign on the Flames as he was negotiating Gio's last contract in 2011.
__________________

"May those who accept their fate find happiness. May those who defy it find glory."
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07-01-2015, 02:18 PM
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#417
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by transplant99
OK....but when you take the emotion out of it (which Treliving has been emphasizing since day 1) and realize an ask is....an ask, it means nothing.
You then counter with 5 years at 6.5....do you think Winter gets upset by that as well? Not a chance.
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Sure. I trust Treliving to take emotion out of it. Giordano/Winter, I don't know. Clearly, a lot of players take this personally, and so do some GMs. There is one fundamental disconnect here - Giordano "deserves" to get paid for what he has done. Treliving should only pay for what Giordano is going to do. Is there an overlap? I don't think your suggested compromise of 5 @ 8 is good for the Flames, but we shall see.
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07-01-2015, 02:20 PM
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#418
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#1 Goaltender
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Yesterday we were told by the 'experts' that Hamilton wanted 7.5 million for 6 years. Treliving got him for 5.75.
Earlier today we were told that Frolik wanted 5 million plus plus. Treliving got it done for 4.3.
Who cares what the early numbers are being reported as. All that matters is the final number the contract is signed for, and I'm confident that it will get done at a number that makes everyone happy.
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07-01-2015, 03:00 PM
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#419
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikephoen
Yesterday we were told by the 'experts' that Hamilton wanted 7.5 million for 6 years. Treliving got him for 5.75.
Earlier today we were told that Frolik wanted 5 million plus plus. Treliving got it done for 4.3.
Who cares what the early numbers are being reported as. All that matters is the final number the contract is signed for, and I'm confident that it will get done at a number that makes everyone happy.
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... Or we get a great return in a Gio trade.
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07-01-2015, 03:03 PM
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#420
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Calgary
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CroFlames
... Or we get a great return in a Gio trade.
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The only "great" returns in a Gio trade I can think of would be Ivan Provorov, Drew Doughty, Kevin Shattenkirk, Ryan McDonagh, Hampus Lindholm, or Aaron Ekblad.
...We would not get a great return.
__________________

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